7X01 Asylum Of The Daleks (Grading/Discussion) (SPOILERS!)

[Emh]

I haven't read the rest of the thread (yet) but I loved this episode. Through and through. Easily the best Dalek episode since "Dalek" and one of Moffat's best episodes in recent time.

Some people went into this expecting a masturbatory "Every Dalek but the Kitchen Sink Dalek" overblown, nonsensical thrill ride to give RTD a run for his money. Instead I found this to be a quieter, atmospheric, more personal story, a story that the Daleks richly deserve, one which they haven't gotten since "Dalek" (or Big Finish's I, Davros).

Were all of the Daleks we've ever seen in the history of show in it? Yes, they were, but they weren't in your face "Look at us! We're all of the Daleks ever!" Instead they were just there. An asylum planet full of broken Daleks and Daleks defeated by The Doctor was the perfect way of getting away with that.

At first, I wasn't sure if I liked the idea of humanoid Daleks (I read about this appearance before I saw the episode), especially after the disaster that was "Daleks in Manhattan"/"Evolution of the Daleks," but I found them to be effectively creepy and reasonably believable (as believable as one can be in Doctor Who).

As for the Rory/Amy conflict, I didn't like it at first because I thought it was going to be an unnecessary divide to create conflict and then have them slowly fall in love with each other in the upcoming episode. However, once Amy and Rory argued about the split and we learned what led to it, it felt a bit more natural and fit fairly well with the episode. I'm still not sure if it was necessary but I'm willing to accept it as long as we're back to Amy and Rory being a couple (but with things to work out obviously).

And now for Oswin. Simply said, I adore her. But I'm a sucker for a brunette in a red dress wearing red trainers and a utility belt. I mean, who isn't? Then you through in the dimples and the whimsical wit, you've got yourself a winning character. I'm not sure why, but she felt like a Big Finish companion. I can't give any rhyme or reason for it, but it was a random thought I had during the episode. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by her ultimate fate. I certainly didn't expect her to be properly rescued considering that we know she doesn't become a full-fledged companion until the Christmas episode. Nonetheless, I was shocked by the revelation that she was a Dalek and a shed a tear regarding her fate.

One side thought: I loved the reference to Barbara when we see The Doctor through the Dalek's eyestalk and he throws his arms all around the door frame.

One final thought (I swear!): I loved the twist of Oswin wiping the memories of The Doctor from all of the Daleks' minds. Hopefully this will play into the more low-key Doctor that was set-up the end of last season.

[Gov Kodos]

I was amused by the Doctor's single minded hatred of the Daleks, commented on at the Parliament, shown dramatically in the wake of convincing Oswin she'd been converted into a Dalek. The look of on his face was great, 'What did I do that for?' as she started with the 'Exterminate' line.

[Ghost Bones]

Gov Kodos wrote:

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Then have the self respect to look at yourself. Continue as you do and get the reactions you have been getting. You wish people would talk about your opinions, then try being more civil. Continue with the constant over the top internet tough act and passive aggressiveness and your opinions will be ignored for your persona, which seems more likely what you want as your unwillingness to learn from posters comments demonstrates.

People are responsible for their own reactions, I'm not going to sugarcoat my opinions. "Then have the self respect to look at yourself." Likewise.

[Guy Gardener]

Do Daleks have gender?

How do they reproduce?

Cloning?

So.

This Parliament recovered the massive Dalek Army the Doctor buried under all that molten ice on Spidiron?

So that's the idea behind this massive Dalek civilization, find the fallen, nurse them back to health until they can sic balls?

I mean with time travel, even time scoops at work, they can totally freejack all the lost causes they left for dead the first time around.

[Emh]

ROBE wrote:

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Well that was BRILLIANT!
The now lost Second Doctor first story The Power of the Daleks was set on Vulcan.

Oh, good catch there. I completely forgot about that.

Alidar Jarok wrote:

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BTW, I did get a Zoe vibe from Oswin. Glad I'm not the only one.

I didn't think of Zoe but I can definitely see the similarities.

Lonemagpie wrote:

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Brilliant!

Holdfast wrote:

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BTW, not being immersed in Who fandom, this has probably been discussed ad infinitum already, but I did chuckle at the name of the pretty new companion: IIRC from history class, Oswin translates to "friend/ally of god" and Oswald to "having the power of god". Calling a Doctor's companion "God's friend" is quite a cheeky little wink.

Oh, that's a cool insight. Thanks for sharing that.

[Green Lantern]

Was disapointed a bit by the lack of pre 2005 daleks, but overall it was enjoyable. One of the best Moffat episodes, but that's not much of an ahivement. Would have worked better as a two part episode, or as a RTD style arc. What do you think?

[Starkers]

Emh wrote:

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I haven't read the rest of the thread (yet) but I loved this episode. Through and through. Easily the best Dalek episode since "Dalek" and one of Moffat's best episodes in recent time.

