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Old September 23 2012, 11:51 PM   #61
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

It was only recently that I found out that the spaceships that we first see in the film (right before the space station) are orbital nuclear weapons platforms. I used to think they were just generic spaceship thingies.
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Old September 24 2012, 01:32 AM   #62
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

Until Roger Ebert discussed that point a couple of decades ago, I never caught the relevance either. But it's appropriate and makes great sense when we've just left the Moonwatcher character becoming the first homo sapien killer.....after being influenced by the Monolith. The monolith's purpose as I see it is to induce evolution, and the only way to facilitate it is for man to discover violence in order to survive as well as evolve. So Kubrick jump cuts from Moonwatcher's spinning bone-weapon to another slowly floating weapon (or arsenal of weapons in space). Now do you see why I find this film poetic?

Other than that above plot point, Maurice did a better job answering beamMe's last question than I possibly could, and also brought up two points I've never considered. He noticed the Heywood Floyd section has no title card. And he noticed the Discovery resembles Moonwatcher's thrown bone. Maybe now we know why the immense ship is shaped as it is. Yeah, I know, it's also kinda shlongy, but so are old Klingon ships.

Title cards notwithstanding, I always think of 2001 as THREE parts instead of four: the Moonwatcher incidents, the Floyd mission, and the two-part Bowman adventure. I think it's also the recurring appearances of the Monolith(s) that make the film poetic. We can see how the Moonwatcher evolves, and we know Bowman is evolving in a more positive way. Floyd never evolves. I don't consider him a closet Neanderthal or anything, but the ending of his segment to me is the most confusing and disorienting. The Monolith (or another hidden source) emits one hell of a sonic signal which prevents Floyd's team from taking a photograph of it. Here's one moment where I'm not certain of the overall meaning. And when you see the way it ends, you tend to wonder if the team survived that ear-solitting moment because they're never seen again. Floyd is heard again after HAL is deactivated, and his name is seen in teeny-tiny type. It might be too small to notice on DVD though.
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Old September 24 2012, 03:56 AM   #63
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

In the strictest sense, most of what's ambiguous in 2001 is explained clearly in the source novel, even if Kubrick would have preferred otherwise.
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Old September 24 2012, 05:15 AM   #64
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

I don't think even Clarke quite got where Kubrick was going, and so I think the novel is more Clarke's take on the events than what Kubrick thought it meant.

What's delightful about seeing 2001 on a big screen with an audience that appreciates Kubrick is that there are moments in the film that get laughs, notably HAL's, "I know I have made some bad decisions lately," in reference to his murdering the rest of the crew and marooning Dave outside to die. One thing that always gets an unintentional laugh on the big screen (impossible to see on DVD) is when Dave asks HAL for a hard copy, and what pops out is a punch card!
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Old September 24 2012, 01:07 PM   #65
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

Maurice wrote: View Post
I don't think even Clarke quite got where Kubrick was going, and so I think the novel is more Clarke's take on the events than what Kubrick thought it meant.

What's delightful about seeing 2001 on a big screen with an audience that appreciates Kubrick is that there are moments in the film that get laughs, notably HAL's, "I know I have made some bad decisions lately," in reference to his murdering the rest of the crew and marooning Dave outside to die. One thing that always gets an unintentional laugh on the big screen (impossible to see on DVD) is when Dave asks HAL for a hard copy, and what pops out is a punch card!
Heh, I laughed at those two moments, do I appreciate Kubrick now?
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Old September 24 2012, 02:14 PM   #66
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

^ You can see the punch card on the Blu-Ray.

What you can also see, is the screen that the outdoor scenes are projected on, during the Dawn of Man sequence. As we all know, those scenes were not actually SHOT outdoors - they were in a studio, with the 'sky' being a projection on film. It's only on the Blu-Ray where you can actually SEE the screen.

foxhot wrote: View Post
And when you see the way it ends, you tend to wonder if the team survived that ear-solitting moment because they're never seen again. Floyd is heard again after HAL is deactivated, and his name is seen in teeny-tiny type. It might be too small to notice on DVD though.
If you're suggesting that the ear-shattering sound killed all those astronauts, I don't think so. They would have had plenty of time to make it back to their moon rover craft.

And Dr. Floyd appears in the novel 2061, so at least Clarke suggested that he survived. As for Floyd's prerecorded message at the end of 2001? If you believe Floyd in 2010 where he said he never authorized anyone to tell HAL about the monolith...that message was apparently FAKED.
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Old September 24 2012, 06:14 PM   #67
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

At least according to Hyams's sequel.

Sometimes I figure the Monolith emitted the supersonic signal because it didn't want the astronauts to photograph it, or themselves in front of it. It's a strangely vague ending for the Floyd segment.
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Old September 24 2012, 06:21 PM   #68
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

Strangely enough, I always got a bit of a Lovecraft/old gods vibe from 2001.
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Old September 24 2012, 06:33 PM   #69
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

foxhot wrote: View Post
Sometimes I figure the Monolith emitted the supersonic signal because it didn't want the astronauts to photograph it, or themselves in front of it. It's a strangely vague ending for the Floyd segment.
The monolith emitted a "single very powerful radio emission aimed at Jupiter," which is why Discovery is headed where she's headed. I always assumed the signal was so powerful it created a painfully loud interference on the spacesuit radios.

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Old September 24 2012, 06:39 PM   #70
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

foxhot wrote: View Post
At least according to Hyams's sequel.

Sometimes I figure the Monolith emitted the supersonic signal because it didn't want the astronauts to photograph it, or themselves in front of it. It's a strangely vague ending for the Floyd segment.
I thought it was a signal that humanity had advanced far enough to even find the Monolith in the first place. Thus it signaled to its creators that humanity was almost ready. Killing people would be counterproductive.

The Monolith clearly didn't care about being poked and prodded. In 2010 Dr. Floyd said that they tried everything - lasers, even nuclear detonators, and nothing worked. So the creators of the device had no problem with people poking around it. The Monolith emitted that signal because it was a 'trip-wire' due to go off whenever humanity found it. The signal was for the next phase in the plan, as it were (i.e. the transformation of Dave Bowman).
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Old September 24 2012, 08:15 PM   #71
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

Remember, the signal was triggered when the artifact entered direct sunlight.
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Old September 24 2012, 10:22 PM   #72
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Re: There's no one like Kubrick

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
foxhot wrote: View Post
At least according to Hyams's sequel.

Sometimes I figure the Monolith emitted the supersonic signal because it didn't want the astronauts to photograph it, or themselves in front of it. It's a strangely vague ending for the Floyd segment.
I thought it was a signal that humanity had advanced far enough to even find the Monolith in the first place. Thus it signaled to its creators that humanity was almost ready. Killing people would be counterproductive.

The Monolith clearly didn't care about being poked and prodded. In 2010 Dr. Floyd said that they tried everything - lasers, even nuclear detonators, and nothing worked. So the creators of the device had no problem with people poking around it. The Monolith emitted that signal because it was a 'trip-wire' due to go off whenever humanity found it. The signal was for the next phase in the plan, as it were (i.e. the transformation of Dave Bowman).
In that case, we have another case of Man evolving, not a caveman or astronaut, but a team of scientists----evolving through clever ingenuity this time......it's still poetic.
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