PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

[Pauln6]

Base_Delta_Zero wrote:

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Everyone makes insanely stupid decisions or is prevented from making a sane decision by some other moron at every opportunity. It's like everyone on board the Prometheus didn't want to be there, didn't care they'd found alien life or (ugh) possible origins of human life, and actively sought death at every turn. Except for Theron's character, who had the few brain cells the crew could scrape together, was capable and clearly wanted to live.

I thought a huge error was made in putting so many characters in play and then setting up Noomi (who isn't that good) as the clear heroine with a character shield from word one. She should have died about half way into the film suddenly and with great violence, so that Theron's character (the justifiably paranoid asshole who couldn't get along with anyone) could step in and try to salvage the inevitable disaster, if only for herself and maybe the audience would have been surprised at a turn the film took.

Elba, Theron and Fassbender were all good, but they weren't given anything to work with. Noomi was meh. Her boyfriend was lame just like he is in every movie he's in and the rest of the dozen other characters are ciphers, with little or no dialogue, only there to hold up the sets and then die.

As for the deeper message? Engineer Aliens are assholes. And humans are assholes to robots. That's it. Having characters say there are Big Things out there that need Big Answers is not the same as actually having those characters explore those Big Things or find those Big Answers.

I'll give it one more go with a Director's Cut (Kingdom of Heaven DC is frickin awesome compared to the wreck of a theatrical release).

C+ (Leaning towards C/C- as time passes)

Yeah now that would have been interesting. You are not the only person who would have liked to see more development with Theron's character as the only one who didn't really deserve what they got. If Noomi had been placed in stasis and Theron had to step up, that would have been a WAY better finale. Theron could work the doctor bot (far less silly) and they could have worked towards several characters with potential for development surviving to the end (or not)

[Admiral2]

B+

The + is mainly for Charlize Theron and the half-naked and wet push-ups, Charlize Theron in the "power" suits and Charlize Theron in the space suit. The rest was a B movie.

For those of you who thought the story was disjointed or incoherent: It was nothing of the kind. There were three human characters with agendas that were propelled by the Space Jockeys' agenda. Think of it that way and it's easy to understand.

For those of you who thought the scientists were stupid: My Brother The DOCTOR once asked my mother for help cooking a turkey and she started her instruction by telling him to wash it before he prepared it, which he did...with dishwashing liquid. The moral: smart people can do really stupid things. That makes them human, not a problem with the narrative.

Those of you who didn't like the Alien references: It's a movie about the Space Jockeys. How do you do a movie about the Space Jockeys without referencing the movie that introduced the Space Jockeys?

Speaking of, those who think this is not an Alien prequel: Willful self-delusion is allowed, but not recommended.

Those of you who think Noomi Rapace is no Sigourney Weaver: Well...yeah, that's true. I think the silliest part of her story was when she turned herself into The Girl With The F***ed Up Abdominal Scar.

Also want to mention that I found it interesting that the lifeforms in this movie are closer to what Dan O'Bannon said he envisioned for the original alien seeders before Giger started drawing for the movie.

[Pauln6]

Admiral2 wrote:

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For those of you who thought the scientists were stupid: My Brother The DOCTOR once asked my mother for help cooking a turkey and she started her instruction by telling him to wash it before he prepared it, which he did...with dishwashing liquid. The moral: smart people can do really stupid things. That makes them human, not a problem with the narrative.

My problem was with them having no concept of any scientific method (as well as being stupid). If they had taken even the most basic precautions but the situation got out of hand due to one or two stupid things (or David's desire to get the ball rolling) the general stupidity level would have come down a few notches.

They could have lifted really basic safety pointers from Stargate SG1 and seriously improved the plot. In fact low tech MALPS would have been better than the mildly irritating floaty things that inexplicably failed to help the guy that owned them find his way to an exit.

STUPID.

Another example is that in Alien there is a defined quarantine protocol that took place in the airlock. It didn't take long to explain in the plot and Ash broke it due to his own agenda. In this movie they had the cargo bay open to the atmosphere...