Some people went into this expecting a masturbatory "Every Dalek but the Kitchen Sink Dalek" overblown, nonsensical thrill ride to give RTD a run for his money. Instead I found this to be a quieter, atmospheric, more personal story, a story that the Daleks richly deserve, one which they haven't gotten since "Dalek" (or Big Finish's I, Davros).

Were all of the Daleks we've ever seen in the history of show in it? Yes, they were, but they weren't in your face "Look at us! We're all of the Daleks ever!" Instead they were just there. An asylum planet full of broken Daleks and Daleks defeated by The Doctor was the perfect way of getting away with that.

At first, I wasn't sure if I liked the idea of humanoid Daleks (I read about this appearance before I saw the episode), especially after the disaster that was "Daleks in Manhattan"/"Evolution of the Daleks," but I found them to be effectively creepy and reasonably believable (as believable as one can be in Doctor Who).

As for the Rory/Amy conflict, I didn't like it at first because I thought it was going to be an unnecessary divide to create conflict and then have them slowly fall in love with each other in the upcoming episode. However, once Amy and Rory argued about the split and we learned what led to it, it felt a bit more natural and fit fairly well with the episode. I'm still not sure if it was necessary but I'm willing to accept it as long as we're back to Amy and Rory being a couple (but with things to work out obviously).

And now for Oswin. Simply said, I adore her. But I'm a sucker for a brunette in a red dress wearing red trainers and a utility belt. I mean, who isn't? Then you through in the dimples and the whimsical wit, you've got yourself a winning character. I'm not sure why, but she felt like a Big Finish companion. I can't give any rhyme or reason for it, but it was a random thought I had during the episode. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised by her ultimate fate. I certainly didn't expect her to be properly rescued considering that we know she doesn't become a full-fledged companion until the Christmas episode. Nonetheless, I was shocked by the revelation that she was a Dalek and a shed a tear regarding her fate.

One side thought: I loved the reference to Barbara when we see The Doctor through the Dalek's eyestalk and he throws his arms all around the door frame.

One final thought (I swear!): I loved the twist of Oswin wiping the memories of The Doctor from all of the Daleks' minds. Hopefully this will play into the more low-key Doctor that was set-up the end of last season.

Yeah I think overall it was a far subtler episode than many were expecting, but I don't think that was a bad thing. I think it felt very second Doctor'y, don't know if anyone else got that vibe...helps that Jena came across somewhat Zoe like.

It's odd, when I saw the first pics of her I didn't think she was my type, and seeing her interviewed didn't fill me with hope, but actually finally seeing her in character I thought she was great, adorable and it'll be nice to have a proper genius companion again...always assuming it is her and now her great grandmother or anything!

and yeah I like the notion of the Daleks not having a clue who the Doctor is. Moffat wasn't kidding about this low profile bit...

[Steve Mollmann]

Did the Daleks manage to exterminate anyone during this episode? I'm trying to think of an example, but I can't-- everyone dead was dead before it began!

[Starkers]

Steve Mollmann wrote:

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Did the Daleks manage to exterminate anyone during this episode? I'm trying to think of an example, but I can't-- everyone dead was dead before it began!

I think you're right. I wonder if this is a first?

[Australis]

On a slightly different topic, we in Oz were able to see this legally about an hour after it had been shown in the UK via the ABC online viewer. In 24 hours, about 80,000 of us did so, the most ever.

[Haggis and tatties]

I thought Moffet managed to give the Daleks back some of their original menace....i loved the Daleks waking up and trying to say EXTERMINATE!!!.

[Rosalind]

Australis wrote:

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On a slightly different topic, we in Oz were able to see this legally about an hour after it had been shown in the UK via the ABC online viewer. In 24 hours, about 80,000 of us did so, the most ever.

Wow, that's impressive, so about 10% if the normal audience number? Good on Auntie for making it available.

[marillion]

That was amazing.. Not much to add that hasn't been stated here already but this, THIS was the Dalek episode I've been waiting for... Great all around!!

[Alidar Jarok]

Ghost Bones wrote:

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Well presumably you do because there's an obvious difference between the meaning of a parliament of owls and a parliament in this context. A mod (I assume that's what the green name indicates) calling reasonable criticism of a TV show "bitching" says a lot.

I generally call nitpicking bitching. Your complaints about the plot of the episode are valid, but this is just nitpicking. My point with the Owls is that you haven't any idea what the Dalek Parliament constitutes and neither do I.

Do me a favor. Go to the main Doctor Who page. Scroll down to moderators. Then come back here.

[Starkers]

The history of Who (of most sci-fi in fact) is replete with alien races using human terms/titles, but they rarely mean the same thing as they do on Earth.

The Daleks also had an Emperor, the Timelords had a President and a Castellan and a Chancellor, the Sontarans have generals and commanders…

The word parliament comes from the French parler, which means to talk or to discuss. So rather than imagine this is a Dalek Westminster, perhaps it’s just the Skaro University debating society?





(And yes I cribbed that last bit from Wikipedia…well apart from the Skaro University debating society obviously )