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Old September 9 2012, 07:18 PM   #286
Drago-Kazov
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Re: The Newsroom.

What for? He's by no means a great President, but what has he done that is so outlandishly terrible that the show needs to call him out on it?
Staying in Afghanistan for example.

Watch the video FPAlpha posted, particularly the part from 5:15 on. It's hyperbolic, but it gets the points across.
Its a partisan rant.I listened to it.

They believe that Obama is a socialist out to turn America into a communist state when he's very much a centrist leader.
Plenty of people on the left belived that Bush was a fascist. i he was one Obama is a bigger one since he expanded the power of the executive branch.

They have a very poor grasp on reality, and that's why I consider them loony.
Most voters do, look at the terrible people who get elected all the time.

Qouting

They believe that 30 years of trickle-down economics that widened inequality didn't work because taxes for the rich are still too high.
Depends on how do youdefine rich. What do you consider is rich?

They believe that the budget deficit must be addressed now, while still believing that taxes must be cut at the same time. And
And they also want a muscular military. At the same time dems embraced the Bush foreign policy. People on both sides have cognitive dissonance.

nd a large number of them buy into a paranoid conspiracy theory that Obama isn't really an American.
Are there more then left wing 911 truthers?

Quoting foxhot posts:

He also said the Tea Party was lunatic fringe. Some of them whom I've heard in person seem to confirm that, such as the blonde-haired nutjob who screamed ''Obama is the devil'' to her five-year-old son.
Tere are plenty of nuts in both parties, especially considering that most voters are old and if this goes their metal wheel will start malfunctioning.

ut TGB didn't mention the entire modern Republican Party in its entirety. As Will McAvoy demonstrates, Republican is not necessarily synonymous with tea party. Even though McAvoy's a creation of a Democratic writer, there's still credence to that theory. I've come to think lately that Reps and Dems aren't the true problem, but conservatives and liberals. Reps and Dems will occcasionally listen......
I don't see him critcizing dems. David Frum does that and McAvoyis supposed to be a David Frum republican.
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Old September 9 2012, 09:05 PM   #287
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Re: The Newsroom.

I thought you stopped watching early on?

Anyway, it does make sense that the show focuses so much on the Tea Party and how it has come to dominate the Republicans because both Will and Charlie see them as a great danger. It's also an important part of the overall arc of the season because going after the Tea Party and the crazy Republicans is what gets Newsnight on Fiona's and Reese's bad side. It's also very plausible that Will would be so invested in pursuing this because he's himself a Republican (a moderate/liberal one) and sees his party taken over and shift to the right.
Also, let's keep in mind that, all things considered, we only see very little of the actual Newsnight content, considering it's about 45 minutes long each weeknight. The show can only show a small selection of what they did.

Also, there was minor criticism of Obama's reaction to the Deepwater Horizon spill, though it wasn't on the news show (Gary and Kendra were arguing about it). I suppose, the show where they talked about the development of gun laws under the Obama administration can also be seen as criticism even though on Newsnight it was only used to show how Republicans/the NRA/conservatives were lying about it. Will saw it that way as well, but his date (Sloan's crazy friend with the gun and the marijuana in her handbag) thought that they had come out against guns.

Lastly, it's a romantic comedy with some drama and a politcal slant. They are in no way obligated to be balanced or even accurate.
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Old September 9 2012, 10:21 PM   #288
Locutus of Bored
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Re: The Newsroom.

Count Zero wrote: View Post
It's also very plausible that Will would be so invested in pursuing this because he's himself a Republican (a moderate/liberal one) and sees his party taken over and shift to the right.
That's key right there. Will is representing people like respected six-term Indiana Senator Dick Lugar, who was ousted by a Tea Party candidate despite his conservative leanings because he readily worked with and compromised with the opposition party like a politician is supposed to do. Lugar is moderate by the standards of the current extremist Republican Party, but he's not really that moderate, and yet the Tea Party considered him a threat to their way of thinking that needed to be taken out.

It shouldn't be a partisan issue. The Tea Party represents more of a threat to the Republican Party than they do to the Democrats, and moderate Republicans shouldn't just circle the wagons around a perceived attack against their party, because the attack is coming from inside the circle.
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Old September 10 2012, 06:19 AM   #289
Drago-Kazov
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Re: The Newsroom.

It shouldn't be a partisan issue. The Tea Party represents more of a threat to the Republican Party than they do to the Democrats, and moderate Republicans shouldn't just circle the wagons around a perceived attack against their party, because the attack is coming from inside the circle.
____________
Hawkish dems represent a threat to the dems, nobody is complaining about that. Isn't a Tea party just going back to the reeots after the compassionate conservativism of Bush?

