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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old September 15 2012, 09:00 AM   #31
MacLeod
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

With regards to evolved humans, most of the characters in DSN both primary and secondary weren't Human.
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Old September 15 2012, 10:58 AM   #32
teacock
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Off the top of my head..

Human


Sisko
Bashir
O'Brien
Keiko
Kasidy
Jake

Non-Human

Quark
Nog
Rom
Leeta
Kira
Garak
Dukat
Worf
Dax
Odo
Weyoun
Damar
Kai Winn

WINNER. Definitely a key to the show being so interesting.
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Old September 15 2012, 12:03 PM   #33
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

It would be good to have a poll on this.

I liked DS9 because it felt the most real. Not the aliens, tech etc feeling real but the characters. In scifi or fantasy genre you can accept the unbelievable elements better if you can relate to the characters and DS9 did the best job of this.
They also showed the gritty and hard working side to how such a perfect society could work.
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Old September 15 2012, 07:01 PM   #34
MacLeod
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

teacake wrote: View Post
Off the top of my head..

Human


Sisko
Bashir
O'Brien
Keiko
Kasidy
Jake

Non-Human

Quark
Nog
Rom
Leeta
Kira
Garak
Dukat
Worf
Dax
Odo
Weyoun
Damar
Kai Winn

WINNER. Definitely a key to the show being so interesting.
Martok
Gowron
Female Changeling
Brunt
Zek

You could also have

Tain

I could go on, but as for another Human, Ross.
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Old September 16 2012, 12:32 AM   #35
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Ishka, can't have Zek without Ishka!

And if we're going Ishka we might as well go one of my favorites, Lwaxana.

Non humans really do make things interesting.
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Old September 16 2012, 01:33 AM   #36
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

No Star Trek DS9 isn't the best Star Trek series. It is however the better follow up to TNG. (IMO)
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Old September 16 2012, 02:03 AM   #37
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Kirby wrote: View Post
The characters grow over the course of the series, their actions (usually) have consequences, and plot points don't just drop when the episode is over.
you could say the same thing about TNG. for some reason people act like the things that happened in TNG had no consequences or continuation...

what about introducing the borg in season 2, which was a consequence in itself of Picard's constant gloating about humanity to Q... and because of Q's actions, the Borg become aware of the federation, and they are trying to assimilate them for the rest of the series and beyond. Going back even farther, in even as early as season one's coming of age... Picard is under investigation for all sorts of things that happened in prior episodes. they make specific references to several past episodes... and this story continues later in conspiracy (which was originally going to be the start of the borg, who would be insects, but this was changed due to budgetary reasons).. daimon bok having run ins with picard in season 1 and season 7, which is almost like two parts of one story.... these are just examples of major plot points continuing in even the EARLY seasons.. There is a definite sense of continuation throughout the series, although it may not be as obvious as in ds9.

O'brien getting married, we saw his marriage with keiko grow and change with the birth of their daughter in later episodes... Troi's prior relationship with riker having an effect on her and Worf much later in the series... In Defector they reference geordi's experiences in the golondon core with the other romulan.. Data's exploration of humanity which is a constant theme throughout the series and there is a definite sense of his progression throughout many episodes... the introduction of alexander and Worf's continual struggle with balancing his klingon/human side in fathering, all the way to season 7 when alexander from the future comes back and tries to change alexander's path.. Riker realizing that the reality in future imperfect being false, when he found out about Minuet, who was a hologram from season 1...

Of course then there's the obvious big stuff like Worf's actions affecting his reputation in the klingon empire and the consequences of that rippling throughout the series as well as ds9... or when Picard is assimilated and this is brought up time and time again and how he struggles with this in... the flute being brought back in Lessons even explored his pain and the way the music helped him cope.. The run ins with the duras family... Tasha Yar's death and the consequences of Yesterday's Enterprise leading into several appearances with romulan yar.. continued run-ins with Tomalak.. there are lots of examples of this stuff, I could go on and on but why bother? Just watch the series and pay attention.

But for some reason, people act like there were no continuing stories in TNG. As if stuff just happened, and it was never brought up again, and nothing from one episode affected anything after. It may not have been as much of a focus or spelled out as it was in ds9, and it certainly wasn't as political, but there was a definite sense of continuity, character progression, and story arcs.. wayyy more than something like Voyager which came out years later

this of course is in no way to take away anything from ds9, as it definitely focused more on continuing stories, and focused on a constant progression to a larger degree, but I think people give TNG way too little credit in the same categories
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Old September 16 2012, 02:43 AM   #38
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Why not have Lek and Gaila, invite all the Ferengi to the party.

In answer to thread title, yes. Simply yes.
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Old September 16 2012, 02:51 AM   #39
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

of the Modern TV series (TNG onwards) I think DS9 has aged the best. The first season of DS9 is a lot better then the first seasons of TNG, Voy, or Ent (by a good margin) and there is less bad episodes in later seasons. Also, the themes of DS9 still have a lot of punch in today's society.

