Errand of Vengeance / Fury series

[zarkon]

Christopher wrote:

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I wouldn't consider most of the books on that list to be "dark," especially not The Wounded Sky, which is one of the most idealized portrayals of the ST cast and universe you're ever likely to see.

All the ones in the list I consider sophisticated, not dark.

[RonG]

Thanks, zarkon.

I already read (and love) all the books you mentioned

To be a bit more specific, I'm looking for novels that offer a "less-idealized" view on the Federation, Starfleet, etc.

Again, it's a bit hard to explain, so it doesn't surprise me that the novels you recommended (while fantastic in their own right) are not what I'm currently looking for.
still, the effort is much appreciated

[bok2384]

I'll take a stab at it, although probably get it completely wrong. What we must remember though, is that the reason that Vanguard was so different to what went before was the fact that it did take us into dark and uncomfortable places, in contrast to what the crew of the Enterprise traditionally turned up.

Web of the Romulans by M.S. Murdock could be a good choice. It's been a while since I've read it, but contains a fair bit of Romulan political intrigue as well as dealing with Starfleet preparing for a war with the Romulans. Again, might not be what you're after.

You're probably familiar with the Rihannsu series of novels. I've only read the first two so far, but we have treachery, deceit, secret missions, delving into the Romulans yet again.

I've not read it yet, but the description to Dwellers in the Crucible could be quite a dark novel and offer a dark and twisted view of how the Federation keeps the peace. Have to check it out myself.

Dreadnought! by Diane Carey sees a renegade Starfleet admiral and Kirk and crews attempt to stop him and his prototype dreadnought.

The Pandora Principle by Carolyn Clewes. Good one this, bit of espionage against the Romulans after the Enterprise discovers a Bird-of-Prey adrift. Also examines Saavik's harsh beginnings on Hellguard. Dark stuff.

I think that's it, by-and-large, apart from what you've already read. Coule be bad suggestions, but I'd read them all anyway because they're good.

[RonG]

bok2384 wrote:

---

I'll take a stab at it, although probably get it completely wrong. What we must remember though, is that the reason that Vanguard was so different to what went before was the fact that it did take us into dark and uncomfortable places, in contrast to what the crew of the Enterprise traditionally turned up.

Web of the Romulans by M.S. Murdock could be a good choice. It's been a while since I've read it, but contains a fair bit of Romulan political intrigue as well as dealing with Starfleet preparing for a war with the Romulans. Again, might not be what you're after.

You're probably familiar with the Rihannsu series of novels. I've only read the first two so far, but we have treachery, deceit, secret missions, delving into the Romulans yet again.

I've not read it yet, but the description to Dwellers in the Crucible could be quite a dark novel and offer a dark and twisted view of how the Federation keeps the peace. Have to check it out myself.

Dreadnought! by Diane Carey sees a renegade Starfleet admiral and Kirk and crews attempt to stop him and his prototype dreadnought.

The Pandora Principle by Carolyn Clewes. Good one this, bit of espionage against the Romulans after the Enterprise discovers a Bird-of-Prey adrift. Also examines Saavik's harsh beginnings on Hellguard. Dark stuff.

I think that's it, by-and-large, apart from what you've already read. Coule be bad suggestions, but I'd read them all anyway because they're good.

thanks for the suggestions, bok2384

I've actually bought and read them all except for Web of the Romulans. I'll try and hunt down a copy.


Thanks!

[Patrick O'Brien]

I belive Cast No Shadow by James Swallow my fit your criteria Ron. That is if you have not read it?

[zarkon]

Bear in mind it's a post STVI book though, so just starting to slip out of the TOS era, though still there or there abouts.

Totally forgot about that one. Decentish book, although I think Valeris wasn't particularly well handled.

[Dukhat]

My memory about the first trilogy is a bit dodgy, having read it several years ago. But the one thing I do recall was that there were typos on almost every page of all three books. And really glaring typos as well. I remember thinking that I couldn't believe Pocket Books would have published these books with the amount of mistakes in them. Mind you, this is not the author's fault, but PB's editor.

