American Horror Story Discussion (Spoilers)

[Temis the Vorta]

This is essentially what Heroes should have done right?

No, because they did try bringing in new characters, and most of them sucked because the actors didn't work out. Heroes was an even worse case - they had a viable premise that could have been the basis of a strong series for many seasons, with that cast of characters, and they lucked out with the casting. A competent writing team should have been able to pull it off. They definitely couldn't depend on bringing in a strong cast every year to make up for bad writing (and why should the cast have to make up for the writing anyway?)

But in the case of AHS, the writers have run the premise into the ground. The only place they have to go now is a story of the antichrist and how he somehow threatens the ghosts in the house (if he triumphs, they go to hell, maybe?) But that would require contortions to make work, and it's probably better just to switch the scene to Roanoke or wherever.

The way I read this, Ryan Murphy is simply admitting his limitations. He can't sustain a story over time. That was obvious the way he'd pull sensationalistic rabbits out of the hat - Tate raped Vivien!!! - with no regard to its impact on the story - that fucks up Tate and Violet's relationship permanently. So for the sake of a single zinger scene with Tate taking off the rubber man mask, an ongoing plotline that could have evolved into something interesting was destroyed.

If that's how he handles things as a writer, then fine. Let's see if his anthology idea will fly. But there's a reason anthologies are scarce on TV - there's a widespread (and largely untested) assumption that audiences latch onto characters and watch shows for those characters.

Keeping the same actors might actually accomplish the same objective, who knows. I'm more interested in seeing this cast than I am in seeing more of these particular characters and I'm certainly not watching for the writing, which is largely garbage.

Here's an interesting tidbit of info.

The other advantage in casting the series as a yearly anthology, Murphy added, is that it increases the potential talent pool of performers. “There are a lot of actors who have their own careers and don’t want to make a five-year commitment. This gives people who haven’t done TV before an opportunity. Our shooting schedule is like three or four months every season, so it’s like commiting to a film really. I get a lot of calls from film actors who want to dabble in TV but don’t know how to do it. Being on a series where all of the characters’ stories are done after a season is a way in for them. That’s been the plan from the beginning with this show.”

So major characters next season could be played by well known movie actors. Probably people like Lange, who are getting a bit old for the movie biz. That could turn out to be interesting. Nonetheless, they need to keep Lange and Peters at the very least.

[Gothowitz]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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I'm not sure whether they've written themselves into a corner or not...

I'd say... not.
I think the link for futher seasons was presented early in the season.

Eternal Darkness Tour
"And the next stop on our tour of departed souls, the gem of mid-town: The Murder House."

[Temis the Vorta]

They've written themselves into a corner with those particular characters. That's why they need to switch locations. And I think the switch will be more radical than just moving to another house on the tour route - from the Deadline link:

The show’s second season will eschew the haunted house approach that proved so successful during the freshman season. Murphy insists, “There are all kinds of different American horror stories to tell. There are serial killing stories, prison stories, true crime stories…Each year of the show is designed to be a little miniseries unto itself. The only thing we’re not open to doing is a season on vampires.”

[Gothowitz]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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They've written themselves into a corner with those particular characters. That's why they need to switch locations. And I think the switch will be more radical than just moving to another house on the tour route

They tied in The Black Dahlia to The Murder House.
Sal Mineo was also on the Tour of Eternal Darkness. (Serial Killing/True Crime Story as per your quote?)
Neither were "houses", just stops along the tour of departed souls.

What else and who else is on the tour? And would they tie in or not? Maybe some will, maybe some won't. Maybe only parts of next Season's story will lead back to The Murder House as Black Dahlia did; seemingly ephemeral in nature. If they did, then you can have occasional returning characters from Season 1.

Although I found the comment about some Season 1 actors playing different roles in Season 2 curious.
Truly doomed souls. Pre-incarnations?

All fun speculation.

Yay! No vampires. Frankenbabies!
Next stop on the Tour of Eternal Darkness... The Munster's House.

[Temis the Vorta]

The murder tour is about houses. If the show isn't doing a haunted house, what is it doing? My bet is that next season won't even be in Los Angeles. Roanoke, here we come.

[Gothowitz]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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The murder tour is about houses.

I mentioned Sal Mineo as being on the tour as is stated in Episode 3: The Murder House.
Not a house, but an alley. Although I suppose the alley might be a "home" to some of the homeless.

