Did TNG have too many characters at first?

The Overlord · February 4 2012, 07:47 AM

Did TNG have too many characters at first? It seems like TNG got better after Tasha Yar died and they focused more on other characters like Worf, with one less character hogging the spotlight. It seems like at first there were too many characters to handle, Tasha Yar made Worf seem redundant. Also the series got even better after Wesley Cruhser was demoted to guest star.

Sho · February 4 2012, 08:11 AM

Well, just because they didn't know how to use them effectively, it doesn't mean there were too many characters in an absolute sense. DS9 did splendidly with a considerably larger ensemble. Rather, they had to many characters for the direction of storytelling they chose too adopt. TNG wasn't really a very character-driven show, especially early on before Piller came along, and there were too many characters for the little character time they had going around initially.

sojourner · February 4 2012, 08:37 AM

I am sure the "equal screen time" clause that was in place for the tng actors didn't help either. Or was that just a myth?

Bisz · February 4 2012, 05:12 PM

I'm with Sho, other shows have managed to do very well with larger casts (DS9, Firefly). It all goes to what kind of show you are doing and TNG was a show about going places and doing things, not about characters developing. And that's where I agree with you Overlord, there was no need for both Tasha and Worf since there was no need for two security people.

BillJ · February 4 2012, 05:22 PM

If they had a larger cast we might've been spared such classics as Birthright, Sub Rosa, Inheritance and Bloodlines.

BillJ · February 4 2012, 05:23 PM

Bisz wrote:

I'm with Sho, other shows have managed to do very well with larger casts (DS9, Firefly). It all goes to what kind of show you are doing and TNG was a show about going places and doing things, not about characters developing. And that's where I agree with you Overlord, there was no need for both Tasha and Worf since there was no need for two security people.

Worf wasn't a security person til Crosby left the show...

davejames · February 4 2012, 08:20 PM

I think the problem was more that Yar and Wesley just weren't terribly interesting characters. The writers clearly had a hard time thinking up good storylines for them, and it just made sense that they finally had to go.

Of course Troi, Beverly, and George weren't all that interesting either, but they at least served a functional purpose on the show.

Anwar · February 4 2012, 08:55 PM

BillJ wrote:

If they had a larger cast we might've been spared such classics as Birthright, Sub Rosa, Inheritance and Bloodlines.

Sarcasm sensor is broken, because I thought Birthright and Bloodlines were good episodes...

BillJ · February 4 2012, 08:55 PM

Anwar wrote:

BillJ wrote:

If they had a larger cast we might've been spared such classics as Birthright, Sub Rosa, Inheritance and Bloodlines.

Sarcasm sensor is broken, because I thought Birthright and Bloodlines were good episodes...

That makes one of us...

HaventGotALife · February 5 2012, 02:01 AM

The Overlord wrote:

Did TNG have too many characters at first? It seems like TNG got better after Tasha Yar died and they focused more on other characters like Worf, with one less character hogging the spotlight. It seems like at first there were too many characters to handle, Tasha Yar made Worf seem redundant. Also the series got even better after Wesley Cruhser was demoted to guest star.

I think some of this is true. Remember, it's not just Tasha. LaForge was on the bridge meaning they had to have a guest star in Engineering. Wesley was annoying becase this was a character with no training that knew everything. Why is he on the bridge of the flagship of the Federation? There was something very mystical abot his character in the first season. Worf was essentially a guest-star in the first season. He had nothing important to do or say (until Heart of Glory).

But the series had other problems as well. They didn't have any mysteries--characters figured out what was happening, speculated. For instance, in Datalore without any testing of the hypothesis Riker comes up with all the answers and there's no investigation or confirmation. That's bad writing.

The bridge crew was too eager to please and behaved like they werre always under fire. I found the audiotrack to be quite annoying.

Anyway, I like the pace of the show once the third season rolled around. The subtle nature of Patrick Stewart's acting and it really became a show about Picard's decisions. We didn't have too many problems that didn't end up on his desk.

I like Worf better in DS9 than the brute he was in TNG. I don't like Riker much. These were foils around Picard. It wasn't as much of an ensemble as we like to portray.

BennyRussel · February 5 2012, 04:22 PM

Anwar wrote:

BillJ wrote:

If they had a larger cast we might've been spared such classics as Birthright, Sub Rosa, Inheritance and Bloodlines.

Sarcasm sensor is broken, because I thought Birthright and Bloodlines were good episodes...

Anwar I don't know why people rip on "Birthright." I thought it was a good episode.

HaventGotALife wrote:

The bridge crew was too eager to please and behaved like they werre always under fire.

HaventGotALife please elaborate on the above statement. Are you saying they were too eager to follow the Captain's orders? It seems to me that they were just doing their jobs.

HaventGotALife wrote:

It wasn't as much of an ensemble as we like to portray.

HaventGotALife I agree that the "ensemble" became "Stewart/Spiner/Dorn." Not to the extreme that it became "Shatner/Nimoy/Kelley" on TOS but close.

