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Future of Trek Discussion of future Trek projects.

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Old October 12 2012, 04:23 PM   #31
The Green Mushroom
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Location: United States
Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

Savious wrote: View Post
The Green Mushroom wrote: View Post
• The officers were often recruited by the captain or recommended to him, along with many of what we would today call the non-commissioned officers
Which would then smack right in the face of TNG, and Picard being assigned Riker as the 1st officer.

If, it was originally based on the age of sail; by the time we hit TNG, they updated their assignment operations.
I cannot remember the episode, but didn't Picard tell Riker that he found him out of a pile of recommended first officers?

Plus we have:
  • Sisko requesting a Bajoran first officer, hiring Worf, and seemingly summoning Dax to join him, though she could be a coincidence.
  • Tuvok seems to have been on Voyager because of Janeway.
  • Starfleet recruiting Riker to be captain instead of just giving him orders.
  • Shelby lobbying for Riker's job--directly implying that Picard could offer it to her.
  • Worf leaving Starfleet after DS9 and then having no trouble rejoining Picard for Nemesis
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Old October 12 2012, 06:31 PM   #32
Temis the Vorta
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Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

AviTrek wrote: View Post
Zombie Cheerleader wrote: View Post
Temis the Friendly Ghost wrote: View Post
The modern audience isnt going to know or care how militaries were in the olden days, but they'd know how things works nowadays in a general sense, so that's going seem right to them. But the real reason to rotate characters more is not "realism" but dramatic impact and flexibility.

It's obvious that Roddenberry modeled Star Trek on the US Navy, which he had personal experience with. Where do you think the USS Enterprise got its name?
He was in the US Army Air Forces.
And Star Trek is more modeled on the Age of Sail and Horatio Hornblower than the Army/Navy Roddenberry new in the 1960s.
So Roddenberry had no personal experience with the US Navy while serivng in the Pacific in WWII? I wonder how he managed that feat. Perhaps he used a rowboat to get around. He was certainly more familiar with the WWII era US Navy than with any entites that existed before he was born, and which he knew only from fiction and historical accounts.

And in his first draft, Roddenberry named his ship the USS Yorktown after yet another WWII aircraft carrier. Cmon, it's obvious that his military experience was a big influence on his concept of the series. The fact that he had multiple influences doesnt change that. Next, you guys will be saying that its all based on Conestoga wagons because he pitched the series as Wagon Train to the Stars.

Not that any of this is particuarly germane to the real point, which is that rotating cast members would be a more interesting and gutsy approach for a new series.

And trying to figure out the influences by looking at the content of the series itself is a lost cause because the military rules were made up based on what works best for a TV series, not because Horatio Hornblower would approve. The characters stayed on the same ship for years because TV shows are loathe to kill off main characters, because of actors' contracts and the assumption that the audience would be angry seeing their favorite characters axed. But TV has changed enough over the years that, at least on cable, the old broadcast assumptions no longer need apply.
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Old October 12 2012, 09:36 PM   #33
Savious
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Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

The Green Mushroom wrote: View Post

Plus we have:
• Sisko requesting a Bajoran first officer, hiring Worf, and seemingly summoning Dax to join him, though she could be a coincidence.
• Tuvok seems to have been on Voyager because of Janeway.
• Starfleet recruiting Riker to be captain instead of just giving him orders.
• Shelby lobbying for Riker's job--directly implying that Picard could offer it to her.
• Worf leaving Starfleet after DS9 and then having no trouble rejoining Picard for Nemesis
Well; I don’t know about other militaries; but I can tell you that in the US; by name requests still happen, and they happen on a regular basis.

But, even with that, many people are told where to go; or the petition to be told where to go, and often can and do turn down certain aspects.

For example, if you join the US army, no one can order you to go to Airborne school; it may be the same in Starfleet for taking a command; someone may be able to turn a command down, which Riker more or less did.

Sisko requested a Bajoran officer, but he didn’t request a specific person; but he did specifically request Worf.

I got the feeling Shelby was making her pitch more to the Admiral than anyone else.

