RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,586
Posts: 5,515,333
Members: 25,157
Currently online: 509
Newest member: Lt. Marseille

TrekToday headlines

Two New Starships Collection Ships
By: T'Bonz on Dec 26

Captain Kirk’s Boldest Missions
By: T'Bonz on Dec 25

Trek Paper Clips
By: T'Bonz on Dec 24

Sargent Passes
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

QMx Trek Insignia Badges
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

And The New Director Of Star Trek 3 Is…
By: T'Bonz on Dec 23

TV Alert: Pine On Tonight Show
By: T'Bonz on Dec 22

Retro Review: The Emperor’s New Cloak
By: Michelle on Dec 20

Star Trek Opera
By: T'Bonz on Dec 19

New Abrams Project
By: T'Bonz on Dec 18


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 7 2012, 04:48 PM   #46
R. Star
Rear Admiral
 
R. Star's Avatar
 
Location: Shangri-La
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

^ Pretty much.

I never got why everyone cited Starship Mine as Picard's ultimate action hero sequence. Pft, even in that episode he wasn't beating the bad guys with brute force and badassery, he was out smarting them with clever diversions and traps. Die Hard? Pft.. more like Home Alone.
__________________
"I was never a Star Trek fan." J.J. Abrams
R. Star is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 7 2012, 04:54 PM   #47
Hartzilla2007
Vice Admiral
 
Hartzilla2007's Avatar
 
Location: Star Trekkin Across the universe.
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
who wont hesitate to ignore his orders if it suits him.
So you would have preferred he let the Borg assimilate earth.
Hartzilla2007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8 2012, 12:04 AM   #48
NKemp3
Commodore
 
NKemp3's Avatar
 
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
Dream wrote: View Post
Zombie Redshirt wrote: View Post
That's because series Picard and movie Picard are in fact two separate people.
Action Picard already existed on the show. Remember Starship Mine?
He didn't say anything about "Action Picard".. He showed his action chops several times in the series when it was necessary, so that's not even the issue.

The issue is that Picard in the series is a thoughtful, reserved, intelligent person who respects all life and respects the chain of command, yet Movie Picard is a dumb, overly emotional, aggressive, bloodthirsty, dune buggying idiot who wont hesitate to ignore his orders if it suits him.

Amen. Stewart and the writers came to the conclusion that Picard needed to be more action driven and proactive. They felt for the big screen he needed to be more like Kirk. IMO it didn't work.
__________________
You will be missed, Richard Biggs
1961 - too soon
NKemp3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8 2012, 12:46 AM   #49
Mr_Homn
Captain
 
Mr_Homn's Avatar
 
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
who wont hesitate to ignore his orders if it suits him.
So you would have preferred he let the Borg assimilate earth.
I was thinking more about the time he started an insurrection so he could get laid.... oh i mean because it was the "right" thing to do...

Even though he made the exact opposite decision in Journeys End...

(yeah yeah the planet was stimulating his hormones... weak ass excuse.)


Zombie Redshirt wrote: View Post
^ Pretty much.

I never got why everyone cited Starship Mine as Picard's ultimate action hero sequence. Pft, even in that episode he wasn't beating the bad guys with brute force and badassery, he was out smarting them with clever diversions and traps. Die Hard? Pft.. more like Home Alone.
Very true and a good analogy. It is way more Home Alone than Die Hard.
__________________
"Thank you.. for the drinks."
Mr_Homn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8 2012, 12:49 AM   #50
Dream
Admiral
 
Dream's Avatar
 
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
who wont hesitate to ignore his orders if it suits him.
So you would have preferred he let the Borg assimilate earth.
I was thinking more the time he started an insurrection so he could get laid.... oh i mean because it was the "right" thing to do...

Even though he made the exact opposite decision in Journeys End... yeah yeah the planet was stimulating his hormones... weak ass excuse.
Insurrection was such a stupid movie. Also Beverly was right there! Why romance that other annoying chick of the week?
Dream is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8 2012, 05:21 AM   #51
NKemp3
Commodore
 
NKemp3's Avatar
 
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

Dream wrote: View Post
Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post

So you would have preferred he let the Borg assimilate earth.
I was thinking more the time he started an insurrection so he could get laid.... oh i mean because it was the "right" thing to do...

Even though he made the exact opposite decision in Journeys End... yeah yeah the planet was stimulating his hormones... weak ass excuse.
Insurrection was such a stupid movie. Also Beverly was right there! Why romance that other annoying chick of the week?

The same reason why they had Lily/Alfrie Woodard deliver all the big speeches to Picard in First Contact instead of Beverly: In the minds of TPTB Gates wasn't good enough to be in too many scenes with the Great Patrick Stewart. At least that's how it came across to me. And that's unfortunate.
__________________
You will be missed, Richard Biggs
1961 - too soon
NKemp3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 13 2012, 12:36 AM   #52
Therin of Andor
Admiral
 
Therin of Andor's Avatar
 
Location: New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
View Therin of Andor's Twitter Profile
Re: Captain Sisko in First Contact

CoveZombie wrote: View Post
Colm Meaney is not that big a movie star, and we're talking about little more than a cameo appearance.
Wanna bet? It's my understanding that his price for a movie contract had gone up beyond the salary levels of some of his TNG colleagues, which would make order of billing a problem. Remember that Whoopi Golding accepted "no billing" on "Generations" only so that she didn't displace her friend Patrick Stewart in the opening credits of his first starring role in a US motion picture.

Meaney seems a good guy and one who was always willing to do what the producers asked of him, such as appearing in the TNG finale. I can't imagine he would have held them up for some huge some of money for a day or two's work on the movie.
If an actor accepts lower-than-status pay on a project it can affect future and current negotiations on other projects. Being "a good guy" means nothing to agents and producers. Whoopi did a "good guy" act, but she wields a lot of star power in Hollywood.

I think the real area the film is lacking, as was hinted at upthread, though, is in the absence of Guinan.
Again, the problem with Whoopi is her availability. They would have had to work very hard to secure her for "First Contact", since she would have to be crucial to its script.

For many TNG eps, Whoopi would tell the production team when she had a window of opportunity, and they'd often rewrite a Troi scene to accommodate her. Only a few Guinan episodes were conceived as Guinan episodes.

And Whoop Goldberg has indicated that she would have been willing to do the film and, in fact, was confused at how they could exclude Guinan from that particular story.
What happens if they wrote the whole script and then she was unavailable? Delays cost money. Soran could have been recast, the Klingon sisters could have become new characters, the Borg Queen could have been recast, but not Guinan. So they went with a similar character/foil and an actress who was also a rising star, Alfre Woodard. She already had two Primetime Emmys and was runnerup for a Film Critics Association award at the time.

And, as I indicated before, as an Academy Award-winning lead actress, Whoopi's agent would have fought for top billing in "First Contact" for anything beyond a cameo.
__________________
Thiptho lapth! Ian (Entire post is personal opinion)
The Andor Files @ http://andorfiles.blogspot.com/
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/
Therin of Andor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:52 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.