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Old August 31 2012, 09:31 AM   #196
teacake
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Do you really expect a truly alien species, one that evolved completely independent of Earth would be in any way psychologically similar to us?
This is where god comes into it.
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Old August 31 2012, 09:50 AM   #197
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Re: Ancient Aliens

teacake wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Do you really expect a truly alien species, one that evolved completely independent of Earth would be in any way psychologically similar to us?
This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
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Old August 31 2012, 09:53 AM   #198
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Re: Ancient Aliens

teacake wrote: View Post
The Castellan wrote: View Post
Well, if you were abducted by aliens, there's nothing to be ashamed of....just because folks make Cartman jokes or whatever....guess what....those folks who make the jokes are often the ones plopped in front of the TV, melting thei brains with American Idol, TMZ, and Sunday afternoon football while stuffing partially hydrogenated soybean oil and monosodium glutimate into their pie holes.
I'm actually pretty fond of monosodium glutimate which was developed by the Japanese from seaweed. It's been demonized unfairly. Don't eat it if you fear it, but I find it quite buzzy myself.

Now, keep in mind I am sure there's good aliens, and then there's bad aliens....the anicent aliens show even goes over that topic. And not all abductions are bad, many folks also had good things come from it happening. Also, you mightbe scared for just fear of the unknown.....fear's the ultimiate poison....but it can be controlled.

Personally, I envy you and would LOVE to have the aliens come by and pay me a visit. In fact, I am planning to soon start designing my own Nazca line type picture on my property, and using mathematical and sacred geometry as a basis for it.
What good things have people had happen to them?

Wait, I already know the answer to that, I live in Hippy Country. Yeah yeah, messages of peace and good will about the coming third age of somethingorother.
From my own studies, there's at least 100 different aliens stoping by here, and the greys are just one of those.
Why would they want to come here if they have interstellar travel? We are dull.

To answer in that order:

Monosodium Glutimate gives me incredible headaches.

Those folks first learned they are not alone. Some were even taken for a joy ride throughout space (hell, the book of Enock, which was conveniantly taken out from the bible, big suprise, I think might have actually been one of the oldest alien abductions, if it happened.) and shown what's there. And some even developed strong physchic abilities and empathetic powers Both me and my mom think she's an abductee, because she has had times where she felt she lost time, and often wakes up in the morning with odd puncture like marks on the inner elbow in this patten
:::: and she has no clue where they came from, plus she has some weird object behind her ear, akin to an implant.
I've watched videos of a doctor trying to remove a person's implant, and the darned thing actually moved away from the doctor's extraction tools. Plus many times the implants that are collected are made of materials they can't even recognize often and so on.

Nothing wrong with peace and good will, I know that sickens some folks, but why not give it a try, ya dig?

To observe us, learn about us, maybe even give us a helping hand, maybe they influenced us, or even effected our evolution. Scientists keep trying to find that missing link between us and olde hominids, it's possible genetic manipulation was done, we're just learning it now, imagine what a millon/billion year old civilization could do? I mean if Star Trek (lay off Deckard ) can have stories about people in space ships searching for and observing strange new life, and new civilizations, why could there not be a real thing out there by some advanced, civilized society? Hell, if I really wanted to use an episode in comparison, I could see us at that civilization in the TNG episode "First Contact" or "Who watches the watchers"

I'm hoping to be able to head to a few different states and Mexico to study some of the unusual structures for myself, maybe even crack some puzzle of code if lucky. I'd also love to go to some of the crop circles.
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Old August 31 2012, 09:58 AM   #199
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Lulz.
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Old August 31 2012, 09:59 AM   #200
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Do you really expect a truly alien species, one that evolved completely independent of Earth would be in any way psychologically similar to us?
This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
I think if aliens are truly interacting with humans we need a cohesive theology to explain it.

This is not about the great computer behind every belief. It is about the belief that drives us to desire more than circuitry to be behind events. More than circuitry of the machine and more than circuitry of the brain. I'm speaking of a circuitry of the soul.

