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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old September 2 2012, 01:23 AM   #76
Maurice
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

Christopher wrote: View Post
Looks gray to me in that shot, and in the others I've seen.
The model was green. I can see it in the film.

There're also some discussions about the original series model being a two-tone gray and green paintjob, as per these notes on Hobby Talk

Post referring to the history of the models built by AMT for the show.


"Scott "Captain Cardboard" Alexander on the colors of the model as deliver to the NASM
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Old September 2 2012, 03:47 AM   #77
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

To be fair it's a very gray green.
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Old September 2 2012, 04:09 AM   #78
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

Yes, it's a very different and much subtler shade than the one that became standard from the BoP onward. Not all greens are created equal. Green is actually my favorite color; that's why the heroine of my upcoming novel is named Emerald and is wearing a green top and boots on the cover. But some shades of green look nice and others look ugly. I don't like "Klingon-ship green."
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Old September 10 2012, 06:55 PM   #79
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

Carcazoid wrote: View Post
Dick_Valentine wrote: View Post
old people ...
You should respect "old people" because you might live to be one someday and then you'll have to listen to all the disrespectful young punks bitching and moaning about how stupid old people are and you'll yell at them to get off your lawn ... I can almost guarantee it.
What makes a young person's moaning any better or worse than an old person's moaning. What age you are is not the deciding factor in the validity of your opinion. The fact is, older people are used to model shots rather than that newfangled computer stuff, and younger people are accustomed to CG effects instead of that stupid old rubbish.
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Old September 10 2012, 07:12 PM   #80
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

^It's not that simple, because not all CGI is alike. CGI can be great if it's got enough time and money and talent going into it; for instance, I found the virtual sets and scenery and creatures in Andrew Stanton's John Carter to be pretty much flawless and stunning. But it's not at all easy to get CGI to look realistic, and if the time or money or talent isn't there, the results are not going to look as good as a well-done model shot. (And part of the reason JC's effects looked so good is that Stanton shot them as if they were live action, with restrained, physically believable camera moves, rather than the showy swooping about that makes so many CG shots look self-conscious and fake.)

In general, it's foolish to think a single technique is right for everything. The smart approach to visual effects is to make use of all the available tools in the kit, and pick the right tool for each job. There are still jobs for which miniatures work better than CGI -- which is why the CGI-laden Lord of the Rings trilogy made extensive use of miniatures for cities like Minas Tirith (not to mention full-size physical sets for a lot of things that most productions would fake with miniatures or CG). One of the ways CGI can be misused is relying on it too exclusively, using it for shots that can be more effectively done with a different technique.
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Old September 11 2012, 04:47 AM   #81
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

^ Well said.
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Old September 11 2012, 06:07 PM   #82
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

I have to say the CGI in the remastered eps was good all around, but I was really impressed by the D'Deridex reveal in "Neutral Zone". Perhaps it's just that I haven't "Neutral Zone" since the Season 1 DVD set came out, but I felt that the Warbird looked amazing. It seemed imposing, big and really well textured. There even appears to be a new design element, a sort of ripple or fold on the "wings" of the ship. I actually said "Whoa!" outloud upon seeing it. The CGI E-D looks good, though there are a few times I *know* it's a CGI ship and the illusion is shattered. But I have to say, the CGI is well integrated into the show and doesn't seem as alien as it does in TOS-R. (Not that TOS-R is bad, but you notice it more.)

Also, have we gotten a reason as to why that 2 seconds of Riker wasn't HD? Missing film I'm guessing.
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Old September 11 2012, 06:16 PM   #83
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Dick_Valentine wrote: View Post
ITT old people moan about CGI....and how it was better in the olden days when models were used...
Tell that to VFX guys, as they still choose real models over CGI at times.
CGI like model work has it's uses. Sure some CGI work can be better than models, but the reverse is also true it can be worse than model work.

I could pick two examples one model work and 1 CGI work, the space battles in Return of the Jedi (Model) and Revenge of The Sith (CGI). To me the former ROTJ is superior. But that's just me.
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Old September 11 2012, 07:45 PM   #84
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

BritishSeaPower wrote: View Post
I have to say the CGI in the remastered eps was good all around, but I was really impressed by the D'Deridex reveal in "Neutral Zone". Perhaps it's just that I haven't "Neutral Zone" since the Season 1 DVD set came out, but I felt that the Warbird looked amazing. It seemed imposing, big and really well textured. There even appears to be a new design element, a sort of ripple or fold on the "wings" of the ship. I actually said "Whoa!" outloud upon seeing it. The CGI E-D looks good, though there are a few times I *know* it's a CGI ship and the illusion is shattered. But I have to say, the CGI is well integrated into the show and doesn't seem as alien as it does in TOS-R. (Not that TOS-R is bad, but you notice it more.)

Also, have we gotten a reason as to why that 2 seconds of Riker wasn't HD? Missing film I'm guessing.
Missing film element for who knows what reasons.

It's important to point out that not all of the effects are being replaced in this, in fact most of them are NOT being replaced and are just the original film elements fully remastered.
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Old September 11 2012, 08:10 PM   #85
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

BritishSeaPower wrote: View Post
The CGI E-D looks good, though there are a few times I *know* it's a CGI ship and the illusion is shattered. But I have to say, the CGI is well integrated into the show and doesn't seem as alien as it does in TOS-R.
As Trekker4747 says, the ships here are not CGI. For TNG, unlike TOS, they still had the original film of the miniature photography used in creating TNG's effects, and have simply recomposited those film elements in HD. The only things that have been replaced were things that were created in low-resolution video the first time, like most of the planets, the starscapes, animation elements like phasers and transporter beams, or things that were CGI the first time like the Crystalline Entity. But the ships are the real physical models, the exact same footage that we've been seeing for 25 years, just in much higher resolution than we were able to see it before.
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Old September 11 2012, 08:16 PM   #86
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Re: Perfect example of what they SHOULD have done with the TNG-R FX

BritishSeaPower wrote: View Post
I have to say the CGI in the remastered eps was good all around, but I was really impressed by the D'Deridex reveal in "Neutral Zone". Perhaps it's just that I haven't "Neutral Zone" since the Season 1 DVD set came out, but I felt that the Warbird looked amazing. It seemed imposing, big and really well textured. There even appears to be a new design element, a sort of ripple or fold on the "wings" of the ship. I actually said "Whoa!" outloud upon seeing it. The CGI E-D looks good, though there are a few times I *know* it's a CGI ship and the illusion is shattered. But I have to say, the CGI is well integrated into the show and doesn't seem as alien as it does in TOS-R. (Not that TOS-R is bad, but you notice it more.)

Also, have we gotten a reason as to why that 2 seconds of Riker wasn't HD? Missing film I'm guessing.
Perhaps you weren't reading the press releases for TNG:HD but the original effects work is only being replaced when they can't find the original filmed elements. Season 1 only has 3 or 4 shots where they had to replicate a shot with CGI.

I would be interested to hear what shots you felt screamed CGI considering 99% of the effects are the original effects recomposited with modern technology. That romulan ship was original, not CGI.
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