That's key right there. Will is representing people like respected six-term Indiana Senator Dick Lugar,
Lugar is not in the House of Lords, his retirement is not a tragedy.

Count Zero posted:

I thought you stopped watching early on?
I would tune in if i could some more machiavellian realism like in the Wire.

Lastly, it's a romantic comedy with some drama and a politcal slant. They are in no way obligated to be balanced or even accurate.
Tt's not a law but making a partisan hack show is much more easier then making one that takes a deeper look at US politics.

Charlie see them as a great danger. It's also an important part of the overall arc of the season because going after the Tea Party and the crazy Republicans is what gets Newsnight on Fiona's and Reese's bad side. It's also very plausible that Will would be so invested in pursuing this because he's himself a Republican (a moderate/liberal one) and sees his party taken over and shift to the right.
Italso would make sense to criticize the democrats because they are governing, therefore abusing their power the same the Bush admin did it.

Also, there was minor criticism of Obama's reaction to the Deepwater Horizon spill, though it wasn't on the news show (Gary and Kendra were arguing about it). I suppose, the show where they talked about the development of gun laws under the Obama administration can also be seen as criticism even though on Newsnight it was only used to show how Republicans/the NRA/conservatives were lying about it. Will saw it that way as well, but his date (Sloan's crazy friend with the gun and the marijuana in her handbag) thought that they had come out against guns.
Nice to know they can do that before going on air and acting like Chris Matthews instead of let's say Cenk Uygur or Dylan Ratigan.
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Old September 10 2012, 07:24 AM   #290
Locutus of Bored
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Re: The Newsroom.

Drago-Kazov wrote: View Post
It shouldn't be a partisan issue. The Tea Party represents more of a threat to the Republican Party than they do to the Democrats, and moderate Republicans shouldn't just circle the wagons around a perceived attack against their party, because the attack is coming from inside the circle.
Hawkish dems represent a threat to the dems, nobody is complaining about that. Isn't a Tea party just going back to the reeots after the compassionate conservativism of Bush?
No one is complaining because no left wing analog to the Tea Party exists. What faction of the Democratic Party compares in size, scope, organization, and mission to the Tea Party and where are the 45 Congressional votes they represent?

That's key right there. Will is representing people like respected six-term Indiana Senator Dick Lugar,
Lugar is not in the House of Lords, his retirement is not a tragedy.
That is not a rebuttal to anything I said in the slightest. It's a meaningless comment.

If you just want to discuss politics (or just throw out more platitudes about the GOP and Democrats), come on down to the election subforum of TNZ and discuss it to your heart's content.
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Old September 10 2012, 07:48 AM   #291
Drago-Kazov
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Re: The Newsroom.

No one is complaining because no left wing analog to the Tea Party exists. What faction of the Democratic Party compares in size, scope, organization, and mission to the Tea Party and where are the 45 Congressional votes they represent?
As far as i am concerned the Obama foreign policy is incredibly dangerous and they are more of a threat to the country then the Tea Party. The dems have tho government which scares me more then the Tea Party. They are well organised and not wery to nice.


About the Lugar thing. Like i said he should be willing to criticize dems on air like David Frum. If he is unwiling to do so he is probably a dem mascarading as a Frum Republican.

Does the TNZ has different rules? Do you have to put in a special request?
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Old September 10 2012, 08:02 AM   #292
Locutus of Bored
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Re: The Newsroom.

Drago-Kazov wrote: View Post
As far as i am concerned the Obama foreign policy is incredibly dangerous and they are more of a threat to the country then the Tea Party. The dems have tho government which scares me more then the Tea Party. They are well organised and not wery to nice.
Which parts of Obama's foreign policy agenda are you so afraid of and how are they more dangerous than some of the rhetoric the extreme right has used toward say Iran and Russia?

You know, on second thought, never mind. This is getting too far away from a discussion about the show and into just a regular political discussion.

About the Lugar thing. Like i said he should be willing to criticize dems on air like David Frum. If he is unwiling to do so he is probably a dem mascarading as a Frum Republican.
You know it's just a drama series and not a real news program, right?

And again I see little relation between the Lugar comment and what follows. I gave you a reason why MacAvoy was going after the Tea Party and what faction of the Republican Party he supposedly represents. Now, the show is written by a very liberal writer, so granted he exhibits relatively few Republican traits, but I'm telling you what he's supposed to represent within the context of the series: a moderate old school Republican.