I would be interested to know if The Castellan thinks there is some kind of god who is god to both aliens and humanity.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:06 AM   #201
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Do you really expect a truly alien species, one that evolved completely independent of Earth would be in any way psychologically similar to us?
This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
Well, I want to to sit back and try to envision this, regardless what ya you think about my posts:

Picture that you were a primative person, say some shepard somewhere in Greece or whatever. A spaceship lands and outsteps these alien beings with incredible technology, I could easily see some of these people thinking those guys were gods. And if we were genetically manipulated or altered, maybe they used their own genes to make us, like the whole "we were created in god's image" Also, while still on the bible, one bit in Genesis always confused me was of being fruitful and replenishing the Earth....replenish what, though? It tells me there was once a state of plenishment, at some earlier time. Hell, one thing that annoys some folks is when I suggest their Christ might have been an alien...I mean he supposedly had all these gnarly powers, I could see some alien being do that. I say this since legends, myth and scriptures like that often have some hint of truth to them in some form.

Also, some of the other folks, like the Native Americans say not only were the sky people from the stars, but they themselves come from there, too. I talk often to the old Indian guys when they have their pow wows in my neck of the woods, and have conversations with them when possible, and they are probably the best examples of anicent aliens, and they themselves say so.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:07 AM   #202
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Re: Ancient Aliens

The Castellan wrote: View Post

Those folks first learned they are not alone. Some were even taken for a joy ride throughout space (hell, the book of Enock, which was conveniantly taken out from the bible, big suprise,
Not really, it is included in the Apocrypha and read by Catholics and Orthodox.
I think might have actually been one of the oldest alien abductions, if it happened.) and shown what's there. And some even developed strong physchic abilities and empathetic powers Both me and my mom think she's an abductee, because she has had times where she felt she lost time, and often wakes up in the morning with odd puncture like marks on the inner elbow in this patten
:::: and she has no clue where they came from, plus she has some weird object behind her ear, akin to an implant.
Okay I am NOT trying to slag off at your mom but my first thought was, puncture marks? Addict. Object behind ear? Tumor. Let's hope my cynicism is horribly off the mark.

I've watched videos of a doctor trying to remove a person's implant, and the darned thing actually moved away from the doctor's extraction tools. Plus many times the implants that are collected are made of materials they can't even recognize often and so on.
See.. there you trip up. Can't even recognize? I would like cites for that. The universe is ENORMOUS and I will never be one to say "there are no aliens" or even "people's weird ass stories are all crap". But we have many wonderful tools to test such claims and it does believers (any believers) cause good to happily test and provide proofs.
Nothing wrong with peace and good will, I know that sickens some folks, but why not give it a try, ya dig?

To observe us, learn about us, maybe even give us a helping hand, maybe they influenced us, or even effected our evolution. Scientists keep trying to find that missing link between us and olde hominids, it's possible genetic manipulation was done, we're just learning it now, imagine what a millon/billion year old civilization could do? I mean if Star Trek (lay off Deckard ) can have stories about people in space ships searching for and observing strange new life, and new civilizations, why could there not be a real thing out there by some advanced, civilized society? Hell, if I really wanted to use an episode in comparison, I could see us at that civilization in the TNG episode "First Contact" or "Who watches the watchers"

I'm hoping to be able to head to a few different states and Mexico to study some of the unusual structures for myself, maybe even crack some puzzle of code if lucky. I'd also love
to go to some of the crop circles.
Dude, crop circles have been utterly disproved. I would not waste your time. I am sure there are other mysteries which have far more oomph.

As to "helping hand" and "influenced us", where would you speculate this has happened? Because everything seems pretty fucked as it is. I think if they have no prime directive they should be stepping up the interference levels.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:14 AM   #203
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Re: Ancient Aliens

The Castellan wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post

This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
Well, I want to to sit back and try to envision this, regardless what ya you think about my posts:
Just to let you know, I may have my fun but I am not dissing your posts. I am genuinely interested in other people's beliefs and I am happy for people to share them.

Picture that you were a primative person, say some shepard somewhere in Greece or whatever. A spaceship lands and outsteps these alien beings with incredible technology, I could easily see some of these people thinking those guys were gods. And if we were genetically manipulated or altered, maybe they used their own genes to make us, like the whole "we were created in god's image" Also, while still on the bible, one bit in Genesis always confused me was of being fruitful and replenishing the Earth....replenish what, though? It tells me there was once a state of plenishment, at some earlier time.
The word means "fill". So it doesn't automatically refer to filling something that has depleted. Blame it on the KJV.

Hell, one thing that annoys some folks is when I suggest their Christ might have been an alien...I mean he supposedly had all these gnarly powers, I could see some alien being do that. I say this since legends, myth and scriptures like that often have some hint of truth to them in some form.

