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Old August 28 2012, 11:33 AM   #16
teacock
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

EmoBorg wrote: View Post
According to scientists, the first sex to develop was female. The male gender then developed from the female sex. That is why males have nipples because females are the default sex in nature and males developed from that. The Borg collective has a female leader maybe because it is the default gender.

Females are the first sex/gender according to scientific research. Eve came before Adam in the real world.
I like this. In their search for perfection the Borg start with the first gender from which the other gender(s) develop.
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Old August 28 2012, 11:44 AM   #17
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

teacake wrote: View Post
Tiberius wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Is the gender of the central borg important like with bees?They need a coordinating leader for the hive but I don't see why that leader needs to be female. Even if the female hormones were amping something up plenty of assimilated race wouldn't even have the same hormone receptivity.
The Borg Queen is a mind that is formed from all the drones being connected together, just the way that your mind is formed from all your brain cells connected together.

By itself a brain cell has no gender identity, and neither does a drone.

But when you connect a lot of brain cells together, it forms a mind that DOES have a gender identity.

Likewise, the mind formed from all the drones connected together, has a gender identity, and it is female. The Borg Queen. There is no Borg King because there are no drones available to form another mind. All the drones available are being used as part of the Queen's mind.
I didn't mean a king in addition to a queen, I meant a king instead of a queen.
Sorry. The thread title threw me. Sounds like you were asking if there could be a king in addition to the queen, not instead of the queen.

And we know it's a female mind because every single time it's chosen to use a body to represent itself (controlling it like a puppet), it has chosen a female body.
But why is the gender identity always female?
What do you mean, always?

It's always the same queen we are seeing, because it's always the same mind that is controlling it. And that mind just happens to be a female in the same way as Amber Benson happens to be a female. It's just an emergent property.
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Old August 28 2012, 11:44 AM   #18
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

Maurice wrote: View Post
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I read somewhere that the borg were originally meant to look something like insects. In the end, TPTB decided against using so much of the budget for CGI.
CGI? CGI to create aliens? In 1989? On TV? Not a chance.
*coughcrystallineentitycough*
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Old August 28 2012, 11:53 AM   #19
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

Well there's no king in bee hives either.
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Old August 28 2012, 11:57 AM   #20
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

teacake wrote: View Post
But why is the gender identity always female?
The only reason I could ever come up with was the "perfection" of the arrangement of the chromosomes in the female gene.

But then one has to wonder do all females of all alian races have this arrangement? Well no because not all Terrian species have the odd pairing of chromosomes ending in a male.

In birds, the opposite is true: the male is the homogameticsex, having two Z chromosomes (ZZ), and the female (hen) is hetergametics, having one Z and one W chromosome (ZW).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_linkage

I see no reason that there wouldn't have been Borg Kings. Maybe we only saw Queens.

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Well there's no king in bee hives either.

Well yes there is but he only serves one purpose and quickly dies afterward.
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Old August 28 2012, 12:06 PM   #21
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

Prosthetics or puppets.

But yeah, what they chose was a lot cheaper than wrapping dozens of actors each in 60 pounds of latex with anamatronic wibbly bits.
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Old August 28 2012, 12:15 PM   #22
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

The thing about the Borg Queen is, I think, the following:

The Borg Collective, the Hive Mind, is one single individual. That individual is represented by the Queen. She says to Data: I am the Borg. And as the Borg, she has always been lonely. Then she found Picard, who was about to be assimilated. But she wanted to make him more than just a simple drone so that she wasn't alone anymore. So in a way, he would have been a Borg King, but not quite.
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Old August 28 2012, 02:10 PM   #23
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

Maurice wrote: View Post
spot_loves_data wrote: View Post
I read somewhere that the borg were originally meant to look something like insects. In the end, TPTB decided against using so much of the budget for CGI.
CGI? CGI to create aliens? In 1989? On TV? Not a chance.
I'm not sure if you're kidding here.

Voyager started in 1995 and they used lots of CGI. There was CGI in every episode if you count the opening credits. And, of course, Species 8472 was CGI.
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Old August 28 2012, 02:24 PM   #24
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

R. Star wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post

But why is the gender identity always female?
If you go by the Destiny novels, it's because the being who created the Collective was female.
And so was the first drone, I believe.



Note that there was going to be an episode of Enterprise which would have starred Alice Krige as a Starfleet doctor who is assimilated and becomes the Queen. But they dropped that.

I guess there's no reason why the regular universe Borg couldn't have had a King. Just comes down to 'who came first' and thus the Borg used them as a template.
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Old August 28 2012, 02:59 PM   #25
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
Note that there was going to be an episode of Enterprise which would have starred Alice Krige as a Starfleet doctor who is assimilated and becomes the Queen. But they dropped that.
Yeah, that's a small mercy I think.
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Old August 28 2012, 03:10 PM   #26
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

teacake wrote: View Post
...They need a coordinating leader for the hive...
They could call him "Norman" and all plead, "Norman, coordinate!"
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Old August 28 2012, 10:50 PM   #27
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

R. Star wrote: View Post
Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
Note that there was going to be an episode of Enterprise which would have starred Alice Krige as a Starfleet doctor who is assimilated and becomes the Queen. But they dropped that.
Yeah, that's a small mercy I think.
Especially since the BQ talks about "my species" to Janeway as if she is not a human.

Jeri wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
...They need a coordinating leader for the hive...
They could call him "Norman" and all plead, "Norman, coordinate!"
heh.. I like how they are more circuits and flesh than visible machines.
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Old September 2 2012, 09:49 AM   #28
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

spot_loves_data wrote: View Post
Maurice wrote: View Post
spot_loves_data wrote: View Post
I read somewhere that the borg were originally meant to look something like insects. In the end, TPTB decided against using so much of the budget for CGI.
CGI? CGI to create aliens? In 1989? On TV? Not a chance.
I'm not sure if you're kidding here.

Voyager started in 1995 and they used lots of CGI. There was CGI in every episode if you count the opening credits. And, of course, Species 8472 was CGI.
And I'm not sure if YOU are kidding. The Borg aren't a creation of Voyager, but were introduced years before in The Next Generation, back when CGI wasn't really all that feasable on a TV budget.
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Old September 2 2012, 10:27 AM   #29
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

I'm thinking about Burger king.

Synergy and crosspromotion.

Imagne that factory serving cube shaped hamburgers.

The Burger king gets assimilated and turns in the Borger King.

Then in the ads, you have Janeway or Picard (Sisko saying you killed my wife you damn dirty hamburger, is a bit rough.) firing on the hamburger cubes, and the weapons bloke says, phaser fire is ineffective sir, we're just making them more delicious.
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Old September 2 2012, 11:03 AM   #30
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Re: Could there be a Borg King?

I think Wendy's had square hamburgers. If you buy enough of them and pile them on top of each other you would get a cube.
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