RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 140,890
Posts: 5,476,492
Members: 25,050
Currently online: 541
Newest member: aloraptor

TrekToday headlines

Klingon Bloodwine To Debut
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Trek Actors In War Of The Worlds Fundraiser
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Star Trek: The Next Generation Gag Reel Tease
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24

Shatner In Haven
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24

Retro Review: Covenant
By: Michelle on Nov 22

Two Official Starships Collection Previews
By: T'Bonz on Nov 21

Saldana: Women Issues In Hollywood
By: T'Bonz on Nov 21

Shatner Book Kickstarter
By: T'Bonz on Nov 20

Trek Original Series Slippers
By: T'Bonz on Nov 19

Hemsworth Is Sexiest Man Alive
By: T'Bonz on Nov 19


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Welcome to the Trek BBS! > General Trek Discussion

General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 20 2012, 10:17 AM   #16
King Daniel Into Darkness
Admiral
 
King Daniel Into Darkness's Avatar
 
Location: King Daniel Into Darkness
Re: Captain Worf

T'Cal wrote: View Post
He was the first Klingon in Starfleet

"Nu uh, that was me."
http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Konom
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3

Last edited by King Daniel Into Darkness; September 20 2012 at 10:18 PM.
King Daniel Into Darkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20 2012, 10:33 AM   #17
C.E. Evans
Vice Admiral
 
C.E. Evans's Avatar
 
Location: Ferguson, Missouri, USA
Re: Captain Worf

R. Star wrote: View Post
Well it was unequivocally stated that because Worf betrayed a mission to save his wife, his career was basically dead and he wouldn't get a command.
Which was an opinion at the time. Given how much time has passed since then and how many times Worf has likely redeemed himself, it's definitely plausible that Worf is a captain by now.
__________________
"Don't sweat the small stuff--it makes you small-minded..."
C.E. Evans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20 2012, 11:05 AM   #18
DarKush
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Captain Worf

T'Cal wrote: View Post
Worf was one of the richest characters in all of Trek. He was the first Klingon in Starfleet and he has earned his way up the ranks and deserves to be captain. He served under two of the greatest captains of all time (Picard & Sisko - not to mention Riker) and the writers of such a story should have him grow and mature to the point where his style incorporates some traits of each. He should have some of the patience of Picard, the tenacity of Sisko and the unpredictability of Riker, as well as the warrior spirit and deep honor that Worf himself has always possessed. A post-Nemesis series should feature Worf commanding a ship with a crew filled with fresh characters.
This sounds on the money to me!
DarKush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20 2012, 11:14 AM   #19
DarKush
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Captain Worf

T'Cal wrote: View Post
Worf and data got short-changed for the most part in TNG's movies. While in the end they got to help save the day, far too often they were used as failed attempts at humor, cheapening both characters, who had been written prior to the films as complex characters with rich histories. Much of that was pissed away in the films.
While I agree with you on Worf, I think Data did get far more screen time. Now we can debate whether his screen time amounted to much character development or not. I think Data was mostly used for comic relief in Generations, which made sense in a way due to his issues with the emotion chip. I thought Data's best outing was First Contact when he was seduced by the Borg Queen. His character regressed in Insurrection, but there was some fumbling attempts at character development in Nemesis, ending with his big sacrifice. So I think Data got a lot more screen time. I think they were trying to make Picard and Data the new Kirk and Spock, with very mixed results.

Worf's best outing was First Contact. He wasn't much of a factor in Generations (except for comic relief) or Nemesis. He also had some comical scenes in Insurrection, along with most of the crew.

As for the Change of Heart rationale for not giving Worf command. I think that's something that could be easily overturned or forgotten. For one, it was Sisko's opinion or recommendation. Picard, arguably, a bigger Starfleet figure might disagree, and I'm guessing that Riker, another notable Starfleet officer would as well. Who's to say that Sisko didn't change his mind-or it could be written to say that he did.

