PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss - Page 2

137th Gebirg · May 31 2012, 02:36 PM

Mutenroshi wrote:

TPM is not a prequel to A New Hope...

Heh...that may be more philosophical than literal.

Set Harth · May 31 2012, 02:38 PM

TPM is not a prequel to A New Hope...

Yes, it is. It's just not the only one.

That's why it's been called a "Star Wars prequel" from day one and no one ever disputed that. Similarly, the PT is referred to as "the prequels" as opposed to "one prequel and a prequel to that prequel and a prequel to that prequel to the prequel".

If you try to change the definition of prequel so that TPM is not a prequel to ANH, then what exactly is it a prequel to? AOTC? That would mean it's a prequel to a film which came out three years after its own release. Which kind of invalidates the "quel" part.

Mutenroshi · May 31 2012, 02:47 PM

Jesus, are you really taking literally what I've just written? When Prometheus ends, it does not lead to Alien! Sheesh!
It's not Alien 0, if you prefer that kind of anal(sic)ogy.
Go and see the film and maybe you'll understand what I try to convey.

Set Harth · May 31 2012, 02:54 PM

I understand what you're saying, I just don't agree with your (re)definition of "prequel".

The Mirrorball Man · May 31 2012, 04:45 PM

I've just seen it. In my opinion, though it's visually and technically impressive and some of the actors do their best with what they're given, Prometheus is an incoherent mess.

Ridley Scott, who used to be so talented at that kind of thing, seems to have lost all deftness at building dramatic tension. The film is a collection of loosely connected scenes which ultimately fail to coalesce into a coherent whole. It looks and reads like a first draft. Characters are introduced and discarded randomly. Their motivations are all over the place. Some events which should be extremely important have little or no impact and are never referenced again. Even the sci-fi part, the worldbuilding, is haphazard and lacks cohesion. It seems to exist solely to provide a setting for action scenes and to hit a couple of half-baked thematic notes about faith and the meaning of life.

For me, it's as if the movie had been written by people whose total life experience comes from other movies: not once do you believe that you're looking at flesh-and-blood people with decipherable motivations and credible emotions. The Prometheus is full of weird automatons who speak like movie characters and act like movie characters, as if they had escaped from the Jack Slater universe.

Prometheus is not without merits, but as far as I'm concerned, it's a bitter disappointment.

Hartzilla2007 · May 31 2012, 05:16 PM

Mutenroshi wrote:

Jesus, are you really taking literally what I've just written? When Prometheus ends, it does not lead to Alien!

And X-men First Class doesn't end where X-men began and yet its still a prequel to it.

137th Gebirg · May 31 2012, 05:42 PM

Again, I think the varying difference between the definition of "prequel" being cited here is more philosophical than literal.

Donald Draper · May 31 2012, 05:56 PM

I think the real issue is that for some, the sole interest in this was hope it would have direct connections to ALIEN. Meaning the same planet and the actual xenomorphs.

I am not in that group. I am a casual fan of the original at most. The idea of a film being in the same universe but with different characters and no real plot connections is interesting.

For me the real question, is this a movie that works on its own terms? Will it appeal to me personally and do I have a strong desire to even see it in the theater. I am not sure of that yet. I would have to hear its a must see for anyone. Beyond fanish hype.

The Mirrorball Man · May 31 2012, 06:13 PM

Donald Draper wrote:

For me the real question, is this a movie that works on its own terms? Will it appeal to me personally and do I have a strong desire to even see it in the theater. I am not sure of that yet. I would have to hear its a must see for anyone. Beyond fanish hype.

In my opinion it fails as a prequel and it fails on its own terms as well.

Mutenroshi · May 31 2012, 10:10 PM

Funny. Two friends of mine went to see the movie today. One was not convinced and the other wants to see the sequel!
Looks like this'll be the kind of reaction we will get concerning that movie.

137th Gebirg · May 31 2012, 10:18 PM

^^^ Definitely sounds like what's going on here. Either people love it or it's not worth their time. Doesn't seem to be much in the way of a middle ground going on.

I don't suppose anyone can now confirm or deny (even in spoiler code) about the infamous "push ups" scene, hmmm?

Mutenroshi · May 31 2012, 10:27 PM

Warped9 · May 31 2012, 11:17 PM

Donald Draper wrote:

For me the real question, is this a movie that works on its own terms?

For me thats the ultimate arbiter. I've never felt that Alien needed a prequel. It's a self-contained story that works very well on its own.

Now if Prometheus has some connection to Alien then fine. But ultimately I'm interested in seeing a good space adventure. From what I've seen so far this might have the makings of a good time at the movies. How enjoyable it'll be remains to be seen, but I'm interested in seeing on the big screen.

davejames · May 31 2012, 11:24 PM

137th Gebirg wrote:

^^^ Definitely sounds like what's going on here. Either people love it or it's not worth their time. Doesn't seem to be much in the way of a middle ground going on.

I suspect the people who go in expecting just a fun little scifi thriller are probably going to enjoy it the most.

The more hardcore scifi fans, who want something that lives up to the brilliance of the original movie, or that shares the same style and tone, are probably going to have the biggest issues with it.

Dac · June 1 2012, 02:56 AM

Just came back from it. It was solid, I really really enjoyed it BUT - there was nothing here that made my chest thump and brain race. This film did not get me excited, which is a little bit of a shame. The trailers did give away a LOT of the big points which sucked. There is still some stuff there to make you go "ooo", but overall I'd say about 50% of the big stuff is ruined plain as day in the trailer, and having seen the film another 20% is there even if you don't realize what it is.

