RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 139,703
Posts: 5,431,633
Members: 24,833
Currently online: 408
Newest member: PlainSimplGarak


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy

Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 13 2012, 12:01 AM   #316
Ruaidhri
Commodore
 
Ruaidhri's Avatar
 
Location: Ruaidhri...Toronto in body, Philly in spirit!
View Ruaidhri's Twitter Profile Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to Ruaidhri
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

I keep thinking of the character in Lucifer's Hammer that buried a set of The Way Things Work in his back yard before the meteor hit, so that when the initial disaster had subsided, he could go back and dig up all the volumes to help rebuild society. Of course, in that story he had time to prepare for it, but I don't think you need a truckload of books to set up a serviceable and self sustaining village. A relative handful to establish yourself after the chaos ends, and then you can branch out for more. And the survivors would probably be learning new skills at a crazy rate (or they would die). Naturalists and jacks-of-all-trades would probably do well.

And I would bet that a government like the USA probably has all kinds of contingency plans for a widespread and lasting blackout to ensure the preservation of the core government and strategic places to retain control over.
Ruaidhri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 13 2012, 02:25 AM   #317
sojourner
Admiral
 
sojourner's Avatar
 
Location: I'm at WKRP
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

A good set of books would be the Foxfire series for a knowledge base of basic homesteading skills.
__________________
Baby, you and me were never meant to be, just maybe think of me once in a while...
sojourner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 14 2012, 06:06 AM   #318
degra
Fleet Captain
 
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

I could barely get through this episode--the pointless death of a plot device=Maggie, the bland characters, the aimlessness, the lack of urgency in storytelling, the silliness of a tornado, no compelling villain. I'm done. Yet another epic mystery series that sucks--well at least it isn't alone--Last Resort, Caprica, V, Flash Forward, Alcatraz, Persons Unknown, Harpers Island, Surface, Invasion, The Event, The River, Vanished, Reunion, The Nine, Heroes, Kidnapped, Once Upon a Time can keep it company.

Now will networks finally realize these type of shows just don't work and go back to more basic, open-premised, shows with smaller more interesting characters and more streamlined season long arcs like many primetime dramas used in the 80s and 90s before LOST came along and everyone wants to do a LOST type serial with large casts, non linear storytelling, boring flashbacks, interconnectedness, too densely plotted to give a scene enough room to breathe etc.
degra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 05:13 AM   #319
sojourner
Admiral
 
sojourner's Avatar
 
Location: I'm at WKRP
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Monroe is an idiot. If steam power has worked all this time he should have much better than idiots with muskets. The things you could do!
__________________
Baby, you and me were never meant to be, just maybe think of me once in a while...
sojourner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 05:46 AM   #320
Agent Richard07
Admiral
 
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

I'm not really into this show, but I leave it on in the background and pay attention when it looks like something important or relevant to the big mystery is happening.

I enjoyed Captain Neville's backstory. It was very reminiscent of Locke's first flashback from Lost, knife and all.
Agent Richard07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 11:13 AM   #321
Guy Gardener
Fleet Admiral
 
Guy Gardener's Avatar
 
Location: In the lap of squalor I assure you.
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

sojourner wrote: View Post
Monroe is an idiot. If steam power has worked all this time he should have much better than idiots with muskets. The things you could do!
Steam yes.

19th century forge/factories no.

Did you see the front of the train?

That fucker had been rebuilt by hand.

Working iron plate like that is difficult if not impossible if you want it precise enough not to blow up.

But yes.

they should have gotten this shit off the ground in year 2, not year 16.

Fuck it.

How hard is to retrofit a trolley into a hand cart?
__________________
"Glitter is the herpes of arts and craft."

Troy Yingst. My Life as Liz
Guy Gardener is online now   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 05:56 PM   #322
propita
Rear Admiral
 
Location: fresno, ca, us
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Franklinstein wrote: View Post
I keep thinking of the character in Lucifer's Hammer that buried a set of The Way Things Work in his back yard before the meteor hit, so that when the initial disaster had subsided, he could go back and dig up all the volumes to help rebuild society. Of course, in that story he had time to prepare for it, but I don't think you need a truckload of books to set up a serviceable and self sustaining village. A relative handful to establish yourself after the chaos ends, and then you can branch out for more. And the survivors would probably be learning new skills at a crazy rate (or they would die). Naturalists and jacks-of-all-trades would probably do well.

And I would bet that a government like the USA probably has all kinds of contingency plans for a widespread and lasting blackout to ensure the preservation of the core government and strategic places to retain control over.

I thought of the same book (Lucifer's Hammer, that is). Didn't he also store a lot of other well-needed books, info, and items?


