I need to run this by some people...

[Gaith]

Kommander wrote:

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The differences between men and women are greatly exaggerated. Other humans are often a great mystery, but very little of it is related to sex or gender.

Yes, and women are other humans and female - a mystery twofer!

(I kid, a bit.)

[sojourner]

FPAlpha wrote:

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If that's you in your avatar i'd say you are also not ugly or repulsive (might think about a new hairstyle though but that's just personal opinion).

That's Iwan Rheon mostly known for his role as Simon on Misfits.

[Kommander]

RJDemonicus wrote:

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This is exactly right. Women are no mystery-- they are individuals. That's one reason your story was such a great idea, whether it ultimately works or not.

She liked it, so it worked. When I write stories, I don't even understand them fully, it's perfectly understandable if others don't. I'm sure I'll tell her what I was doing eventually, and then she'll tell me I'm an ass, and we'll go from there.

sojourner wrote:

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That's Iwan Rheon mostly known for his role as Simon on Misfits.

Yeah, I look nothing like him. I'm also not a Welsh actor, no one's ever mistakenly thought my name is Barry, and I've never had sex with a melon (at least, no one can prove that I have.) I look like this:



Yes, I'm wearing eye liner.

[RJDiogenes]

^^ Shrink that down and enter it in the new Avatar Contest.

[Gaith]

So did you ask her out, or not?!

[Captain Ice]

How about just telling her that she seems like an interesting person and that you would be interested in getting to know her outside of class? If she has another class after the one the two of you are in together, maybe she would meet you somewhere for coffee after that class?

[teacake]

Some people just cannot wrench themselves away from the drama of subtext.

[Kommander]

Gaith wrote:

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So did you ask her out, or not?!

I haven't asked her for any contact information, she does not appear to have a Facebook page, and I don't have class with her again until Tuesday. It doesn't occur to me to ask these kinds of things. Hell, I had been talking to her regularly for a month before I knew what her name was...

Grim Reaper wrote:

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How about just telling her that she seems like an interesting person and that you would be interested in getting to know her outside of class? If she has another class after the one the two of you are in together, maybe she would meet you somewhere for coffee after that class?

What? There's no way things like this are that simple! I'm pretty sure I have to wait until the planets align under a full moon and the second stage of the prophecy reveals itself. Even if that's not necessary I should probably consult the ancient texts or cast some runes or something. Also, donning the ceremonial garb. That's usually important.

[Gaith]

Kommander wrote:

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I haven't asked her for any contact information, she does not appear to have a Facebook page, and I don't have class with her again until Tuesday. It doesn't occur to me to ask these kinds of things. Hell, I had been talking to her regularly for a month before I knew what her name was...

Dude...

1) Learn basic facts such as her name early on in the small talk process (as in, two minutes or less).

2. READ THE GUIDE!

Gaith wrote:

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The Hitchhiker's Guide to Dating 21st-Century Women, written by yours truly. (link)

You don't want her contact information or Facebook profiles access for its own sake, you want some of her time. Visualize a shared activity and suggest it to her.

[teacake]

How's it going with that guide anyway, do you get lots of people to read it? Do you get interesting responses? I think you should put it up in blog form.

[Kommander]

I know there's a stereotype about Trekkies and everything, but, am I really coming off like I've never talked to a woman before and I don't know how social interaction works?

Don't answer that.

I'm not anxious about this because I don't know what to do, I'm anxious about it because I'm starting to like this girl a lot, it seems to be mutual, and feeling anxious in such a situation is natural. I could just pretend that the anxiety doesn't exist, but when I've done that in the past it doesn't actually help. So instead, I focus on the anxiety, I allow it to exist, and a lot of times, I try to make myself more anxious. When I do this, I work through it, eventually calm the fuck down. Even if I'm still slightly anxious at that point, it doesn't seem like a big deal and doesn't interfere with my actions as much.

As for the guide:

The Guide wrote:

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The second most important thing when it comes to dealing with women is Confidence. The most important thing is to not be a sodding git, but the inability to respect and treasure women is an affliction no pamphlet can cure; therefore, if you are so hobbled, please either burn this or pass it on to someone worthier forthwith.

Um, yeah... I'm going to go ahead and not read it if that's okay with you.

[Gaith]

teacock wrote:

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How's it going with that guide anyway, do you get lots of people to read it? Do you get interesting responses? I think you should put it up in blog form.

I doubt anyone outside of the BBS crowd here has read it. I've never been emailed about it, alas. And I lost the original download count even before Megaupload went belly-up.

[Kommander]

Kommander wrote:

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Um, yeah... I'm going to go ahead and not read it if that's okay with you.

That, and the other things I said, probably sounded a bit more mean than I meant them.

I have a problem with dating guides in general, not just yours, Gaith. As I said, I haven't read it, but I have read at least a hundred others. Best case scenario, they contain mostly factual information, but information that's pointless in the context of a dating guide. At worst, they teach people to be manipulative or even abusive.

The harmless ones tend to talk a lot about confidence and treating dating like it's not a big deal. First of all, if it wasn't a big deal, there wouldn't be thousands of fucking dating guides, and there'd be no need for relationship counselors and sex therapists, and I'd have to instead pursue a real career.

And yes, it's correct. Dating is much easier if one has confidence, just like everything else in life. While confidence is learned, it can't really be taught. Talking about confidence in a dating guide is like if the instructions with an IKEA bookshelf said "Assemble the pieces so they look like the picture on the box. It's not that difficult." Yes, that's true, but if one doesn't know how to assemble the pieces it does nothing to help, and probably makes them feel stupid.

Most of the time, the general point is "all women are like this, and want these things, so do this," or "all men are like this, and want these things, so do this," depending who they're targeted at. Despite the way it is very often presented, all men are not the same, and all women are not the same. Dating guides tend to focus on gender stereotypes which, while they do fit some people, are not representative of people in general.

The really dangerous ones present dating as an adversarial relationship: Men want the most amount of sex with the least amount of commitment, and women want to maximize commitment with minimal sex. If a man commits, he loses. If a woman is easy she loses. So, one has to manipulate the other into doing what they want. Explaining whats wrong with this set up would take a very long time, so I'll explain what's right about it. This is how narcissistic ass holes act. So if you're one of them, go for it.

[Gaith]

I've no doubt that many dating guides are messed up. I don't think mine is a-hole friendly, nor does it exaggerate the ease of the matter, but that's a matter of details. If you'd like to discuss any specific aspects of the guide, I'd be happy to do so, but no hard feelings if you don't. Heck, as I wrote in it, I don't claim to be any kind of expert myself, just a frood with a few rudimentary tips.

[RAMA]

Ok this isn't really a dating guide, it's just straight reality for most cases:

Don't play games, you can be subtle but don't be coy and manipulate. Don't do the waiting to call thing; don't worry you're looking desperate (whether you are or not); there's nothing wrong with complimenting someone if you mean it (guys seem to thing they'll give a girl an attitude if they say something positive). Don't wait to ask someone out, it's easier just to ask.

Be yourself...up to a point. Don't pretend to be someone you're not (don't lie about your real day to day life) HOWEVER, there's nothing wrong with acting more confident than you might normally be, or simply put more energy into how you project yourself. This can actually be good practice for later on when you might actually become that.

Be direct, but not overbearing. I've found that simply saying what your wants or needs are are a lot more useful than waiting.

These are pretty general but also sensible, if someone can't handle that, then they arent for you. I would have trouble with anyone who wasnt honest and reciprocated. I've never had a girl turn me down for a date (or other things) unless she was already taken (again something to ask about early).

RAMA