Plus, denying Starfleet's best known Klingon officer the captain's chair wouldn't sit well with the Klingons, especially since Worf is in the House of the Klingon Chancellor.

Beyond that Worf has redeemed himself multiple times, during the Dominion War. Plus he spent time as an ambassador. He's skilled in war, politics, and diplomacy.

It likely wouldn't matter for a TV show, but Trek Lit. has already started eroding the Change of Heart decision, by making Worf a first officer, putting him back on the command track.

As for picking another character like Ezri over Worf. While I get the idea of a fresh breath of air, I just don't think that Ezri was as popular as Worf. I don't think she has the ties to TOS, TNG, and DS9 that Worf had. Heck, even the House of Duras was on ENT, which somewhat ties him to that show too. His character has such a rich history and is a far more compelling character than Ezri. I don't want to knock Ezri, but she didn't get a lot of development since she came on the scene so late. I do think Trek Lit. has done a good job with her as captain. I was skeptical at first, but I think they've pulled it off. However I don't see how you can build a show around her. Worf is a far more recognizable face for the Trek brand.
DarKush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20 2012, 11:27 AM   #20
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Captain Worf

DarKush wrote: View Post
Heck, even the House of Duras was on ENT, which somewhat ties him to that show too.
That's because they had run out of any original thoughts and had to rehash the same ideas in different settings, which is why we got Duras, the Ferengi and the Borg all making appearances in ENT.
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20 2012, 11:54 AM   #21
Jimi_James
Lieutenant Commander
 
Jimi_James's Avatar
 
Location: Gettin' Lucky in Kentucky
View Jimi_James's Twitter Profile
Re: Captain Worf

I'm on the fence about this. On the one hand, YAY! More Trek! On the other hand, what is there left new to do or discover with Worf that hasn't been done already?

So the idea of using Worf as the focal point for a new series doesn't exactly feel me with a great deal of enthusiasm or excitement.

Plus, again with the Klingons? Maye he can find some Borg to fight. That's an idea that's never been done.

I do agree though, that like most of the TNG characters not named Data or Picard, Worf drew the short end of the stick when it came to screen time in the movies. In most instances, you can cut him out of the movies and not really disrupt the overall flow of the narrative.

This does sort of feel like the Sulu series idea that floated around for a long time and eventually went no where. I don't expect it will likely go anywhere...but if it does, I'll likely tune in and give it a chance.
__________________
“I was here,” says Man. “Prove it,” says the Universe.” Method of Life, a post apocalyptic sci-fi ebook available on Amazon.

My YouTube Gaming Channel
Jimi_James is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 02:49 AM   #22
T'Cal
Commodore
 
T'Cal's Avatar
 
Location: Chicago
Re: Captain Worf

DarKush wrote: View Post
T'Cal wrote: View Post
Worf and data got short-changed for the most part in TNG's movies. While in the end they got to help save the day, far too often they were used as failed attempts at humor, cheapening both characters, who had been written prior to the films as complex characters with rich histories. Much of that was pissed away in the films.
While I agree with you on Worf, I think Data did get far more screen time. Now we can debate whether his screen time amounted to much character development or not. I think Data was mostly used for comic relief in Generations, which made sense in a way due to his issues with the emotion chip. I thought Data's best outing was First Contact when he was seduced by the Borg Queen. His character regressed in Insurrection, but there was some fumbling attempts at character development in Nemesis, ending with his big sacrifice. So I think Data got a lot more screen time. I think they were trying to make Picard and Data the new Kirk and Spock, with very mixed results.

Worf's best outing was First Contact. He wasn't much of a factor in Generations (except for comic relief) or Nemesis. He also had some comical scenes in Insurrection, along with most of the crew.

As for the Change of Heart rationale for not giving Worf command. I think that's something that could be easily overturned or forgotten. For one, it was Sisko's opinion or recommendation. Picard, arguably, a bigger Starfleet figure might disagree, and I'm guessing that Riker, another notable Starfleet officer would as well. Who's to say that Sisko didn't change his mind-or it could be written to say that he did.

