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Trek Tech Pass me the quantum flux regulator, will you?

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Old June 5 2012, 11:54 AM   #61
Timo
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Well, I'm inclined to think the very thing...

Also, even if they allow the garbage trucks in, why don't we see any limos there?

Don't get me wrong, the more I see of this beautiful model, the better. It's just that I'd have been happier with just about anything else in that scene, including those travel pods (even if it might take quite a bit of gulping to swallow the idea that those can operate within an atmosphere, let alone land and take off).

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Old June 5 2012, 01:33 PM   #62
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Fortunately we got our "limo" in TUC. With tugs and travel pods, we desperately needed the "executive shuttle" to take our heroes from San Francisco to Spacedock. Probably we should have seen one of the "buses" from TMP here too:

http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/a.../tmphd0220.jpg

Perhaps those are just hoppers that take Starfleet members across the bay from one Federation facility to another (like hospital or university campus shuttle buses)?
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Old June 5 2012, 07:08 PM   #63
Timo
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Quite possibly so. Backstage sources speak of "air trams", but these don't seem like public transportation to me. More like company minibuses, or even private limos.

It would be interesting to know how much one saves by omitting spaceflight capabilities from a flying vehicle in the 23rd century, or how much one has to pay extra to make a vehicle fly... If it isn't trivially easy for an aircraft from the era to reach space, then dedicated "hoppers" or "flitters" would certainly make sense here.

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Old June 14 2012, 03:55 AM   #64
Uxi
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Dukhat wrote: View Post
That's a good point. But then why didn't the Planet of the Titans ship go after them? Or maybe the other ships' captains just assumed the Excelsior would catch them, and didn't bother?
Remember the destination, too. Genesis was "planet forbidden" and they might not have wanted any other ships going there due to the political situation. At least not until they can detail the right Captain and crew. And by the time they get there, the BoP is already en route to Vulcan and the planet/system is falling apart.

Great design, though. I would think the exterior hatches are ingress/egress, though beaming into the area behind the cockpit could be possible. Entrance to the cockpit itself would be from the inside and just lacked that appropriate detail (though it could arguably be armored/pressurized and not look like an overt conventional door/hatch.
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Old June 14 2012, 06:57 PM   #65
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Why didn't other ships pursue the USS Enterprise? I think, and I am pulling in information from another franchise (Mass Effect), Starfleet couldn't track the starship when she was in warp. I am thinking that Starfleet would need for the starship to emerge out of warp into a system to get a lock on the vessel, and then send a starship to retrieve the Enterprise and the renegade officers.
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Old June 14 2012, 07:06 PM   #66
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

throwback wrote: View Post
Starfleet couldn't track the starship when she was in warp.
Wrong. Starfleet tracked uncloaked ships which were traveling at warp all the time.
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Old June 14 2012, 08:00 PM   #67
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Can you name an example? I don't have an encyclopedic memory for all things Star Trek, unfortunately.
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Old June 14 2012, 09:36 PM   #68
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Timo wrote: View Post
Not according to these pictures. Indeed, the vehicle appears to be intended to be boarded only by trained personnel who can squeeze in through the twin dorsal hatches, which is a rather silly arrangement.

...All the more so since the cabin visible through the forward dome does not appear to include any sort of doors to the back compartment(s)! Perhaps we are instead supposed to think that the transparent canopy opens up somehow, in which case the question goes, how are the pilots supposed to climb out? Crawling over their dashboards? This is rather rare for real vehicles accessed through an opening canopy.

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Shame they don't have some kind of device they can use to transport people into and out of places...
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Old June 14 2012, 09:59 PM   #69
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

throwback wrote: View Post
Can you name an example? I don't have an encyclopedic memory for all things Star Trek, unfortunately.
Examples abound, but how about The Menagerie, part 1. While the Enterprise is at warp, she can scan the shuttlecraft following her more slowly, and the shuttlecraft can scan the Enterprise.
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Old June 16 2012, 10:17 AM   #70
Timo
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Why didn't other ships pursue the USS Enterprise?
It's a somewhat confusing issue. If we assume Genesis is relatively close to Earth (so that Kirk could wander to the general region during his birthday joyride), and merely in a generally neglected rather than horribly distant corner of the UFP, then when one starship fails, there might not be time to scramble another until Kirk was already there. And diverting random ships from everywhere in the Federation to block Kirk's access to a place nobody should visit would be counterproductive, as Starfleet would end up with half a dozen unauthorized ships at Genesis instead of just one!

Then again, if Genesis indeed is fairly close to Earth (that is, close to the place where Khan was marooned, that in turn probably being close to the place where he was found, that in turn necessarily being fairly close to Earth), Starfleet should have a great number of ships to choose from. After all, while many ships explore the unknown, it still makes sense to have plenty of them near the UFP core worlds as well, if for no other reason then because that's where they'd be the densest when moving out and returning from the frontier. They then could divert a trusted ship and skipper to intercept Kirk. They'd know the Grissom wouldn't be up to the job, even if JT Esteban was...

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Old June 16 2012, 10:57 PM   #71
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

It's probably a lot more simple than that: the reason they sent Excelsior is because her captain just happened to be aboard when Kirk made a run for it. The other three or four ships in port either took longer to power up (because their chief engineer and/or primary systems were sleeping/offline) or just didn't have one of their senior officers on board at that time.

In the Trekiverse, starships generally revolve around their senior command staff, usually the Captain and First Officer and a couple of other people who are really important for some reason (varies from ship to ship). Much the same way, Enterprise-D would never pull out of port in anything short of a catastrophic emergency unless it had Picard, Riker, Data and Geordi aboard and accounted for; they could leave without Troi, or even Beverly, and a loss of Worf would definitely be felt (though tollerable for a short non-combat mission). But leave one or more of those major crewmen behind, plot logic alone suggests that somebody else who is more ready to go will take the job first.
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Old June 17 2012, 03:10 AM   #72
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Starfleet didn't send a pursuit ship; instead, the agency sent a warning to the USS Grissom about the USS Enterprise.
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Old June 17 2012, 12:55 PM   #73
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

Well, why send a pursuit ship when there's one already waiting for him at Genesis? He's going to act on some Vulcan Katra mumbo-jumbo with a skeleton crew... the command staff already knows about Genesis... what in fact is the risk? Kirk won't take a shot a Grissom, and Grissom's (guesstimate) 50 or so people are more than enough to take on a small command staff if it comes to that.
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Old June 17 2012, 01:48 PM   #74
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Re: That Spacedock "shuttle" is actually a Tug

The other ships weren't comparable to taking on the Enterprise (if needed)? Not fast enough- not powerful enough?

Maybe the ships were in various stages of refit-repair-crew shore leave?

And I always assumes space defence of the Sol System was patrolled by low warp, heavy powered ships that weren't meant for really leaving the parameter of our system. Plus Earth itself has that giant beast of StarBase that I personaly assumed is armed to the freakin' teeth.

Then there's the point that space is HUGE!!! You may have a fleet of 10000 ships and it means shit in the vastness of space. I posted a thread once with the size of the Federation and the sheer volume of space that takes up. It's insane- even with warp drive.

And then that leads into the threat factor. I never really thought threats of a system were as large as some series have suggested. And that's primarily because of the size of space. And how defendable the major systems would be. Major enemy encounters probably primarily involved skirmishes. Some lesser planets get raided, or even occupied by an agressor. Starfleet takes it back, and life goes on. No giant everyday planet killing silly plots...

One other thing about sending out someone to pursue the Enterprise- I think there would be some political interference as well. The Excelsior failed immediately, and there may have been intensional delays to react because some people didn't want to stop Kirk.
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