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Old September 27 2012, 02:46 AM   #46
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Well, I got it from Cracked.com's 5 Things You Won't Believe Are Making You Dumber

According to research done by the University of New Hampshire, the IQs of unspanked toddlers were on average five points higher than those of their bruised-assed peers ... even four years after the spanking took place. In fact, the more often a kid was spanked, the lower his IQ was. They also found that nations where spanking is still socially acceptable today had lower national IQs than nations that look down on it.

Researchers say that kids who were spanked actually showed symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder -- the same condition war veterans get from watching people's heads get blown off (which is associated with low IQs).
It's based on a study from the University of New Hampshire. There's at least a correlation there.
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Old September 27 2012, 02:57 AM   #47
{ Emilia }
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
{ Emilia } wrote: View Post
Also: Any specific reason for singling out Italy where corporal punishment in schools has been banned since 1928? Sulking because I'm not all that impressed by the US in this case?
Ho scelto Italia perché è un paese che usa punizione corporale in qualche circostanze (e perché conosco alcune persone dall'Italia). Mi scusi si ho causato offesa (e per la mia grammatica). Credo che Italia è un paese modernisso ed è probabilmente meglio degli stati uniti. Ma punizione corporale non era una cosa del passato persino nell'Europa occidentally.
Don't worry, I wasn't offended. In fact I was being way too grouchy in my reply and I apologize for that.
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Old September 27 2012, 03:00 AM   #48
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Hooray. It was perhaps a bit unnecessary when I wrote it, so sorry about that.
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Old September 27 2012, 04:54 AM   #49
Knight Templar
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
Well, I got it from Cracked.com's 5 Things You Won't Believe Are Making You Dumber

According to research done by the University of New Hampshire, the IQs of unspanked toddlers were on average five points higher than those of their bruised-assed peers ... even four years after the spanking took place. In fact, the more often a kid was spanked, the lower his IQ was. They also found that nations where spanking is still socially acceptable today had lower national IQs than nations that look down on it.

Researchers say that kids who were spanked actually showed symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder -- the same condition war veterans get from watching people's heads get blown off (which is associated with low IQs).
It's based on a study from the University of New Hampshire. There's at least a correlation there.
Coincidence is not causation.

For all we know, stupider kids do more things to deserve spankings.
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Old September 27 2012, 11:06 AM   #50
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Actually, the phrase you're looking for is correlation, not coincidence. While I agree that, on the individual level, there needs to be more than just correlation (accounting for pre- and post-spanking IQ development with a large sample size), the comparison between nations is more difficult. It's harder to think of alternative explanations that account for entire nations rather than individuals.

In addition, that's just the epidemiological study. The non-statistical study of actual individuals that determined that they had some form of PTSD doesn't have an alternative explanation and PTSD is associated with reduced IQ.
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Old September 27 2012, 11:32 AM   #51
Haggis and tatties
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post
What is wrong with corporal punishment anyway?

Worked just fine in schools for centuries.
But we have moved on so much, do we really want to step back into the days of using voilence to control a child's behaviour.

And a lot of teachers were against Physical Punishment in school for a long time before it was banned....and by the time i was 15 i was simply refusing the belt totally, which had one teacher attacking me in the corridor, wrestling me to the ground and punching me........a nasty peice of work that asshole, big bugger as well....and not the kind of person you want being able to use voilence on kids with complete immunity....one of the reasons i am personally glad its long gone and that none of my nephew's or niece's will ever bump into a crazy unhinged idiot like this in school.

Best in my opinion to leave coropral punishment back in the past were it belongs.
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Old September 27 2012, 01:17 PM   #52
Knight Templar
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Haggis and tatties wrote: View Post
Knight Templar wrote: View Post
What is wrong with corporal punishment anyway?

Worked just fine in schools for centuries.
But we have moved on so much, do we really want to step back into the days of using voilence to control a child's behaviour.
I think giving children experience with controlled violence is a vital part of development.