Another thing I found really annoying is the use of the names of real Star Trek production personnel as characters. Okuda, Sternbach, Drexler et. al are name-dropped to the point of ridiculousness. I really wish Trek authors wouldn't do that, because in fiction one wants to imagine what those characters look like in our minds. Giving a character the name "Roddenberry" just to be cute automatically makes one think of the real article, and ruins the fictitiousness of the setting, IMHO.

[zarkon]

Odd, I don't remember the typos, and I would have gotten american imports from forbidden plant back then, so they should have been first editions. Sure it wasn't the Janus Gate trilogy? That was a bit of a snoozefest so I wouldn't recall one way or the other, but the covers had a very similar style.

The name drops I do kind of remember, but only a couple - guess there were more that I just didn't recognise.

[Steve Mollmann]

RonG wrote:

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Well, basically I'm looking for novels that explore the TOS era / timeframe with a darker look - something that goes beyond "just" what was shown on the series itself, and delves into more complex situations, settings and characterizations - preferably more plotically or military-themed.

I hope this explains it a bit - it's more of a feeling I got when reading Vanguard, and I was looking to experience something similar (and finding it to date only in the Errand series and Cloak)..

Barbara Hambly's Crossroad is dark in terms of tone, kind of spooky, and features a warped future Federation. Probably my favorite numbered TOS novel.

[Patrick O'Brien]

I have noticed the typos I just thought it was the conversion to an ebook that caused this?

[Hartzilla2007]

Christopher wrote:

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I wouldn't consider most of the books on that list to be "dark," especially not The Wounded Sky, which is one of the most idealized portrayals of the ST cast and universe you're ever likely to see.

Its also way better than the TNG episode based on it.

Steve Mollmann wrote:

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Barbara Hambly's Crossroad is dark in terms of tone, kind of spooky, and features a warped future Federation.

It also has the Enterprise's bowling alley make an appearance.

[Steve Mollmann]

And laundry, if I remember right.

[shanejayell]

The Enterprise had a laundry?

*blink blink*

[Christopher]

If I recall The Making of Star Trek correctly, it had machinery that broke down clothing into its constituent fibers, separated out the dirt and stuff, and reassembled the clothes as if brand new. Sort of a much lower-resolution equivalent of a replicator.

[RonG]

Patrick O'Brien wrote:

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I belive Cast No Shadow by James Swallow my fit your criteria Ron. That is if you have not read it?

zarkon wrote:

---

Bear in mind it's a post STVI book though, so just starting to slip out of the TOS era, though still there or there abouts.

Totally forgot about that one. Decentish book, although I think Valeris wasn't particularly well handled.

I read Cast No Shadow when it came out. It was nice and with a "Hunt for Red October" vibe, with Elias Vaugh as Ryan

Dukhat wrote:

---

My memory about the first trilogy is a bit dodgy, having read it several years ago. But the one thing I do recall was that there were typos on almost every page of all three books. And really glaring typos as well. I remember thinking that I couldn't believe Pocket Books would have published these books with the amount of mistakes in them. Mind you, this is not the author's fault, but PB's editor.

Another thing I found really annoying is the use of the names of real Star Trek production personnel as characters. Okuda, Sternbach, Drexler et. al are name-dropped to the point of ridiculousness. I really wish Trek authors wouldn't do that, because in fiction one wants to imagine what those characters look like in our minds. Giving a character the name "Roddenberry" just to be cute automatically makes one think of the real article, and ruins the fictitiousness of the setting, IMHO.

zarkon wrote:

---

Odd, I don't remember the typos, and I would have gotten american imports from forbidden plant back then, so they should have been first editions. Sure it wasn't the Janus Gate trilogy? That was a bit of a snoozefest so I wouldn't recall one way or the other, but the covers had a very similar style.

The name drops I do kind of remember, but only a couple - guess there were more that I just didn't recognise.

Patrick O'Brien wrote:

---

I have noticed the typos I just thought it was the conversion to an ebook that caused this?

Yep - the first Errand series had quite a few typos - while distracting at first, I stopped paying attention to them after a while - goes to show that a great book overcomes mistakes in editing/proofing

Steve Mollmann wrote:

---

Barbara Hambly's Crossroad is dark in terms of tone, kind of spooky, and features a warped future Federation. Probably my favorite numbered TOS novel.

I have Crossroad, but it's been quite a while since I read it - will have to have another look!