Plus, denying Starfleet's best known Klingon officer the captain's chair wouldn't sit well with the Klingons, especially since Worf is in the House of the Klingon Chancellor.

Beyond that Worf has redeemed himself multiple times, during the Dominion War. Plus he spent time as an ambassador. He's skilled in war, politics, and diplomacy.

It likely wouldn't matter for a TV show, but Trek Lit. has already started eroding the Change of Heart decision, by making Worf a first officer, putting him back on the command track.

As for picking another character like Ezri over Worf. While I get the idea of a fresh breath of air, I just don't think that Ezri was as popular as Worf. I don't think she has the ties to TOS, TNG, and DS9 that Worf had. Heck, even the House of Duras was on ENT, which somewhat ties him to that show too. His character has such a rich history and is a far more compelling character than Ezri. I don't want to knock Ezri, but she didn't get a lot of development since she came on the scene so late. I do think Trek Lit. has done a good job with her as captain. I was skeptical at first, but I think they've pulled it off. However I don't see how you can build a show around her. Worf is a far more recognizable face for the Trek brand.
I couldn't agree more with all that you wrote, my friend. While Data did get more screen time in Generations (even more than Riker!), it was wasted time. First Contact holds up because the characters were written, directed and acted well. I liked Insurrection and I agree with the many who say it was more of an episode than an epic film; I prefered the episodes over the films so it appealed to me. Nemesis has some great moments, although some were in deleted scenes. Over all, though, the film lacked because the characters were far too often written and directed out of character. Picard never responded quite the way I would've expected him to. Riker wasn't bad nor was Deana, but Geordi actually gave up when the transporters blew. Has he ever given up in a crisis?? Based on how well he worked for Riker in the Briar Patch in Insurrection, I fully expected Geordi to be chosen by Will as his XO on the Titan. B4 was a mess as one pair of clones was more than enough. Beverly barely had screen time and this should've been the film for him and Beverly to get together finally. Worf got to mumble something about honor. BFD. Humor is not easy in TNG. Frakes gets it but Baird certainly didn't.
__________________
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." -- Judge Aaron Satie
T'Cal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 09:16 AM   #23
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Captain Worf

Jimi_James wrote: View Post
I'm on the fence about this. On the one hand, YAY! More Trek! On the other hand, what is there left new to do or discover with Worf that hasn't been done already?

So the idea of using Worf as the focal point for a new series doesn't exactly feel me with a great deal of enthusiasm or excitement.

Plus, again with the Klingons? Maye he can find some Borg to fight. That's an idea that's never been done.
I would have to agree. I'm really pretty 'meh' towards the concept.

Worf was a decent character but on TV he was used and used and used to the point where there really isn't much more that can be explored with him. He was never my favourite character, but he was well written and acted and definately helped to beef out the Klingons. But they've been done to death (even B'Elanna "I hate everything Klingon" Torres somehow shifted to being a supporter and hanging a bat'leth in her quarters).
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 10:14 AM   #24
R. Star
Rear Admiral
 
R. Star's Avatar
 
Location: Shangri-La
Re: Captain Worf

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
R. Star wrote: View Post
Well it was unequivocally stated that because Worf betrayed a mission to save his wife, his career was basically dead and he wouldn't get a command.
Which was an opinion at the time. Given how much time has passed since then and how many times Worf has likely redeemed himself, it's definitely plausible that Worf is a captain by now.
Um... Worf let abandoned not only his mission during a war, but let a vital contact die. That's a pretty big screw up and one he was lucky he didn't get court martialed over.

