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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old November 5 2012, 01:01 AM   #31
CoveTom
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

TUC is a fun movie. An entertaining movie. And enjoyable movie. And it holds up a lot better if you try not to think too much about it.
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Old November 5 2012, 01:54 AM   #32
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

CoveZombie wrote: View Post
TUC is a fun movie. An entertaining movie. And enjoyable movie. And it holds up a lot better if you try not to think too much about it.
Much like Star Trek 2009.
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Old November 5 2012, 03:00 PM   #33
CoveTom
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

BillJ wrote: View Post
Much like Star Trek 2009.
Agreed.
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Old November 6 2012, 11:54 AM   #34
Timo
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

...Whereas, say, ST:TMP just holds up a lot better if you try not to think too much about it.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 6 2012, 01:41 PM   #35
SmoothieX
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

Pawleygirl wrote: View Post
There is something that I've wanted to know for a while now. So Valeris won't tell the names of her co-conspirators, so Spock uses a forcible mind-meld on her to get the names. Then Kirk asks for the location of the conference, so Spock digs deeper (which causes great distresses for them both). She doesn't know, so Kirk contacts Sulu, and he knows. Why didn't Captain Kirk or Spock just get in contact with Captain Sulu for those details?
Sulu wouldn't have any idea about who the conspirators were.
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Old November 6 2012, 03:13 PM   #36
CoveTom
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

Timo wrote: View Post
...Whereas, say, ST:TMP just holds up a lot better if you try not to think too much about it.

Timo Saloniemi
Which is funny because, for all it's flaws, TMP is one of those films that I think holds up better if you put some thought into it. If you just approach it from the mindless entertainment perspective, it can be rather slow and dull. But if you actually think about what's happening and what it is saying, it can become a lot more interesting. IMHO.
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Old November 6 2012, 06:27 PM   #37
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

SmoothieX wrote: View Post
Pawleygirl wrote: View Post
There is something that I've wanted to know for a while now. So Valeris won't tell the names of her co-conspirators, so Spock uses a forcible mind-meld on her to get the names. Then Kirk asks for the location of the conference, so Spock digs deeper (which causes great distresses for them both). She doesn't know, so Kirk contacts Sulu, and he knows. Why didn't Captain Kirk or Spock just get in contact with Captain Sulu for those details?
Sulu wouldn't have any idea about who the conspirators were.
Right. The mind meld was used initially to find out who the conspirators are. It was only after they learnt that Valeris didn't know the location that they called Sulu. There'd have been no point asking him about the conspirators as, unless he was part of the conspiracy himself, he wouldn't know anything about it.
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Old November 7 2012, 06:10 PM   #38
Timo
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

It's something of a mystery why even Valeris knew about the conspirators. What was her all-important need to know?

She would have been amply motivated if Cartwright told her that firing at Gorkon's ship was for the greater good of the UFP. Cartwright might further tell her that Chang was in on it and helping to assassinate Gorkon (but that Cartwright would eventually backstab this despicable enemy, so no worries). But what would be the point of telling Valeris that the Romulans were involved?

I guess it's just a bit too weird for my tastes that an operative very high in the ranks of the conspirators would be sent to Kirk's ship where she could get captured, either by Kirk or (more worryingly) by the Klingons. Goons like Burke and Samno, yes. Their handler, yes. But why would the handler need to be so knowledgeable? Perhaps Cartwright just wanted to limit the number of middlemen...

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 11 2012, 01:12 AM   #39
jayrath
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

Kirk likely didn't think to contact Sulu because he had no idea that Sulu had been in touch with the Enterprise while he and McCoy were imprisoned. He likely hadn't time to check the logs; things were moving pretty fast.

As for Valeris being so knowledgable -- perhaps she wasn't. Perhaps there were many other conspirators whose names were never revealed. What's-his-name the Romulan (played by Malachi Throne when Spock crossed over to TNG) may have had an idea of it, and he was at Khitomer (according to TNG). Then there was the crew of Chang's ship, too; Valeris never named them. So maybe Valeris was just in the highly-placed Federation/Starfleet group.
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Old November 11 2012, 09:24 PM   #40
Timo
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

The problem I have is that Valeris knows about the Romulan involvement at all, regardless of the exact names or faces. The Romulans appeared to be playing the two sides against the middle, but that wouldn't work too well if both of the sides knew about their involvement!

Then again, if the Feds already knowingly cooperate with Klingons in hopes of defeating the Klingons in the endgame, and vice versa, both sides might also accept that they are currently being played by the Romulans but will triumph in the end because of their moral superiority or warrior fierceness or whatnot.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 11 2012, 09:56 PM   #41
jayrath
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Re: Why didn't Kirk just contact Sulu?

Maybe the super-duper new magic cloaking device that Chang got, which allowed him to fire while invisible, came from the Romulans? Who knows. It's still the most enjoyable of any of the movies for me.
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