Don't get me wrong. It IS a great film, and is worthy of being connected to the Alien franchise in a prequel-ish way (c'mon it IS. Sort of. It's more of a prequel than its not). The way it leads to a possible sequel is not what I would called hackneyed or tacked on, it works. It certainly adds too Alien as a film, and does not detract in any way.

View Poll Results: Prometheus - Poll
A +	16	6.90%
A	27	11.64%
A -	32	13.79%
B +	43	18.53%
B	33	14.22%
B -	21	9.05%
C +	19	8.19%
C	8	3.45%
C -	15	6.47%
D	12	5.17%
F	6	2.59%
Voters: 232. You may not vote on this poll

May 31 2012, 02:47 PM	#18
Mutenroshi 亀仙人 - 武天老師 Location: Mutenroshi	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss Jesus, are you really taking literally what I've just written? When Prometheus ends, it does not lead to Alien! Sheesh! It's not Alien 0, if you prefer that kind of anal(sic)ogy. Go and see the film and maybe you'll understand what I try to convey. __________________ Let There Be Rock! Jack Beauregard: "You shine like the door of a whorehouse!" *Nobody:* "I like folks to see me."

May 31 2012, 02:54 PM	#19
Set Harth Rear Admiral Location: Ekkaia	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss I understand what you're saying, I just don't agree with your (re)definition of "prequel". __________________ "Your grandfather called me a ronin. A samurai without a master. Who has no reason to live." "Was he right?"

May 31 2012, 04:45 PM	#20
The Mirrorball Man Vice Admiral Location: Switzerland	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss I've just seen it. In my opinion, though it's visually and technically impressive and some of the actors do their best with what they're given, Prometheus is an incoherent mess. Ridley Scott, who used to be so talented at that kind of thing, seems to have lost all deftness at building dramatic tension. The film is a collection of loosely connected scenes which ultimately fail to coalesce into a coherent whole. It looks and reads like a first draft. Characters are introduced and discarded randomly. Their motivations are all over the place. Some events which should be extremely important have little or no impact and are never referenced again. Even the sci-fi part, the worldbuilding, is haphazard and lacks cohesion. It seems to exist solely to provide a setting for action scenes and to hit a couple of half-baked thematic notes about faith and the meaning of life. For me, it's as if the movie had been written by people whose total life experience comes from other movies: not once do you believe that you're looking at flesh-and-blood people with decipherable motivations and credible emotions. The Prometheus is full of weird automatons who speak like movie characters and act like movie characters, as if they had escaped from the Jack Slater universe. Prometheus is not without merits, but as far as I'm concerned, it's a bitter disappointment. __________________ Check out my deviantArt gallery!

May 31 2012, 05:42 PM	#22
137th Gebirg Rear Admiral Location: Who is John Galt?	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss Again, I think the varying difference between the definition of "prequel" being cited here is more philosophical than literal. __________________ Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.

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May 31 2012, 05:56 PM	#23
Donald Draper Fleet Captain	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss I think the real issue is that for some, the sole interest in this was hope it would have direct connections to ALIEN. Meaning the same planet and the actual xenomorphs. I am not in that group. I am a casual fan of the original at most. The idea of a film being in the same universe but with different characters and no real plot connections is interesting. For me the real question, is this a movie that works on its own terms? Will it appeal to me personally and do I have a strong desire to even see it in the theater. I am not sure of that yet. I would have to hear its a must see for anyone. Beyond fanish hype.

May 31 2012, 10:10 PM	#25
Mutenroshi 亀仙人 - 武天老師 Location: Mutenroshi	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss Funny. Two friends of mine went to see the movie today. One was not convinced and the other wants to see the sequel! Looks like this'll be the kind of reaction we will get concerning that movie. __________________ Let There Be Rock! Jack Beauregard: "You shine like the door of a whorehouse!" *Nobody:* "I like folks to see me."

May 31 2012, 10:18 PM	#26
137th Gebirg Rear Admiral Location: Who is John Galt?	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss ^^^ Definitely sounds like what's going on here. Either people love it or it's not worth their time. Doesn't seem to be much in the way of a middle ground going on. I don't suppose anyone can now confirm or deny (even in spoiler code) about the infamous "push ups" scene, hmmm? __________________ Gebirgswick - Ind, Tra, Sec & Env.

May 31 2012, 10:27 PM	#27
Mutenroshi 亀仙人 - 武天老師 Location: Mutenroshi	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss Meredith Vickers does her push ups immediately after cryo-sleep. But she's not naked, she's in cryo-panties. __________________ Let There Be Rock! Jack Beauregard: "You shine like the door of a whorehouse!" *Nobody:* "I like folks to see me."

June 1 2012, 02:56 AM	#30
Dac Commodore Location: The Essex wastes...	Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss Just came back from it. It was solid, I really really enjoyed it BUT - there was nothing here that made my chest thump and brain race. This film did not get me excited, which is a little bit of a shame. The trailers did give away a LOT of the big points which sucked. There is still some stuff there to make you go "ooo", but overall I'd say about 50% of the big stuff is ruined plain as day in the trailer, and having seen the film another 20% is there even if you don't realize what it is. Don't get me wrong. It IS a great film, and is worthy of being connected to the Alien franchise in a prequel-ish way (c'mon it IS. Sort of. It's more of a prequel than its not). The way it leads to a possible sequel is not what I would called hackneyed or tacked on, it works. It certainly adds too Alien as a film, and does not detract in any way.