After all, our society uses controlled violence all the time against adults in order to restrain behavior (the police).
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Old September 27 2012, 01:35 PM   #53
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

If spanking worked, kids would quit doing shit that got them spanked. But they don't.

Besides that, kids aren't stupid.

"I'm going to spank you because you did something wrong."
"Didn't you teach me that violence is wrong?"
"Yes."
"Isn't spanking violence?"
"Shut up and bend over!"

My parents spanked me (rarely), and I can tell you that it had little to no positive effect on me. I was much more bothered when they took away stuff I liked, e.g. video games and computer time. Simple deprivation and boredom will make the point.
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Old September 27 2012, 01:40 PM   #54
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post
I think giving children experience with controlled violence is a vital part of development.

After all, our society uses controlled violence all the time against adults in order to restrain behavior (the police).
On the contrary, the police, at least when it follows its own rules, merely uses violence as a last option ... and definitely not against the petty mischief of a child so the comparison is plain wrong. Not that I am surprised about right-wingers lusting for violence (of course with them being on the giving and not the receiving end).
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Old September 27 2012, 03:30 PM   #55
Haggis and tatties
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post
Haggis and tatties wrote: View Post
Knight Templar wrote: View Post
What is wrong with corporal punishment anyway?

Worked just fine in schools for centuries.
But we have moved on so much, do we really want to step back into the days of using voilence to control a child's behaviour.
I think giving children experience with controlled violence is a vital part of development.

After all, our society uses controlled violence all the time against adults in order to restrain behavior (the police).
Children dont need to be personally on the receving end of physical voilence to understand what it is, god knows these days they have such easy access to it's be it on the Tv or internet, much much more than most of us did in our childhood.

Best to leave schools expanding the brain and not expanding the teachers belting arm muscles.
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Old September 27 2012, 10:37 PM   #56
Knight Templar
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

horatio83 wrote: View Post
Knight Templar wrote: View Post
I think giving children experience with controlled violence is a vital part of development.

After all, our society uses controlled violence all the time against adults in order to restrain behavior (the police).
On the contrary, the police, at least when it follows its own rules, merely uses violence as a last option ... and definitely not against the petty mischief of a child so the comparison is plain wrong. Not that I am surprised about right-wingers lusting for violence (of course with them being on the giving and not the receiving end).
I assume paddling is pretty much a last resort for most schools and parents as well.

Haggis and tatties wrote: View Post
Knight Templar wrote: View Post
Haggis and tatties wrote: View Post

But we have moved on so much, do we really want to step back into the days of using voilence to control a child's behaviour.
I think giving children experience with controlled violence is a vital part of development.

After all, our society uses controlled violence all the time against adults in order to restrain behavior (the police).
Children dont need to be personally on the receving end of physical voilence to understand what it is, god knows these days they have such easy access to it's be it on the Tv or internet, much much more than most of us did in our childhood.
Television and video games do not equal "experience" or "understanding" of violence.
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Old September 27 2012, 11:10 PM   #57
scotpens
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

CaptainStoner wrote: View Post
Spanking should only be carried out by adults on other adults.
Agreed! (Hey, it's about time someone posted this.)

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Old September 27 2012, 11:19 PM   #58
Colonel Green
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

I've been opposed to corporal punishment for as long as I can remember. That said, discovering that FSM holds the same opinion has shaken my confidence in my judgement on this issue.
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Old September 28 2012, 01:13 AM   #59
JiNX-01
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

Redfern wrote: View Post
Sorry, guys; I misread the title as "padding a 16-year old girl"! I thought, "What?! The school is actually advocating she stuff her bra?!"

Sincerely,

Bill
So, uh... were you disappointed when you found what it was really about?
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Old September 28 2012, 01:37 AM   #60
Delsaber
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Re: Paddling a 16-year-old giirl at school: is everyone stupid here?

There was a news story a few years back about strip searches at a school dance. I don't recall the context, probably something about alcohol, but... damn. Paddling and strip searches. Suddenly my school days don't seem quite so bad.
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