Sho · February 5 2012, 04:32 PM

I think the "Birthright" two-parter may have been Worf's best outing in the franchise.

Anji · February 6 2012, 04:19 AM

There were too many characters in the beginning...and I think in another two or three edits of the piolet Gene and Dorothy would've seen their mistakes.

I heard there were some heated arguments between Roddenberry and Berman in regards to rearranging the characters, but I have never heard what each party wanted to do.

RAMA · February 6 2012, 04:20 AM

Later on they had Chief Obrien, Ensign Ro, Reg Barclay added to the mix.

RAMA

bullethead · February 6 2012, 04:26 AM

I think most of the problems with the characters had to do with the fact that people high up in the food chain were at odds with the staff writers. I know Maurice Hurley screwed over Tracey Torme's original script for The Royale and IIRC he blocked the writer for The Arsenal of Freedom from establishing a Picard/Crusher romance. In fact, his only good contribution that I know of is helping create the Borg.

February 4 2012, 07:47 AM	#1
The Overlord Captain	Did TNG have too many characters at first? Did TNG have too many characters at first? It seems like TNG got better after Tasha Yar died and they focused more on other characters like Worf, with one less character hogging the spotlight. It seems like at first there were too many characters to handle, Tasha Yar made Worf seem redundant. Also the series got even better after Wesley Cruhser was demoted to guest star. Last edited by The Overlord; February 4 2012 at 07:58 AM.

February 4 2012, 08:11 AM	#2
Sho Fleet Captain Location: Berlin, Germany	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? Well, just because they didn't know how to use them effectively, it doesn't mean there were too many characters in an absolute sense. DS9 did splendidly with a considerably larger ensemble. Rather, they had to many characters for the direction of storytelling they chose too adopt. TNG wasn't really a very character-driven show, especially early on before Piller came along, and there were too many characters for the little character time they had going around initially. __________________ TrekLit review threads, sorted by average score (discussion thread).

February 4 2012, 08:37 AM	#3
sojourner Vice Admiral Location: I'm at WKRP	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? I am sure the "equal screen time" clause that was in place for the tng actors didn't help either. Or was that just a myth? __________________ Baby, you and me were never meant to be, just maybe think of me once in a while...

February 4 2012, 05:12 PM	#4
Bisz Rear Admiral Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? I'm with Sho, other shows have managed to do very well with larger casts (DS9, Firefly). It all goes to what kind of show you are doing and TNG was a show about going places and doing things, not about characters developing. And that's where I agree with you Overlord, there was no need for both Tasha and Worf since there was no need for two security people. __________________ "In general, living kills you..."

February 4 2012, 05:22 PM	#5
BillJ Vice Admiral Location: Greater Cincinnati	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? If they had a larger cast we might've been spared such classics as Birthright, Sub Rosa, Inheritance and Bloodlines. __________________ J.J. Abrams didn't change Star Trek, audience expectations did.

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February 4 2012, 08:20 PM	#7
davejames Vice Admiral Location: Sac, Ca	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? I think the problem was more that Yar and Wesley just weren't terribly interesting characters. The writers clearly had a hard time thinking up good storylines for them, and it just made sense that they finally had to go. Of course Troi, Beverly, and George weren't all that interesting either, but they at least served a functional purpose on the show.

February 5 2012, 04:32 PM	#12
Sho Fleet Captain Location: Berlin, Germany	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? I think the "Birthright" two-parter may have been Worf's best outing in the franchise. __________________ TrekLit review threads, sorted by average score (discussion thread).

February 6 2012, 04:19 AM	#13
Anji Rear Admiral Location: Assisting in the birth of baby Horta on Janus VI	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? There were too many characters in the beginning...and I think in another two or three edits of the piolet Gene and Dorothy would've seen their mistakes. I heard there were some heated arguments between Roddenberry and Berman in regards to rearranging the characters, but I have never heard what each party wanted to do. __________________ "You may be wrong, but you may be right." - Billy Joel Last edited by Anji; February 6 2012 at 04:19 AM. Reason: clarity

February 6 2012, 04:20 AM	#14
RAMA Vice Admiral Location: NJ, USA	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? Later on they had Chief Obrien, Ensign Ro, Reg Barclay added to the mix. RAMA __________________ “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”—Stephen R. Covey

February 6 2012, 04:26 AM	#15
bullethead Fleet Captain	Re: Did TNG have too many characters at first? I think most of the problems with the characters had to do with the fact that people high up in the food chain were at odds with the staff writers. I know Maurice Hurley screwed over Tracey Torme's original script for The Royale and IIRC he blocked the writer for The Arsenal of Freedom from establishing a Picard/Crusher romance. In fact, his only good contribution that I know of is helping create the Borg. __________________ A business man and engineer discuss how to launch a communications satellite in the 1960s: *Biz Dev Guy*: Your communications satellite has to be the size, shape, and weight of a hydrogen bomb.