Also, some of the other folks, like the Native Americans say not only were the sky people from the stars, but they themselves come from there, too. I talk often to the old Indian guys when they have their pow wows in my neck of the woods, and have conversations with them when possible, and they are probably the best examples of anicent aliens, and they themselves say so.
So from this I get that.. you don't believe in a divine power? You think there is a naturalistic reason behind everything, even if that reason is aliens?
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Old August 31 2012, 10:25 AM   #204
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Re: Ancient Aliens

I think your 'even if' was superfluous, teacake.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:30 AM   #205
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Re: Ancient Aliens

teacake wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post

This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
I think if aliens are truly interacting with humans we need a cohesive theology to explain it.

This is not about the great computer behind every belief. It is about the belief that drives us to desire more than circuitry to be behind events. More than circuitry of the machine and more than circuitry of the brain. I'm speaking of a circuitry of the soul.

I would be interested to know if The Castellan thinks there is some kind of god who is god to both aliens and humanity.
To answer your question, I do not know. My own beliefs, I am spiritual, not religious....I believe in a high power, but not in the form of an angy old man sitting on top of a golden throne. I believe in higher powers and an afterlife, because one two occasions, I have seen what appears, as one might call a 'ghost' I saw a figure of a man who I learned was the father of a friend of mine, I described him perfectly she said, even down to his messy hair and favorite clothes, and I enver saw the guy when he was alive. Same for a girl in the grade school I went to in the 80's. Last year I saw her figure in a hallway during a rummage sale, and talked to a few of the women present, and I later was able to find the mother of this person and I pointed to a picture I found in the yeat book and it was that person. I enver seen the person, before either. And no, I do not use drugs, drink or other chemical substances if anyone was gonna ask.

Also, I kinda have, Decakrd's gonna have a ball with this one, with Picard's answer to the universe and death in a Where Sience had Lease

"Considering the marvelous complexity of the universe, its clockwork perfection, its balances of this against that, matter, energy, gravitation, time, dimension, I believe that our existence must be more than either of these philosophies. That what we are goes beyond Euclidean or other "practical" measuring systems, and that our existence is part of a reality beyond what we understand now as reality."

I believe in both science and spirituality needing to come together. I also believe there is SOMETHING beyond our plane of existence and that we are not merely going to be a pile of lifeless meat when we check out. I have seen so many strange and amazing things to think that all the universe and beyond consists of only taxes and a 6 foot hole in the ground and then there's nothing. All we claim to know is really just speculation on our parts.

With that out of the way, I got no clue about the gods the aliens worship, of they even worship one at all. But what I can say to religious folks (mainly bible belt Christians and Evangelicals) who got a problem with aliens....lemme tell you this....many religions, like the Native Americans, the Hindu, the Muslims, all believe in life out there in the stars, on other worlds.....and many priests in the colonial days of our county, and our founding Fathers, especially Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson believed in alien life....and even the Vatican, a few years ago, said that belief in alien life does NOT negate in the belief in god. Forthose who said alien life would destroy belief in God, mainly the Brookings Report fuckheads when NASA was being created (I always veiwed the Brookings Report as a corrupt, twisted, self imposed type of Trek's Prime Directive that needs to go) or that it would make us no longer 'special' or god's greatest creation....a few things:

1: If we are all there is, god sure has a small mind and limited power...plus vey impractical, due to the fact that the universe is a rather large place.
2: If we are god's greatest creation, he/she/it needs practise, since we are not doing so well, and he/she/it is flawed right there.
3: If anything, alien life should make your god GREATER and all that.
4: The bible belt folks have a whole new species to try and convert and 'save'.

I really don't know what theology, if any, the aliens have. Plus I don't know if they have them that if they have just one, or many.....if there is a god, it's possible he/she/it created us, if he/she/it created them as well. I have no clue.

Also, I feel that we have to know what the truth is, and I do not think the stock market will crumble or that religions will collapse or that we'll all go crazy and kill each other regarding the 100% abosolute truth regarding alien life is disclosed, and think we gotta do it and lets the chips fall where they may.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:34 AM   #206
Gov Kodos
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Re: Ancient Aliens

The Castellan wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post

This is where god comes into it.
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
Well, I want to to sit back and try to envision this, regardless what ya you think about my posts:

Picture that you were a primative person, say some shepard somewhere in Greece or whatever. A spaceship lands and outsteps these alien beings with incredible technology, I could easily see some of these people thinking those guys were gods. And if we were genetically manipulated or altered, maybe they used their own genes to make us, like the whole "we were created in god's image" Also, while still on the bible, one bit in Genesis always confused me was of being fruitful and replenishing the Earth....replenish what, though? It tells me there was once a state of plenishment, at some earlier time. Hell, one thing that annoys some folks is when I suggest their Christ might have been an alien...I mean he supposedly had all these gnarly powers, I could see some alien being do that. I say this since legends, myth and scriptures like that often have some hint of truth to them in some form.