One thing that likely is correct about this show is the relative lack of older people. People on meds, old or not, would not survive. Not talking vitamins, but diabetics, thyroid, some cardio, etc. I know I'd be gone (hypothyroid, I'd sleep myself to death). And those left ARE relatively healthy. They'd have to be, because there's little to no meds, certainly not enough to sustain 15 years.
propita is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 07:17 PM   #323
Scout101
Admiral
 
Scout101's Avatar
 
Location: Rhode Island, USA
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Yep, they were right on that count (even asthma would be tricky). Not only the people relying on meds, but very few people over, say, early 50s would have had much shot surviving the early die-off as well. Something like 15-40 would have been the sweet spot, and mostly in the middle of that curve. Add 15 years, and that should be the age of your population.

We should be seeing very few kids in the 15-20 old range right now. You'd have a few families here and there that made it, but it would be extremely difficult for young children to survive at that point. And they'd be an additional drain on the parents (extra food/supplies, having to carry them, having them cry at inopportune moments when hiding, etc), so it's likely either the child just wouldn't make it, or would eventually cause the whole family to die off. Having them forgo food to feed the child leaving them weaker when an attack comes, giving away position, tired from carrying them, diseases that the adults are innoculated against that the kids never got shots for, risky foraging mission to try and get them medicine, etc.

Not impossible, just think there'd be a couple of obviously-missing age bands at the start of this new world. And then there'd start being children in the 0-12 or so range as people started to settle in again, although in smaller numbers at first, so you'd expect that any children you see on this show would be quite young.
__________________
Perhaps, if I am very lucky, the feeble efforts of my lifetime will someday be noticed and maybe, in some small way, they will be acknowledged as the greatest works of genius ever created by man. ~Jack Handey
STO: @JScout33
Scout101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 07:26 PM   #324
Rhaven
Captain
 
Rhaven's Avatar
 
Location: Rhaven in Boston
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Franklinstein wrote: View Post
I keep thinking of the character in Lucifer's Hammer that buried a set of The Way Things Work in his back yard before the meteor hit, so that when the initial disaster had subsided, he could go back and dig up all the volumes to help rebuild society. Of course, in that story he had time to prepare for it, but I don't think you need a truckload of books to set up a serviceable and self sustaining village. A relative handful to establish yourself after the chaos ends, and then you can branch out for more. And the survivors would probably be learning new skills at a crazy rate (or they would die). Naturalists and jacks-of-all-trades would probably do well.
Thank you! I've been trying to remember which book had that in it.

And I would bet that a government like the USA probably has all kinds of contingency plans for a widespread and lasting blackout to ensure the preservation of the core government and strategic places to retain control over.
I'm sure they do. Want to venture they are the ones controlling the mountain/west coast?
__________________
I'm not a geek, I'm an aficionado.
Rhaven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 07:59 PM   #325
PsychoPere
Vice Admiral
 
PsychoPere's Avatar
 
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Spooky Cat wrote: View Post
Franklinstein wrote: View Post
And I would bet that a government like the USA probably has all kinds of contingency plans for a widespread and lasting blackout to ensure the preservation of the core government and strategic places to retain control over.
I'm sure they do. Want to venture they are the ones controlling the mountain/west coast?
If remnants of the U.S. government are still in power in that region, they aren't doing so under the name "United States of America." As Nora said, the rebels in the Monroe Republic are fighting to overthrow Monroe and to re-establish the U.S.

As the map I linked to in my previous post shows, the areas of the country west of the Monroe Republic are controlled either by a California Commonwealth, a Plains Nation, a Texas, or comprise a region simply called the Wasteland.
PsychoPere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 08:17 PM   #326
Morpheus 02
Commodore
 
Location: Chicago IL
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

In this latest episode, i appreciate the way they are develping Captain Neville...who was a good guy, but then the day of the black out, his unjust firing starts him on the road to being a tough "bad" guy...it'll be intersting to see if he gets redeemed. Giancarlo Espoisito does a great job of having a character where we honestly wonder how much good is in him (if any), and the writers are doing it in a way that is reasonably consistent.
__________________
Morpheus 02
a.k.a.
JP Paulus jp [at] paulus . com
Morpheus 02 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 09:26 PM   #327
Enterprise is Great
Rear Admiral
 
Enterprise is Great's Avatar
 
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Neville's flashback was similar to John Locke's in Lost's Walkabout. He was some poor schlub working for a jerky boss then something happens to him and he becomes more badass. Though in Locke's case it involved him being able to walk again after being paralyzed and for Neville it involved killing a man.
__________________
JJverse Star Trek...ROCKED on May 17, 2013 and beyond!
Enterprise is Great is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 11:28 PM   #328
sojourner
Admiral
 
sojourner's Avatar
 
Location: I'm at WKRP
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

The Monroe republic is actually the best location to take advantage of steam technology in the U.S. It sits right on top of the industrial center of the U.S. Even if there were no current steam powered industries, they would still have the highest concentrations of industrial museums and the like to raid for equipment, not to mention the best rail infrastructure.