So you have somebody that you think need to be quarantined. Do you:

a) Shoot them with a tranquiliser dart, breaching their encounter suit, potentially suffocating them, and allowing the pathogen out of the suit?

b) Decide that the established quarantine procedure, if drafted by these idiot scientists, probably isn't worth the paper it's written on and flame them instead, killing them and limiting you chances of getting useful information from an autopsy?

c) Tazer them to incapacitate them to carry out a exam under your established quarantine procedures while they are hopefully still alive?

d) Examine them in your sterile mobile lab that you set up outside the ship?

[Admiral2]

Pauln6 wrote:

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My problem was with them having no concept of any scientific method (as well as being stupid). If they had taken even the most basic precautions but the situation got out of hand due to one or two stupid things (or David's desire to get the ball rolling) the general stupidity level would have come down a few notches.

They could have lifted really basic safety pointers from Stargate SG1 and seriously improved the plot. In fact low tech MALPS would have been better than the mildly irritating floaty things that inexplicably failed to help the guy that owned them find his way to an exit.

STUPID.

The first part of the scientific method is to Test. Shaw's boyfriend tested a theory about the air the expedient way. Shaw tested a theory about the Space Jockey's head. David tested a theory about the black oil. Shaw's only real derivations from scientific method were driven by emotion, not stupidity.

And I thought the two guys who tried to get back to the ship before the blue meanies came out showed incredible intelligence usually lacking in monster movies. Then they got lost. Their real problem was that they were wise-asses. Wise-asses generally think nothing can hurt them.

[Pauln6]

Admiral2 wrote:

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The first part of the scientific method is to Test.

Yes - test the air throughout the entire complex by sampling to make sure there are no atmospheric black spots, harmful chemicals, or pathogens. You might test the air on animal subjects in laboratory conditions long before you would expose a human volunteer. I am assuming that they had equipment that checked for airborn pathogens and found none so I'll give a pass there - but assuming that there would be no pathogens in any other chamber would be grossly negligent. By the time you'd detected them, you would already be exposed.

I can get behind the smart ass archaeologist doing it. It's that everybody else, including the biologist and MD also did it that was so stupid. Did they all think that alien bacteria would always kill instantly so there obviously wasn't any?

My issue with the geologist and biologist was that they took no samples and contributed nothing to the trip. How did they get lost? It was his own drones that mapped the complex. Everybody was on the same comms system and the ship monitored their locations. They should have got the message about the storm too but asked for no assistance? If they'd been delayed taking samples on the way out I might have forgiven them. I can only assume they must have switched comms off so they could have a shag. It could have been a glitch in the system I suppose but if so it was poorly represented in the narrative.

[The Wormhole]

Personally, I thought this movie was fucking awesome! While at times there are perhaps too many similarities to Alien, it is regardless some classic sci-fi quality here. The movie is so cool, so enjoyable, so great, and so fucking awesome.

For the most part we've got a great group of characters, though I could have done without the hardass who ends up panicing when shit hits the fan. David the Android was a really cool character and I was surprised how much I liked him. And true to Alien tradition, the android gets violently beaten and sprays white goo everywhere.

The Space Jockeys also turned out kind of cool. While certainly not what I imagined, they managed to not be disappointing, which is quite something since the Space Jockey is something I've thought about since childhood.

Some questions regarding the ending, is Ms. Vickers alive? We don't see her get killed, yet if she is alive, she seems to have been abandoned on the planet. Also, in the final scenes we see Dr. Shaw isn't wearing her spacesuit's gloves. Kind of defeats the purpose of wearing a spacesuit.

I give the movie an A+.

[cbspock]

Don't even bother seeing this movie. It is a waste of time. It's not good when people laugh at stuff they shouldn't be laughing at during the movie. The movie really jumped the shark when she cut the alien out of herself and walked around the rest of the time like nothing happened. Also, if you are going to borrow for Alien, you don't take from Alien 3 and 4. You borrow from the two good ones.


-Chris

[PsychoPere]

Yminale wrote:

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[...] Maybe I'll wait for the Director's cut on this one.

Kirkman1987 wrote:

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I do agree that it's obvious some stuff was cut, and I'm sure Scott will do a director's cut for video.

