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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old December 21 2011, 06:34 PM   #1
The Overlord
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Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I saw an interesting video that suggested Dukat should have died during Waltz, that his character arc was complete by that episode and keeping around after that diluted the character and made him less interesting. Would you agree or disagree with that?

http://blip.tv/sf-debris-opinionated...-dukat-5829507
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Old December 21 2011, 07:48 PM   #2
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

from an in-series perspective I'd say no, since this episode was more of a start for a new arc for him than a conclusion to the character overall.

From a meta-perspective, I'd say yes, since this was the start of some serious character assassination that turned Dukat into a one-note uninteresting crazed supervillain type of character.
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Old December 21 2011, 08:02 PM   #3
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I'd say no, just because Dukat as a character is such a brilliantly realized villain (or not even that,more antagonist than ultimate evil) that to kill him off would be a shame indeed.

I'd even go so far as to say that Marc Alaimo has the acting chops to make insane Dark Messiah Dukat actually watchable despite the fact that it did turn him into a Satanistic super-villain of DOOM. So almost any type of Dukat would have worked in DS9.

Not that there wasn't a different route to take, what if Dukat hadn't joined the Pah-wraith but instead had remained a rouge potent force of chaos? Perhaps he would end up leading The True Way againist both the Federation, Bajor and the Dominion...
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Last edited by Thor Damar; December 21 2011 at 08:19 PM. Reason: Dukat was never the hero after all...
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Old December 21 2011, 08:18 PM   #4
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

sonak wrote: View Post
from an in-series perspective I'd say no, since this episode was more of a start for a new arc for him than a conclusion to the character overall.

From a meta-perspective, I'd say yes, since this was the start of some serious character assassination that turned Dukat into a one-note uninteresting crazed supervillain type of character.
I agree with this. I would have loved more Dukat after "Waltz," but the Dukat we got was just not very interesting.
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Old December 21 2011, 09:46 PM   #5
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I thought Dukat was at his best manipulating the Kai into helping him release the Pah-wraith. I loved the scenes where he feigned respect for her.
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Old December 21 2011, 10:19 PM   #6
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

toughlittleship wrote: View Post
I thought Dukat was at his best manipulating the Kai into helping him release the Pah-wraith. I loved the scenes where he feigned respect for her.
Me too. I also consider "Covenant" to be a highlight of Marc Alaimo's acting. Having seen footage of real cult leaders, to me it is very clear he did his homework on that one. It came off very creepy and convincing.

Even a slightly lesser actor could not have pulled off those post-"Waltz" scripts, but given the calibre of the actor, no, I don't regret the fact that Dukat survived "Waltz."
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Old December 22 2011, 04:16 AM   #7
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I thought the Pa-wraith stuff was really crap and I think him dying in Waltz might have been pretty good.
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Old December 22 2011, 12:12 PM   #8
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

Disagree
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Old December 22 2011, 03:42 PM   #9
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I agree. Him dying would have been so much better than him becoming an insane cultist.

He basically did die, though, because he wasn't Dukat anymore.
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Old December 23 2011, 05:37 PM   #10
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I don't know, I thought he did the insane cult leader bit pretty well.
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Old December 24 2011, 01:51 AM   #11
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

No ... while I dislike how simplistic his character became, it's preferable than conjuring some brand new mustache-twirling villain to fill his role in later episodes.

The better question is: After "Waltz", how would you have liked to see his character develop and evolve?
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Old December 24 2011, 03:04 AM   #12
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

I'm not a huge fan of "Waltz" in general. Dukat going crazy is just silly. Honestly, I would have loved to see it go the complete opposite direction, with Dukat becoming more of a good guy, seeking redemption, possibly even helping Sisko on his path as the Emissary. I think that would have been a whole lot more interesting than what we got.
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Old December 24 2011, 04:32 AM   #13
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

Agreed. He was too complex a character to become a one note villain. It was a shame, because I always felt that despite some of his more terrible actions, that Dukat had the capacity to be a good person.
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Old December 24 2011, 04:33 AM   #14
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

In fact, my favorite Dukat moments are the ones where he and Sisko bond over the things they have in common.
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Old December 24 2011, 04:35 AM   #15
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Re: Should Dukat have died during Waltz?

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
In fact, my favorite Dukat moments are the ones where he and Sisko bond over the things they have in common.
Agreed, and on that same note, when Sisko and Dukat would be at odds with one another, the interplay was terrific to watch.
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