They are going ahead with a Justice League movie

[Christopher]

Believe what you want. But the fact remains, if you cast a white actress as Waller, it's the left that would be upset and the right that would be fine with it. At least let's be clear on who the players are.

[JarodRussell]

sojourner wrote:

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The final lines of the Batman/Superman movie:

"Bruce, even between the two of us, we can't face this!"

"You're right, that's why I've recruited help."

Cue splash scene of 4 more heroes arriving on the battle scene.

Continued in..... JUSTICE LEAGUE.

Rock ballad, credits roll.

There's the problem with that setup: no introduction to those 4 more heroes at all. And that's how this would fail, and why The Avengers was a success. Each of the heroes already had his/her intro in previous movies, and the audiences liked them.

[Sindatur]

Christopher wrote:

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Believe what you want. But the fact remains, if you cast a white actress as Waller, it's the left that would be upset and the right that would be fine with it. At least let's be clear on who the players are.

Oh, I'm not saying there would be no complaints of unfair opportunities for Blacks, I'm saying they would be unreasonable in a case where 3 out of 10 roles were cast with Black actors

[sojourner]

JarodRussell wrote:

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There's the problem with that setup: no introduction to those 4 more heroes at all. And that's how this would fail, and why The Avengers was a success. Each of the heroes already had his/her intro in previous movies, and the audiences liked them.

The thing people seem to be missing is that team movies have been done before Avengers and will be done after Avengers without separate intro movies for the team members. It's just that most other team movies don't portray super powers.

Hell, the "gather the team" storyline is a tradition in some genres like westerns. I think DC can make it work.

[Christopher]

sojourner wrote:

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The thing people seem to be missing is that team movies have been done before Avengers and will be done after Avengers without separate intro movies for the team members. It's just that most other team movies don't portray super powers.

Hell, the "gather the team" storyline is a tradition in some genres like westerns. I think DC can make it work.

Good point. The Seven Samurai, The Dirty Dozen, Ocean's Eleven -- there are tons of movies about assembling a team of protagonists the audience has no prior familiarity with. There are even superhero examples, like Mystery Men and The Incredibles.

[sojourner]

Mystery Men might not be the best example considering it was a bit of a failure, hehe. Though I actually enjoyed it.

[Professor Zoom]

Kai "the spirit" wrote:

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Wether they're going to reboot GL completely or not, that version of Waller should be retconned either way. It's not as if the character was very memorable, anyway.

They should absolutely reboot GL, and yeah, that version, not so great. But laying it on Bassett? Foolish. She's a great actress with a commanding presence. GL was rife with hack writing and poor direction. She did was she could with...well...shit.

[Kai "the spy"]

Professor Zoom wrote:

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They should absolutely reboot GL, and yeah, that version, not so great. But laying it on Bassett? Foolish. She's a great actress with a commanding presence. GL was rife with hack writing and poor direction. She did was she could with...well...shit.

I didn't realize I was doing that.

[Captaindemotion]

I don't see how saying that her character is unmemorable is 'laying it on Bassett' for the movie's failure.

[FPAlpha]

Christopher wrote:

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Good point. The Seven Samurai, The Dirty Dozen, Ocean's Eleven -- there are tons of movies about assembling a team of protagonists the audience has no prior familiarity with. There are even superhero examples, like Mystery Men and The Incredibles.

But then again it needs rock solid writing and by the DC track record (excluding the Nolan Batman movies) i'm not so sure.

Additionally it will inevitably be compared to the Marvel movies and their approach.. might even lead to more problems with the production when people start to ask wo the f.. Martian Manhunter or Wonder Woman is and why they didn't get their own movie before the Justice League.

[sojourner]

Yeah, that question is a real pain. Not like the couldn't go with the obvious answer, "we wanted to do the team movie first".

[Christopher]

To me, the question "Why didn't you do it like those other people did it?" provides its own answer. The fact that Marvel did it one way is the best possible reason for DC/Warner Bros. to do it a different way.

[Ian Keldon]

Christopher wrote:

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To me, the question "Why didn't you do it like those other people did it?" provides its own answer. The fact that Marvel did it one way is the best possible reason for DC/Warner Bros. to do it a different way.

The problems with that idea are many:

1) WB/DC have no established track record of success to inspire audience confidence in the project to generate buzz. Outside of Supes and Bats no DC project has been considered a substantial success either economically or critically. Indeed, it's most recent attempt is widely held to be a resounding failure.

That means they either have to tentpole the film on Supes & Bats (with everyone else being essentially walk-ons in terms of story focus) OR they have to run the huge risk of trying to draw people to these characters whom (if we are being brutally honest) have little or no recognition in the eyes of Joe Buttinseat.

EVERY major character in Avengers already had good name recognition and posititve buzz from a prior movie success (with the possible exception of Hulk). Even Hawkeye's extremely limited showing in Thor drew a great deal of critical and fan approval.

2) Marvel "went big" with Avengers. By your reasoning, DC should "go small" with Justice League, which will leave the audience wondering why all those super-powerful "superheroes" are doing very little in terms of daring-do.

That would be X-Men 1 all over again: no "super" in the superhero movie, leaving the fans of the "BANG! POW! ZAP!" unsatisfied.

On the other hand, they can hardly "go bigger" either. In terms of raw power, the JL has the Avengers dead to rights. There's a reason why they call the Seven a "pantheon". "Going bigger" runs the risk of taking JL into that "cosmic zone" of superherodom that the perceived failure of F4 1 and 2 and Green Lantern seem to indicate that the casual audience cannot relate to.

So you want DC to take a bunch of untested characters, portrayed by unproven actors and try to craft a story that will appeal to Joe and Jane Buttinseat but also do justice to seven "gods on Earth" to appeal to the fanbase..that's a lot to pile onto one film with maybe a $250 million or so budget.

[sojourner]

And yet, that's exactly what they are doing.

[theenglish]

Really though, X-men was a great movie. It was a lot of fun, did a great job of bringing these comic book characters into the "real world", and jump started the whole super-hero film trend.

Justice League just needs solid writing and direction along with competent acting and it will be a success.