Roanoke may figure in for something else (or not); flashbacks maybe? It was mentioned for a reason: Croatoan as a "Go Away" spell. That worked really well as I recall.
"Go Away" worked so much better though.

The wait for Season 2 is not going to be fun.

[Gryffindorian]

Now that I think about it, I don't mind seeing an anthology series. Question is, if they're keeping some of the cast members, will those characters have the same roles, e.g., Jessica Lange as Constance? I surely hope she comes back. She owns that show!

[Temis the Vorta]

I can't see S2 taking place in an alley! At the very least, they'll need some location to build the story around (and build sets for), and it's not going to be a house, so it's going to have to be a prison, lunatic asylum or the site of a lost colony. A haunted hotel would also be a fun idea (but hasn't figured into any of the clues).

I don't think the idea is to bring back any of the characters, so Jessica Lange and the rest would be playing someone completely different.

[Gothowitz]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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I can't see S2 taking place in an alley!

You're funny!
No, I was pointing out that you mentioned the Tour of Eternal Darkness was about houses when it isn't.

They could continue the Constance storyline easily by having part of the next storyline, or even most of the next storyline, about a young Constance intercut with current Constance and how things tie together there.

Maybe we get a peek into the Manson Family murders or Hillside Stranglers as part of the next story, or some other neat twist like The Grim Sleeper or The Night Stalker as backdrop stories to tie into the main story like The Black Dahlia did.

Sal Mineo was mentioned simply due to the fact that he was on the tour and not a house location; but the plotline didn't go anywhere with that except maybe as a possible seed for the next Season?

There really are many ways for them to go. Considering how it is next to impossible to keep spoilers from the internet, we'll have more to consider after they begin casting.

[1001001]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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The kid's a ghost baby, they're all dead, the Harmons haven't solved any of their issues that they had at the beginning, unless the message is that death solves everything. Wow, lazy.

I disagree. They did tell a complete story, as I saw it.

The family was broken, and they moved to Los Angeles to try and repair it. And they did. The scene at the Christmas tree was the closure. They found their love for each other again. They all just had to die to figure it out.

They worked together to save the new family, and agreed they would continue doing so. They are not bitter or lost (like poor Nora).

Now of course it's not all wrapped up, and there are things to think about and speculate about (like the Damien kid, or Hayden's presence). Death doesn't solve everything, but it does put everything into perspective.

Overall, I say it was a fun, creepy season. I am not sure about the future direction. It sounds very odd to me. But then again, I'm already on the bandwagon. Might as well go for the whole ride.

[Temis the Vorta]

It wasn't a complete story because they didn't address the elements that tore the family apart - Ben's infidelity and lies, not to mention Violet's betrayal of her mother by lying and getting her thrown into a looney bin. That family still has plenty of issues to work through, and their story is not over. The writers ran out of time to tell their story, which is not the same thing as bringing the story to a conclusion.

And there was more sloppiness like that all over the place - Nora's whole thing as a character was wanting a baby. Yet when she gets one, she doesn't care. Why? Because the story was over and the writers didn't want to deal with it.

A coherent story has an ending that relates to the beginning in some significant and worthwhile way. This wasn't a story, it was just a sequence of events.

The family was broken, and they moved to Los Angeles to try and repair it. And they did.

They did, because of writer fiat, that's all, and that's not nearly enough for it to be a story, unless you define a story of any sequence of events whatsoever. For the writers to just tell us "and they lived happily ever after" is not the same as showing us, and convincing us, by actually providing a plotline that does that.

This is just a retread of what George Lucas did with the PT. He wanted to tell a story, and I know what story he wanted to tell. But he didn't succeed. The story wasn't actually there. I'm not willing to accept any sequence of events as a story, because it does a disservice to the actual talented writers who are capable of telling a coherent and worthwhile story. I can tell the difference between a worthwhile story and lazy crap.

[1001001]

Vorta Claus wrote:

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I can tell the difference between a worthwhile story and lazy crap.

And I can tell the difference between a ripping good yarn and pretentious art school snobbery.

[Gryffindorian]

Well, this will be the first week in a long time without a new episode to look forward. Just how long exactly are we supposed to wait for Season 2?

[1001001]

Here's a cool article about AHS. I think it reflects my views pretty nicely...

http://news.yahoo.com/essay-american...121304975.html

[Enterprise is Great]

http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/news/Ame...Season-1/17212

Season one out on DVD and Blu-Ray September 23rd.