Its kinda odd to think that Almost all of TNG and the first seasons of DS9 are 20 years old now.
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Old September 16 2012, 04:42 AM   #40
MacLeod
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Mr_Homn wrote: View Post
Kirby wrote: View Post
The characters grow over the course of the series, their actions (usually) have consequences, and plot points don't just drop when the episode is over.
you could say the same thing about TNG. for some reason people act like the things that happened in TNG had no consequences or continuation...

what about introducing the borg in season 2, which was a consequence in itself of Picard's constant gloating about humanity to Q... and because of Q's actions, the Borg become aware of the federation, and they are trying to assimilate them for the rest of the series and beyond. Going back even farther, in even as early as season one's coming of age... Picard is under investigation for all sorts of things that happened in prior episodes. they make specific references to several past episodes... and this story continues later in conspiracy (which was originally going to be the start of the borg, who would be insects, but this was changed due to budgetary reasons).. daimon bok having run ins with picard in season 1 and season 7, which is almost like two parts of one story.... these are just examples of major plot points continuing in even the EARLY seasons.. There is a definite sense of continuation throughout the series, although it may not be as obvious as in ds9.

O'brien getting married, we saw his marriage with keiko grow and change with the birth of their daughter in later episodes... Troi's prior relationship with riker having an effect on her and Worf much later in the series... In Defector they reference geordi's experiences in the golondon core with the other romulan.. Data's exploration of humanity which is a constant theme throughout the series and there is a definite sense of his progression throughout many episodes... the introduction of alexander and Worf's continual struggle with balancing his klingon/human side in fathering, all the way to season 7 when alexander from the future comes back and tries to change alexander's path.. Riker realizing that the reality in future imperfect being false, when he found out about Minuet, who was a hologram from season 1...

Of course then there's the obvious big stuff like Worf's actions affecting his reputation in the klingon empire and the consequences of that rippling throughout the series as well as ds9... or when Picard is assimilated and this is brought up time and time again and how he struggles with this in... the flute being brought back in Lessons even explored his pain and the way the music helped him cope.. The run ins with the duras family... Tasha Yar's death and the consequences of Yesterday's Enterprise leading into several appearances with romulan yar.. continued run-ins with Tomalak.. there are lots of examples of this stuff, I could go on and on but why bother? Just watch the series and pay attention.

But for some reason, people act like there were no continuing stories in TNG. As if stuff just happened, and it was never brought up again, and nothing from one episode affected anything after. It may not have been as much of a focus or spelled out as it was in ds9, and it certainly wasn't as political, but there was a definite sense of continuity, character progression, and story arcs.. wayyy more than something like Voyager which came out years later

this of course is in no way to take away anything from ds9, as it definitely focused more on continuing stories, and focused on a constant progression to a larger degree, but I think people give TNG way too little credit in the same categories
It might just be me, but I haven't seen TNG come under much fire not having continuity or at the very least having internal continuity within itself as a show. VOY is the show which comes under most fire for having more lax continuity, even with the show itself.
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Old September 16 2012, 04:29 PM   #41
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

TNG had continuity alright just not such grand story arcs or DS9's rich structure. Ironically TNG was more of a closed-in show than DS9 was since TNG was confined to the ship and all the main characters were confined to it as where most of the secondary characters.

Whereas in DS9 you had Quark going to Ferenginar, Kira sometimes visiting Bajor, Odo and the Great Link, plus a whole of other secondary characters. I just felt DS9 got to visit many more worlds and seemed to visualize them better than TNG did.
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Old September 16 2012, 05:58 PM   #42
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

Ln X wrote: View Post
TNG had continuity alright just not such grand story arcs or DS9's rich structure. Ironically TNG was more of a closed-in show than DS9 was since TNG was confined to the ship and all the main characters were confined to it as where most of the secondary characters.

Whereas in DS9 you had Quark going to Ferenginar, Kira sometimes visiting Bajor, Odo and the Great Link, plus a whole of other secondary characters. I just felt DS9 got to visit many more worlds and seemed to visualize them better than TNG did.
Well TNG definitely visited more worlds, you can't deny that being there was almost literally a new alien every other week. But DS9 fleshed those worlds out.

In TNG the Ferengi were just after profit, the Cardassians were another generic bad guy and the Bajorians just a race of refugees. While all true, DS9 explored what -really- makes the Ferengi society tick and the holes in their philosophy. The Cardassians became a hugely complicated race, that was almost sympathetic at times as to why their became expansionalist and the Bajorians became a complicated and diverse people with many different facets both religious and political.

Also, TNG was more episodic and limited to that. You literally could reorder the vast majority of TNG's episodes just on whim and it really wouldn't impact much. The big points like the Borg episodes, Worf's Klingon arc and the such you'd have to keep roughly where they are, but for the most part it is fly off and deal with random problem of the week and never see/hear from it again.
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Old September 18 2012, 05:32 PM   #43
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

The best is a matter of opinion, depending on what people are looking for in a show. I do believe it was the most complex and 'grown up' show and is my favorite.
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Old September 19 2012, 02:02 PM   #44
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

is star trek DS9 best star trek series
It absolutely is.
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Old October 4 2012, 07:53 AM   #45
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Re: is star trek DS9 best star trek series

DS9 is the best.

And it can't be the worst. Sure, one could say it was the worst of the good Trek series, but it can't be the worst overall as long as VOY and ENT still exist.
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