Base_Delta_Zero wrote:

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I'll give it one more go with a Director's Cut [...]

Ridley Scott has already said that he won't be doing a director's cut.

[Yminale]

PsychoPere wrote:

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Ridley Scott has already said that he won't be doing a director's cut.

Yeah Ridley Scott ALWAYS said that and then BOOM! Ultra Deluxe 3D Blu ray with smellavision version comes out. I remember Scott said that the ambiguity of Decker's status was what makes Blade Runner such a great movie and that all he would do was restore the original darker ending. Well that went out the window. Thank you magical unicorn.

[DarthPipes]

B I guess. I just got back from it. Strange but good. Kind of hard to describe.

I will say that Michael Fassenbender continues to be the bst thing in any movie he's in. His David is a terrific character. Charlize Theron is fucking beautiful. The guy playing the captain was quite good. Rapace's surgery scene was hard to watch.

[Yminale]

Honestly people, I think most of you are just looking for stuff to critize. Prometheus sounds as dumb as the Avengers or the last Star Trek movie and all of you loved those films.

If you want an intelligent Sci-fi film I suggest you watch "Safety not Guaranteed". Outside of that, shut your brain off and enjoy the pure spectacle that is Prometheus.

[-Brett-]

I'd say a B is fair. The acting is mostly good. The visuals are great. Action sequences are actiony.

The plot left more unresolved questions than I generally like. The scientific method used by the supposed scientists was laughable. The biologist in particular was an idiot. Hissing snake-like thing with bared fangs = stay the fuck away from it. The average high school drop out should know that, but this supposed biologist doesn't?

Anyway, would probably watch again if it was on TV and I had nothing better to do. Maybe not though. Might watch the sequel once it moves to the cheap theatre.

[DestinyCaptain]

137th Gebirg wrote:

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Indeed. Lance Henrikson always seemed to be the de facto Weyland in the franchise and could have played the part adequately. Then again, AvP probably placed him way too early in the company history to be believable in Prometheus' future setting.

That and Scott doesn't like AVP. Does the film expressly say that there wasn't a Weyland before Peter, or does it say something along the lines that he made the company what it is today. If its something along the lines of Peter transitioning the company from a huge manufacturing company in oil and telecommunications to a company devoted to space, robotics, and future tech...then it does not rule out CBW.

[sidious618]

I just got back and was really impressed. The visuals of the film were magnificent and didn't feel excessive- they matched the theme of the story. Even if the story was a dud the visuals alone would've sold it because they created a real, creepy world and at other times filled you with a sense of awe.

It seems to me that the story is what most people have been torn about. I loved it. I liked that it was ambiguous and I liked that it left you with some questions. Could it have been deeper? Yes, but this is a mainstream film and it did a lot more than most mainstream sci-fi films do so I was satisfied. I'd say it was as intelligent as the original Alien.

There are a few things that irked me, such as Shaw not being as upset about David putting an alien inside her as she should've been, but the general chaotic nature of the ending did excuse the questionable plot points somewhat.

[Nightowl1701]

cbspock wrote:

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The movie really jumped the shark when she cut the alien out of herself and walked around the rest of the time like nothing happened.

She was NOT walking around like nothing happened, she was staggering and clutching her belly and popping one painkiller after another. She barely made it back into her spacesuit. When the shit hit the fan, she was going on adrenalin, the painkillers and sheer willpower. No idea how long she was lying there after the ship crashed (obviously long enough for her suit air to almost run out, so we'll say a few hours). No doubt once she and David took off in the other Jockey vessel, she would have had to put David back together enough for him to pilot the ship and put her in cryosleep, because she wouldn't survive the trip otherwise.

sidious618 wrote:

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There are a few things that irked me, such as Shaw not being as upset about David putting an alien inside her as she should've been, but the general chaotic nature of the ending did excuse the questionable plot points somewhat.

"I guess it's because I'm a human being, and you're just a robot." She likely figured it was Weyland prodding David to do his experiments (or David explained it to her in a deleted scene). David, being "just a robot," was just following his master's orders and bore no personal responsibility. Bit of the same condescending attitude Holloway showed him, when you think about it.