Also, some of the other folks, like the Native Americans say not only were the sky people from the stars, but they themselves come from there, too. I talk often to the old Indian guys when they have their pow wows in my neck of the woods, and have conversations with them when possible, and they are probably the best examples of anicent aliens, and they themselves say so.
Surely, the native myths and that American Indians are human, make it more likely that the aliens aren't aliens, but an ancient advanced human civilization. They're knowledge of human psychology is why they stay intermittently involved with Earth. To let us evolve as much as possible with self determination, but interfering enough to keep the baser violent aspects of human nature to get the better of us. Thus the rare visits of 'gods' like Kukulkan, Krishna, Jesus, Buddha and other advanced society changing great minds of the past.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:35 AM   #207
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Deckerd wrote: View Post
I think your 'even if' was superfluous, teacake.
No, because the naturalistic reason could be evolution. He seems to be ascribing to aliens what had traditionally been ascribed to divinity. I was curious as to whether he had a belief in a god as well.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:43 AM   #208
The Castellan
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Re: Ancient Aliens

teacake wrote: View Post
The Castellan wrote: View Post

Those folks first learned they are not alone. Some were even taken for a joy ride throughout space (hell, the book of Enock, which was conveniantly taken out from the bible, big suprise,
Not really, it is included in the Apocrypha and read by Catholics and Orthodox.
I think might have actually been one of the oldest alien abductions, if it happened.) and shown what's there. And some even developed strong physchic abilities and empathetic powers Both me and my mom think she's an abductee, because she has had times where she felt she lost time, and often wakes up in the morning with odd puncture like marks on the inner elbow in this patten
:::: and she has no clue where they came from, plus she has some weird object behind her ear, akin to an implant.
Okay I am NOT trying to slag off at your mom but my first thought was, puncture marks? Addict. Object behind ear? Tumor. Let's hope my cynicism is horribly off the mark.

I've watched videos of a doctor trying to remove a person's implant, and the darned thing actually moved away from the doctor's extraction tools. Plus many times the implants that are collected are made of materials they can't even recognize often and so on.
See.. there you trip up. Can't even recognize? I would like cites for that. The universe is ENORMOUS and I will never be one to say "there are no aliens" or even "people's weird ass stories are all crap". But we have many wonderful tools to test such claims and it does believers (any believers) cause good to happily test and provide proofs.
Nothing wrong with peace and good will, I know that sickens some folks, but why not give it a try, ya dig?

To observe us, learn about us, maybe even give us a helping hand, maybe they influenced us, or even effected our evolution. Scientists keep trying to find that missing link between us and olde hominids, it's possible genetic manipulation was done, we're just learning it now, imagine what a millon/billion year old civilization could do? I mean if Star Trek (lay off Deckard ) can have stories about people in space ships searching for and observing strange new life, and new civilizations, why could there not be a real thing out there by some advanced, civilized society? Hell, if I really wanted to use an episode in comparison, I could see us at that civilization in the TNG episode "First Contact" or "Who watches the watchers"

I'm hoping to be able to head to a few different states and Mexico to study some of the unusual structures for myself, maybe even crack some puzzle of code if lucky. I'd also love
to go to some of the crop circles.
Dude, crop circles have been utterly disproved. I would not waste your time. I am sure there are other mysteries which have far more oomph.

As to "helping hand" and "influenced us", where would you speculate this has happened? Because everything seems pretty fucked as it is. I think if they have no prime directive they should be stepping up the interference levels.
Actually no, no proof was given, and I'l ltell you why.
Those two drunk elderly English guys only showed how to make a crudely made circle with a board and string.....yet, I look and read the interviews of these guys....and compare it to the amazing circles and formations showing incredible, mathmatical properties and tetrahedral geometry......I seriously think those two guys coould not even spell tetrahedron, let alone know any geometry. Also, their circles, besides crude and sloppy are nothing compared to the incredible ones I've seen for the past 20 years...plus if they did it, they never showed how to make these mega intricate circles, never shown. If they show how they do these, and inthe short time, often overnight, at which these appear...then I could consider them an answer. Also, if they admitted to doing it, why do they keep doing it is they are the guity ones?