In any case; I have to agree with Temis; it’s not so much what they did do; or what Starfleet did; it’s more should that be an area to pursue; and I think it would add a dynamic to the show, few other shows have approached; and if done right, could make the show run a lot longer, and better. Dr. Who, is the perfect example there, it keeps on going and going and going, because the cast never gets old.
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Old October 13 2012, 02:56 AM   #34
Nerys Myk
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Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

Temis the Friendly Ghost wrote: View Post
AviTrek wrote: View Post
Zombie Cheerleader wrote: View Post
He was in the US Army Air Forces.
And Star Trek is more modeled on the Age of Sail and Horatio Hornblower than the Army/Navy Roddenberry new in the 1960s.
So Roddenberry had no personal experience with the US Navy while serivng in the Pacific in WWII? I wonder how he managed that feat. Perhaps he used a rowboat to get around. He was certainly more familiar with the WWII era US Navy than with any entites that existed before he was born, and which he knew only from fiction and historical accounts.

And in his first draft, Roddenberry named his ship the USS Yorktown after yet another WWII aircraft carrier. Cmon, it's obvious that his military experience was a big influence on his concept of the series. The fact that he had multiple influences doesnt change that. Next, you guys will be saying that its all based on Conestoga wagons because he pitched the series as Wagon Train to the Stars.

Not that any of this is particuarly germane to the real point, which is that rotating cast members would be a more interesting and gutsy approach for a new series.

And trying to figure out the influences by looking at the content of the series itself is a lost cause because the military rules were made up based on what works best for a TV series, not because Horatio Hornblower would approve. The characters stayed on the same ship for years because TV shows are loathe to kill off main characters, because of actors' contracts and the assumption that the audience would be angry seeing their favorite characters axed. But TV has changed enough over the years that, at least on cable, the old broadcast assumptions no longer need apply.
He was a Bomber pilot. He probably flew. His actual shipboard interaction with the Navy was probably limited to being a passenger once or twice. On shore, who can say? Inter-service rivalry has been known to kick up a ruckus or two.

I would agree that his war time service probably shaped Star Trek's development. The other Gene (Coon) was a Marine so his knowledge of the Navy would have been closer to the source. Hornblower like "Wagon Train" was just away of pitching Star Trek in terms people ( TV executives and sponsors) would understand.
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Old October 20 2012, 06:10 AM   #35
Pondslider
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Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

I really like the idea of making the crew be more fluid and/or bigger and getting away from the idea of having 7 main characters and sort of trying to fit them all into boxes leftover from TOS.

I also think that if Trek is going to come back to TV it should take a page from Doctor Who and other "genre" shows and have shorter seasons and one arc connecting each episode. Twelve or thirteen episodes seem to be the norm for shows like Who, Walking Dead, True Blood, etc. It would save the budget, maybe attract bigger named actors to commit to the show even if just for a few episodes and make every episode count. No filler. They can still go to this random planet over here to settle some kind of dispute or investigate this anomaly over there, but there should be something pushing the overall plot ahead. I think this would also keep them from falling into some of the same cliches that past series did.

I had forgotten, until I started rewatching over the summer, that TNG seemed to attempt this during season two by working hints about the Conspiracy plot into episodes throughout the season leading up to Picard's confrontation at Starfleet. I don't know why they seemed to abandon this later in the series. It doesn't have to be as frantic as The Walking Dead or as big and heavy as DS9's dominion war, but I think having each season set out to tell one story in an overall bigger story would be ideal and hopefully keep people interested.
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Old October 30 2012, 08:18 AM   #36
TheRoyalFamily
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Re: Doctor Who style Trek?

One way to avoid having one crew would be to follow more than one ship. The show could be about a fleet (in the rather loose terms for a non-war Trek), or about an event or period of time. It could have an episode, a mini-arc, or even a whole season (depending on length of season) about one ship, then switch to another. Depending on what the overall show was about, it could even follow a non-Starfleet ship for a story or two. It could (and probably would) return to past ships, to see what they are up to now.
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