Does the TNZ has different rules? Do you have to put in a special request?
Go to User CP > Group Memberships > The Neutral Zone and select Join Group.
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Old September 10 2012, 01:45 PM   #293
Australis
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Re: The Newsroom.

Why the Left worries about the Right (nutbag division):

http://watchingthewatchers.org/news/...oup-calls-bush
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Old September 10 2012, 11:49 PM   #294
Drago-Kazov
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Re: The Newsroom.

but I'm telling you what he's supposed to represent within the context of the series: a moderate old school Republican.
Howard the Duck was supposed to be a great moviie that does not mean its a great movie.

Why the Left worries about the Right (nutbag division):
Plenty reasons to be afraid of both sides. Obama campaing advisor Zbigniew Bzerzinski has some interesting ideas about a new Technochratic Age.
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Old September 10 2012, 11:53 PM   #295
Guy Gardener
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Re: The Newsroom.



Howard the Duck is an awesome movie!
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Old September 11 2012, 01:38 PM   #296
foxhot
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Re: The Newsroom.

Everything SEEMS awesome when you're ten. In my day, LAND OF THE GIANTS was the bomb.
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Old September 11 2012, 03:29 PM   #297
TheGodBen
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Re: The Newsroom.

foxhot wrote: View Post
TheGodBen said the modern Democratic Party was centrist.
That could depend on which specific and current Democrats in power we're referring to.
Obama is the President and leader of the Democratic party, and he is a centrist. Sure, there are some left-wing Democrats, and some could be described as being just as loony as the Tea party but in a different way, but those people don't have as much influence or control over the Democratic party as the Tea party do over the Republican party.

Also keep in mind that I view American politics from a European perspective, and in Europe the Democrats would be a centre/centre-right party while Republicans would be right/far-right.

But TGB didn't mention the entire modern Republican Party in its entirety.
Yes, I didn't because I wasn't talking about them, I was talking about the Tea party.


Drago-Kazov wrote: View Post
Plenty of people on the left belived that Bush was a fascist. i he was one Obama is a bigger one since he expanded the power of the executive branch.
And those that called Bush a fascist were wrong and deserved to be called out for lowering the tone of important discussions, same as those doing it to Obama. Fascist is a word that has a meaning, and while I really disliked Bush, he did not fit the definition of a fascist.

Just to be clear, while I agree with a lot of what Will says about the Tea party in that clip, I disliked his use of the phrase American Taliban for the same reason.

Depends on how do youdefine rich. What do you consider is rich?
There are degrees of wealth, but I think it's fair to assume that most would agree that those earning over 250,000 a year are rich. That's not my personal bottom line.

Are there more then left wing 911 truthers?
Does the Democratic party pander to those loons? Do those loons successfully mount primary challenges to moderate Democrats to get 9/11 truthers into Congress? Does Obama make jokes alluding to the fact that the US government was behind 9/11?


I personally believe that The Newsroom should be doing a far better job at presenting Will's supposed conservative positions because right now there's very little of that and he comes across as a liberal on most issues. But being a conservative doesn't mean wildly bashing liberals, and being a Republican doesn't mean mindlessly attacking Democrats for disagreeing with them on issues. And vice versa. That's not the way representative democracy is supposed to work.
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Old September 12 2012, 12:51 PM   #298
Australis
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Re: The Newsroom.

^ While I am way to the left on most issues, I agree that Will's Republican beliefs should be better expressed, it could only improve the level of debate on the show and hopefully in the wider community, or at least in those who watch it.
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Old September 12 2012, 01:10 PM   #299
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Re: The Newsroom.

I don't know if it is needed to expressly show Will's "conservatism".

He is a center/moderate Republican but in todays US political climate that equals as liberal.. he might as well be a Democrat given most of his stances and convictions.

In one episode he even says that he's only a Republican because of where he was born and that he met his first Democrat at college. I think for him party affiliation is less important.. it is about politics and what you think is best for the country.
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Old September 13 2012, 09:24 AM   #300
Drago-Kazov
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Re: The Newsroom.

The GodBen posted:
But being a conservative doesn't mean wildly bashing liberals, and being a Republican doesn't mean mindlessly attacking Democrats for disagreeing with them on issues. And vice versa. That's not the way representative democracy is supposed to work.
I do not advocate partisan hackery.

Does the Democratic party pander to those loons? Do those loons successfully mount primary challenges to moderate Democrats to get 9/11 truthers into Congress? Does Obama make jokes alluding to the fact that the US government was behind 9/11?
Isn't Cynthia McKinney a truther?

And there is this news:
Alison Pill of 'Newsroom' Topless

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or1NG7LUAkM&feature=plcp
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