Plus, like I said, I doubt a pair of old, tipsy English guys could make these:

http://www.earthfiles.com/images/new...heat082612.jpg

http://www.earthfiles.com/images/new...tern073012.jpg

http://www.earthfiles.com/images/new...gton072912.jpg
And given that now more and more are having binary coded messages, that even sheds more doubt on those old, drunken fools. Those designs above, plus many more I've seen sure give a lot of oooomph, if you ask me.

And as for intervention, I mentioned that many instances, made by people from the military, came foreward and talked about how they encountered UFO's that 'turned off' their nucealr misisle silos......I think that's pretty much a good deal of intervention on their part.....intervening when they really, really need to. It's like when you have 2 bratty kids ready to get into a fight, and each grabs a big, pointy stick. If you walked by them and saw this, if one is a responsible person, you'd go and stop the fight, and that their sticks from then. I think they've intervined many times.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:45 AM   #209
The Castellan
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Re: Ancient Aliens

Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
The Castellan wrote: View Post
Gov Kodos wrote: View Post
Would this be the alien god, or the god alien? I get them confused.
Well, I want to to sit back and try to envision this, regardless what ya you think about my posts:

Picture that you were a primative person, say some shepard somewhere in Greece or whatever. A spaceship lands and outsteps these alien beings with incredible technology, I could easily see some of these people thinking those guys were gods. And if we were genetically manipulated or altered, maybe they used their own genes to make us, like the whole "we were created in god's image" Also, while still on the bible, one bit in Genesis always confused me was of being fruitful and replenishing the Earth....replenish what, though? It tells me there was once a state of plenishment, at some earlier time. Hell, one thing that annoys some folks is when I suggest their Christ might have been an alien...I mean he supposedly had all these gnarly powers, I could see some alien being do that. I say this since legends, myth and scriptures like that often have some hint of truth to them in some form.

Also, some of the other folks, like the Native Americans say not only were the sky people from the stars, but they themselves come from there, too. I talk often to the old Indian guys when they have their pow wows in my neck of the woods, and have conversations with them when possible, and they are probably the best examples of anicent aliens, and they themselves say so.
Surely, the native myths and that American Indians are human, make it more likely that the aliens aren't aliens, but an ancient advanced human civilization. They're knowledge of human psychology is why they stay intermittently involved with Earth. To let us evolve as much as possible with self determination, but interfering enough to keep the baser violent aspects of human nature to get the better of us. Thus the rare visits of 'gods' like Kukulkan, Krishna, Jesus, Buddha and other advanced society changing great minds of the past.
Well, judging from cave painting, statues and so on, many of them were not human looking either. I am not saying it's not the case, but I don't see how that reason is more acceptible than an actual ET visitation.
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Old August 31 2012, 10:45 AM   #210
teacake
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Re: Ancient Aliens

The Castellan wrote: View Post
I have seen so many strange and amazing things to think that all the universe and beyond consists of only taxes and a 6 foot hole in the ground and then there's nothing. All we claim to know is really just speculation on our parts.
My personal theology is that the most important thing in our lives is relationships, whether that be lovers, children or some dude we chat to at the bus stop.
1: If we are all there is, god sure has a small mind and limited power...plus vey impractical, due to the fact that the universe is a rather large place.
2: If we are god's greatest creation, he/she/it needs practise, since we are not doing so well, and he/she/it is flawed right there.
3: If anything, alien life should make your god GREATER and all that.
4: The bible belt folks have a whole new species to try and convert and 'save'.
I absolutely agree with this. This is why I, naturally and perhaps narrowly skeptical about the existence of aliens cannot dismiss the possibility. It stems from a belief in something greater than what we see, perhaps no more than a faith or hope in such a thing. Whatever.. personal god, great net of energy, faux quantum physics.. they all point to it being rather more likely that there is someone out there than that there is not.

I answered this question recently when some troll IRL asked me if I believed in aliens (it was a dig at Star Trek):

If there IS a god, then what seems more likely, that we would be the only life god ever created or that in this vast universe god would have created more life?

If there IS nothing but evolution then what seems more likely, that we are the only planet that ever evolved life or that in this vast universe more life would have evolved?

So. I'm no believer but as far as the odds go I'm thinking we are not alone.
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