Is it understandable? Sure... excusable? No.
__________________
"I was never a Star Trek fan." J.J. Abrams
R. Star is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 09:18 PM   #25
C.E. Evans
Vice Admiral
 
C.E. Evans's Avatar
 
Location: Ferguson, Missouri, USA
Re: Captain Worf

R. Star wrote: View Post
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
R. Star wrote: View Post
Well it was unequivocally stated that because Worf betrayed a mission to save his wife, his career was basically dead and he wouldn't get a command.
Which was an opinion at the time. Given how much time has passed since then and how many times Worf has likely redeemed himself, it's definitely plausible that Worf is a captain by now.
Um... Worf let abandoned not only his mission during a war, but let a vital contact die. That's a pretty big screw up and one he was lucky he didn't get court martialed over.
Water under the bridge. By now (2389), Worf likely has more than made up for that perhaps several times over and has saved countless lives since then.
Is it understandable? Sure... excusable? No.
Nah, Worf probably does have his own command right now.
__________________
"Don't sweat the small stuff--it makes you small-minded..."
C.E. Evans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 09:38 PM   #26
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Captain Worf

Until proven otherwise on screen, I like to think that Worf was still the Federation Ambassador to the Klingon Empire and was only back in uniform for his brief trip to the E-E for the Troi's wedding. After the E-E returned to Earth for repairs, he departed back to Qo'nos to continue his career as a diplomat.
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 21 2012, 10:15 PM   #27
DarKush
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Captain Worf

^
Since Worf was wasted in Nemesis I just wish they had stuck him in Klingon clothes and called him ambassador. Putting him back in a uniform was annoying without giving a reason why. Granted it's all about appealing to new or casual viewers but I think they have to give something to the fans too.

I liked the idea of Worf as ambassador, and Worf as first officer (hello, Titan anyone?) or having a command of his own a lot more than what they did to him in Nemesis.
DarKush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 22 2012, 01:33 AM   #28
T'Girl
Vice Admiral
 
T'Girl's Avatar
 
Location: comfortably residing in the meat packing district
Re: Captain Worf

DarKush wrote: View Post
... and Worf as first officer (hello, Titan anyone?) or having a command of his own ...
Better still, Captain Worf of the Titan. Will Riker is killed one week into Titan's maiden cruise and Worf assume command, he also finds time to "comfort" the widow Troi.

What are friends for.

__________________
.
TOS, TNG and VGR never mentioned a "Federation President."
T'Girl is online now   Reply With Quote
Old September 22 2012, 05:15 AM   #29
Bry_Sinclair
Commodore
 
Bry_Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: Tactical withdrawl along the Klingon border
Re: Captain Worf

I wish they'd done more with the Worf/Troi romance.
__________________
Avatar: Captain Naya, U.S.S. Renown NCC-1415 [Star Trek: Four Years War]
Manip by: JM1776 (STPMA.net)
Bry_Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 22 2012, 06:23 AM   #30
Jimi_James
Lieutenant Commander
 
Jimi_James's Avatar
 
Location: Gettin' Lucky in Kentucky
View Jimi_James's Twitter Profile
Re: Captain Worf

Speaking of Troi and the Titan, I wonder what ship he would get. I doubt it would be the Titan with that clearly being Rikers ship and I don't entirely buy him as CO of the Enterprise...I barely even buy him as XO of the Enterprise.

I could see him getting the Defiant, sort of a continuation of what we briefly saw in First Contact and then later during the war. Plus, canonically, the state of the Defiant is unresolved, so they could give him the ship and do some stories even before Nemesis.

A new ship perhaps? Something fitting his warrior nature.

Who's to say he even gets a Starfleet ship. Perhaps Martok gives him a Bird of Prey to go handle some diplomatic mission, the captain is killed and Worf is forced to step up and take command.

Who knows really. What I'm wondering though, is if they do go with a Starfleet ship, what 24th century sets do they even still have in storage. Weren't most of them destroyed/scrapped or sold. Would they really go to the trouble of rebuilding an entire set for one film? Maybe they go all green screen. With a good budget you can get good results, but if done on the cheap it can often look bad.
__________________
“I was here,” says Man. “Prove it,” says the Universe.” Method of Life, a post apocalyptic sci-fi ebook available on Amazon.

My YouTube Gaming Channel
Jimi_James is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:35 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.