RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 140,901
Posts: 5,477,086
Members: 25,051
Currently online: 642
Newest member: GrammaticalFict

TrekToday headlines

New Star Trek Funko Pop! Vinyl Figures
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

QMx Mini Phaser Ornament
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

Stewart as Neo-Nazi Skinhead
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

Klingon Bloodwine To Debut
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Trek Actors In War Of The Worlds Fundraiser
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Star Trek: The Next Generation Gag Reel Tease
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24

Shatner In Haven
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24

Retro Review: Covenant
By: Michelle on Nov 22

Two Official Starships Collection Previews
By: T'Bonz on Nov 21

Saldana: Women Issues In Hollywood
By: T'Bonz on Nov 21


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy

Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old August 23 2012, 04:21 PM   #1081
Kegg
Rear Admiral
 
Kegg's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland.
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Brendan Moody wrote: View Post
Considering how little emphasis the scripts place on Ned and Jon, and given Bean's, er, less than nuanced acting style, I think they could have gotten away with not telling Bean, if they really wanted to keep it close to the vest.
Could have gotten away with? Sure.

David Prowse had no idea that Darth Vader was Luke's father when filming the scene where Vader tells him exactly that (instead having been told the key line was 'Obi-Wan killed your father.')

But if you want this detail to in any way inform how the actor behaves towards his 'son', then it's a good idea to tell him. Whether or not Sean Bean had no subtelty in his Ned Stark performance is hindsight. I thought the show handled it fairly well - Ned Stark is shown being very recitent when talking about Jon's mother with Robert Baratheon, for example.
__________________
'Spock is always right, even when he's wrong. It's the tone of voice, the supernatural reasonability; this is not a man like us; this is a god.'
- Philip K. Dick
Kegg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 04:47 PM   #1082
Brendan Moody
Vice Admiral
 
Brendan Moody's Avatar
 
Location: Maine
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

If you look back at the Vulture interview with Bean in which he made the comments we're discussing, he notes how Ned's behavior toward/about Jon could be dramatically justified whether Jon is his son or not. Exactly because the TV series is leaving it as an open question, and given that there are all of two scenes where it comes up, it would have been perfectly possible to tell Bean what Ned's attitude, is but not precisely why it exists, without noticeably affecting the result. But I suppose my belief that Bean invariably gives a stiff, barely-adequate performance no matter the background may be a factor here.
__________________
Egg, I dreamed I was old.
Brendan Moody is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 04:51 PM   #1083
Captaindemotion
Vice Admiral
 
Captaindemotion's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Brendan Moody wrote: View Post
But I suppose my belief that Bean invariably gives a stiff, barely-adequate performance no matter the background may be a factor here.
I've never been a big fan but I did like him in this and in LOTR. Fair enough, neither was a particularly subtle or demanding role but I thought that each played to his strengths and he brought the requisite authority and presence to the table.
__________________
Hodor!!!!!!!
Captaindemotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 05:15 PM   #1084
sidious618
Admiral
 
sidious618's Avatar
 
Location: New York, US
Send a message via AIM to sidious618
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

I thought Bean was phenomenal in Game of Thrones.
__________________
We've met before, haven't we?
sidious618 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 05:58 PM   #1085
137th Gebirg
Rear Admiral
 
137th Gebirg's Avatar
 
Location: Who is John Galt?
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Speaking of questionable parentage, what about that bizarre scene between Jaime and his Aunt Genna before he went to talk to Blackfish at Riverrun?

Unless I missed the subtext going on, it seemed to me that she implied that Tyrion was the only true son of Tywin, not Jaime; further implying that maybe Jaime (and, by birth, Cersei as well) are not Tywin's offspring. Is her statement supposed to be more of a metaphor, in that Jaime is nothing like Tywin as a person (good or bad), or does she hold some secret about their origins? That one really confused me and there has been no mention of it since.
__________________
Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.
137th Gebirg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 06:06 PM   #1086
Kegg
Rear Admiral
 
Kegg's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland.
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

137th Gebirg wrote: View Post
Is her statement supposed to be more of a metaphor, in that Jaime is nothing like Tywin as a person (good or bad),
That's exactly how I read it. Tyrion is his father's son, having both his taste and his aptitude for political scheming, a subject that Jaime has little interest in.

Brendan Moody wrote: View Post
Exactly because the TV series is leaving it as an open question, and given that there are all of two scenes where it comes up, it would have been perfectly possible to tell Bean what Ned's attitude, is but not precisely why it exists, without noticeably affecting the result.
That really just gets into the question about how much an actor should know about their character and how that impacts a performance. Some actors know volumes worth of information about who they're playing, a lot of which doesn't seem to have obvious payoff on the screen, others may know nothing beyond their assorted lines of dialogue, and so on.

In the case that it's a subject that Ned Stark confronts twice, to which he knows the definitive answer to and about which he may be lying (either that he's not Jon's father, or the woman he claims to be his mother is not his mother, whatever) it is pretty legitimately an important part of Ned Stark's past that it would benefit Sean Bean to know.
__________________
'Spock is always right, even when he's wrong. It's the tone of voice, the supernatural reasonability; this is not a man like us; this is a god.'
- Philip K. Dick
Kegg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 06:57 PM   #1087
Kosh Naranek
Captain
 
Kosh Naranek's Avatar
 
Location: Elwood P. Dowd's House
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

I am probably over thinking things...