Of course, by the looks of the map in this episode, it looks like Monroe is going to have to fight the civil war all over again.
__________________
Baby, you and me were never meant to be, just maybe think of me once in a while...
sojourner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 16 2012, 11:32 PM   #329
The Green Mushroom
Commander
 
Location: United States
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Enterprise is Great wrote: View Post
Neville's flashback was similar to John Locke's in Lost's Walkabout. He was some poor schlub working for a jerky boss then something happens to him and he becomes more badass. Though in Locke's case it involved him being able to walk again after being paralyzed and for Neville it involved killing a man.
Yeah, I saw that too. I like the character now, whether he stays bad or converts away from the Dark Side. I just need to figure out whether he should step up as the Big Bad after (if) they knock off Monroe or if I would prefer him to become a leader in the Resistance. Of course we could be treated to an indefinite length of time where he's Monroe's guy in the field because the dynamics are never allowed to change.

In other news, I have come around on the issue of the time since the blackout. A few days ago, I posted that I didn't mind the length of time since the blackout since it allowed them to tell a story about rebuilding civilization instead of tearing it down. I think I wrong about that now.

This show really should have been set only a few years after the fall: long enough for some semblance of order, but not long enough for true stability. Two to five years could have allowed for a return to subsistence farming, militias to have cemented power without necessarily having to collapse or turn legitimate, for the clothes and buildings not to look too new, for the plastic soda bottles to still seem like good ideas for canteens (sorry that one just stuck out in my mind), etc, etc, etc. They even could have kept the flashbacks.

By the way, how long should I plan on being banned from the site for breaking the cardinal rule of the internet and admitting that I was wrong about something?
The Green Mushroom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 17 2012, 12:01 AM   #330
SG-17
Commodore
 
SG-17's Avatar
 
Location: Pennsylvania
Re: The Revolution pilot is online now...

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Yep, they were right on that count (even asthma would be tricky). Not only the people relying on meds, but very few people over, say, early 50s would have had much shot surviving the early die-off as well. Something like 15-40 would have been the sweet spot, and mostly in the middle of that curve. Add 15 years, and that should be the age of your population.

We should be seeing very few kids in the 15-20 old range right now. You'd have a few families here and there that made it, but it would be extremely difficult for young children to survive at that point. And they'd be an additional drain on the parents (extra food/supplies, having to carry them, having them cry at inopportune moments when hiding, etc), so it's likely either the child just wouldn't make it, or would eventually cause the whole family to die off. Having them forgo food to feed the child leaving them weaker when an attack comes, giving away position, tired from carrying them, diseases that the adults are innoculated against that the kids never got shots for, risky foraging mission to try and get them medicine, etc.

Not impossible, just think there'd be a couple of obviously-missing age bands at the start of this new world. And then there'd start being children in the 0-12 or so range as people started to settle in again, although in smaller numbers at first, so you'd expect that any children you see on this show would be quite young.
That isn't how it works though. The reason that statistical lifespans were low before modern medicine was because of the high rate of infant mortality and childhood diseases.

If you lived to be 30 you were expected to live into your 70s.

Now take into account that Smallpox and Polio have been wiped out.

PsychoPere wrote: View Post
Spooky Cat wrote: View Post
Franklinstein wrote: View Post
And I would bet that a government like the USA probably has all kinds of contingency plans for a widespread and lasting blackout to ensure the preservation of the core government and strategic places to retain control over.
I'm sure they do. Want to venture they are the ones controlling the mountain/west coast?
If remnants of the U.S. government are still in power in that region, they aren't doing so under the name "United States of America." As Nora said, the rebels in the Monroe Republic are fighting to overthrow Monroe and to re-establish the U.S.

As the map I linked to in my previous post shows, the areas of the country west of the Monroe Republic are controlled either by a California Commonwealth, a Plains Nation, a Texas, or comprise a region simply called the Wasteland.
I'd expect any US remnant to be based in Hawaii.


The Wasteland (Fallout: New Vegas reference?) on that map is composed of the Sonora and Mojave Deserts and the Rocky Mountains. Areas unlikely to be heavily settled without electricity. Maybe there is some Mormon settlement there that none of the other Republics want to have anything to do with?
__________________
Programs that I currently enjoy:
The Legend of Korra | Falling Skies | Hell on Wheels | Archer | The Borgias | Arrow

SG-17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
revolution

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:55 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.