Several times Jon has thought about how dragons would make the defense of the Wall easier. He and Sam even had a discussion about how Targeryns tried to hatch dragon eggs after the last one died, to no avail. Now that Dany has hatched her eggs, could another person do so? Does the person have to be a Targeryn or if someone has an egg and enough heat could anyone do it?

They say that old spells, etc are regaining potency. Is having the ability to hatch dragons specific to the person like warging? It is a talent that seems to touch a few.

Even if Dany reclaims the throne, she is the only Targeryn left (other than Aemon). Granted she could marry, but if she is barren as the story suggests, the land is bloodied for a one off monarch. Plus, all of her dragons are male. They will not be continuing their bloodline either.
__________________
"In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me. - Elwood P. Dowd from Harvey
Kosh Naranek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 08:17 PM   #1088
Klaus
Rear Admiral
 
Klaus's Avatar
 
Location: Beach condo, Bay of Eldamar
View Klaus's Twitter Profile
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

One thing for sure, the price of those "fossilized" dragon's eggs has probably gone up quite a bit ... but wherever Illyrio found them, there's no reason to think there aren't more of them out there waiting for the Mother of Dragons to help revive them too. If some of them are female...
__________________
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
t-shirts!
deviantArt
Klaus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23 2012, 08:42 PM   #1089
Captaindemotion
Vice Admiral
 
Captaindemotion's Avatar
 
Location: Ireland
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Even leaving aside Sean Bean's abilities or subtleties as an actor, I'm not necessarily persuaded that any actor's performance would necessarily benefit from knowing or not knowing the truth about Jon's parentage.

Alfie Allen's 'Luke Skywalker' example works here too. As far as I know, Alec Guinness didn't know that Darth Vader was really Luke's father in ANH and he presumably delivered the line 'He was betrayed and murdered by a young Jedi named Darth Vader' believing it to be 'true.'

But if you look at his performance, he gives this little look away before answering Luke's question about how his father died. At the time, I imagine that it was meant to be Obi-Wan preparing to give nasty news to the young man. But with hindsight, knowing what we now know, it works even better as Obi-Wan's hesitation and self-reproachment at having to lie to Luke.

As and when we find out the truth about Jon, I imagine that people will not just be looking back through the books to look for clues and either confirm their original suspicions or see how they got it so wrong - they'll also re-watch the tv show and they'll find clues and hints in the performances - even if the actors didn't actually intend for them to convey anything at the time!
__________________
Hodor!!!!!!!
Captaindemotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 02:48 PM   #1090
137th Gebirg
Rear Admiral
 
137th Gebirg's Avatar
 
Location: Who is John Galt?
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

__________________
Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.
137th Gebirg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 02:52 PM   #1091
Ayelbourne
Fleet Captain
 
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Just keep on reading. There will be more clues supporting this theory.
Ayelbourne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 03:07 PM   #1092
Kosh Naranek
Captain
 
Kosh Naranek's Avatar
 
Location: Elwood P. Dowd's House
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

137th Gebirg wrote: View Post
__________________
"In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me. - Elwood P. Dowd from Harvey
Kosh Naranek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 03:15 PM   #1093
Kosh Naranek
Captain
 
Kosh Naranek's Avatar
 
Location: Elwood P. Dowd's House
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Sorry to follow my own post but this is a different topic.

Cersei is convinced that Margeary is the queen that knocks her off the throne.

Some readers think it is Dany.

What if it is Sansa?

This may sound odd, but I had this thought when reading Sansa's chapters last night.

She does not seem to think of Jon as her brother.

If Jon is the one promised and is the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar...Would he marry his cousin to give Starks a higher place in the realm?

It is just a thought. Perhaps an icky thought but I had it any way.

Sansa nevers thinks of Jon once when she believes the whole family dead.

I cannot call which character POV is was - Jon or Sansa, but it mentioned that as soon as Sansa understood what bastard meant - she always referred to him as her half brother - if she referred to him all.
__________________
"In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant." Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. You may quote me. - Elwood P. Dowd from Harvey
Kosh Naranek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 07:12 PM   #1094
backstept
Rear Admiral
 
backstept's Avatar
 
Location: Syracuse
View backstept's Twitter Profile Send a message via AIM to backstept Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to backstept
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

if TMZ is to be believed, Kit Harrington and Rose Leslie are apparently dating
__________________
| Hi I'm Gauis Blatar lol
| backstept.blogspot.com | about.me
backstept is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 24 2012, 07:18 PM   #1095
Klaus
Rear Admiral
 
Klaus's Avatar
 
Location: Beach condo, Bay of Eldamar
View Klaus's Twitter Profile
Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

lucky sod....
__________________
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
t-shirts!
deviantArt
Klaus is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
a song of ice and fire, game of thrones

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:38 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.