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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Deep Space Nine

Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old December 17 2011, 12:51 AM   #526
Ln X
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Yeah dah good stuff is coming! We're all like junkies waiting for our fix! Well the 'fix' is The Maquis, Part 1!
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Old December 17 2011, 01:15 AM   #527
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Actually, the dreck of season 2 wasn't so bad, once I got to Whispers things were okay, and this season was far easier to get through than season 1. The big thing I'm curious about is where season 3 will rate compared to season 2 because I've felt for a while that season 2 had a bit of an edge on season 3, which seems likely to be the case as season 2 is better than I remember.
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Old December 17 2011, 02:11 AM   #528
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

I rewatched "Shadowplay" after the review and realized that it did quite a bit of the "is a hologram real life stuff" before the Doctor got involved. It reminded me of my episode idea for Voyager where a crewmember secrety replicates the holo-emitter and creates a hologram of his dead girlfriend who he tries to pass off as the real article to the rest of the crew.
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Old December 17 2011, 04:26 AM   #529
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Ln X wrote: View Post
The only really good bit was Kira describing to Jadzia what it was like killing someone. The directing in that scene was superb, with both Kira and Jadzia sounding rather nervous (initially) when Jadzia broods about carrying through this blood oath.
I think that Kira and Jadzia work well together whenever the scene sets up a contrast between the two, their perceptions and their backgrounds. Another example is their holodeck time in Way of the Warrior. Jadzia's the "privileged" woman who grew up on a prosperous planet (and is in the minority elite of her culture, no less, by being Joined) and whose trials and personal demons stem from introspective self-doubt and failures to live up to her full potential. Kira, of course, is the woman from a war-torn world who struggled through hell to get where she is and whose demons are grounded in circumstance, external reality, and the trauma of action and experience. I really do wish the two characters had more screen time together, because these scenes where their backgrounds and the women they became because of them are thrown together are usually intriguing. It would have been nice if the writers took advantage of that set-up more often. But I suppose with Worf's arrival Jadzia-as-party-Klingon took over and "introspective Jadzia struggling with being the elite of a priviliged culture" was largely set aside.

The scene Ln X describes is a perfect example of how Jadzia could benefit from Kira's insight, just as the holodeck scene in Way of the Warrior shows how Jadzia can positively influence Kira. I'm surprised more wasn't made of the potential here.
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Old December 17 2011, 04:30 AM   #530
Nerys Ghemor
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

I couldn't stand "Blood Oath"--I think from this point, the writers forgot to write Jadzia as a character in her own right and made her a Curzon clone instead.
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Old December 17 2011, 04:33 AM   #531
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

TheGodBen wrote: View Post
Actually, the dreck of season 2 wasn't so bad, once I got to Whispers things were okay, and this season was far easier to get through than season 1. The big thing I'm curious about is where season 3 will rate compared to season 2 because I've felt for a while that season 2 had a bit of an edge on season 3, which seems likely to be the case as season 2 is better than I remember.
Your season two reviews were delightful. Whenever my life outside of the BBS gets too real I go back and read some of them just to smile and laugh. So thank you for that.
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Old December 17 2011, 04:44 AM   #532
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Nerys Ghemor wrote: View Post
I couldn't stand "Blood Oath"--I think from this point, the writers forgot to write Jadzia as a character in her own right and made her a Curzon clone instead.

Say what you will about the focus that season 7 spent on Ezri early on, but at least she was different.
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Old December 17 2011, 04:53 AM   #533
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Yeah, I do think Jadzia was underwritten
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Old December 17 2011, 05:55 AM   #534
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Ln X wrote: View Post
This may be a little late but I've had some thoughts about Paradise and this proves how the plot just falls apart.

...

The next thing is the duonetic field itself, there does not seem to be an indication that it covers the whole planet. Indeed the device does not seem big enough to generate a field that size. So eventually those people from the crashed ship should have fanned out to find a spot where their technology WOULD work.
That's another major problem I have with the episode. I can't accept that nobody ever ventured out to see if they could use their technology elsewhere. Even if we accept that they think it's because of naturally occurring mineral deposits, the whole planet isn't covered by them. Gather some food and start moving. It isn't that hard.

The only explanation I can give it is that Alixus, being the power-hungry tyrant she is, immediately forced everyone to stay in the crash area.

You_Will_Fail wrote: View Post
I rewatched "Shadowplay" after the review and realized that it did quite a bit of the "is a hologram real life stuff" before the Doctor got involved. It reminded me of my episode idea for Voyager where a crewmember secrety replicates the holo-emitter and creates a hologram of his dead girlfriend who he tries to pass off as the real article to the rest of the crew.
That's something that always bothered me when Vic Fontaine showed up in the last seasons. Shadowplay goes out of it's why to show that holograms can be sentient just as organic beings can be, yet everyone either has to convinced that Vic is "alive" or never accept it. But then, I never got the whole "holograms can't be real" argument, either here or on VOY. This is a society that fully accepts an android as an equal. Accepting sentient holograms shouldn't be that big of a jump for them.


As for Blood Oath, I'm sort of with Nerys on this one. This is clearly a departure point for the character of Dax - she's not the same after this one and is indeed simply a Curzon clone. And it's her characterization after this that really turns me off to the character (not that I was a big fan of her before). However, I do enjoy this episode for other elements. Kang, Kor and Koloth are great and seeing them together is excellent as they really play off each other well.

And, to be nitpicky, what exactly was the Albino? Was he a Klingon? Because he doesn't look like any Klingon we've seen otherwise, and I don't just mean his skin color. If anything, I'd have to say he looks like a Tellarite/Klingon hybrid.
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Old December 17 2011, 06:13 AM   #535
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

I think the Albino was intended to be a Klingon, but I agree that he doesn't look very Klingony. Maybe he was disfigured in addition to being an albino.

As for Jadzia, I found her dreadfully boring before "Blood Oath," so it never particularly bothered me that she turned into Curzon 2.0. I thought she was a lot more fun from that point on.
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Old December 17 2011, 06:16 AM   #536
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

It's also that he seems to hate all Klingons - calling Kang, Kor and Koloth "that Klingon scum" for example. So, unless he's got a self-hating complex (which would make some sense if he's only half-Klingon) than it makes more sense for him to be another species.
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Old December 17 2011, 06:17 AM   #537
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Deranged Nasat wrote: View Post
I think that Kira and Jadzia work well together whenever the scene sets up a contrast between the two, their perceptions and their backgrounds.
I am not a fan of Jadzia but I probably liked the scenes between her and Kira the best, I enjoyed watching them pilot the runabouts and shuttles and just having a general respect each other.
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Old December 17 2011, 06:18 AM   #538
Jar Jar Binks
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Admiral Shran wrote: View Post
It's also that he seems to hate all Klingons - calling Kang, Kor and Koloth "that Klingon scum" for example. So, unless he's got a self-hating complex (which would make some sense if he's only half-Klingon) than it makes more sense for him to be another species.
Maybe he came from a subject race of the Klingon Empire.

Or maybe he was half-Tellarite.
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Old December 17 2011, 06:20 AM   #539
Admiral Shran
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

Hanukkah Solo wrote: View Post
Maybe he came from a subject race of the Klingon Empire.
That's a good point. I never thought of that.

Do any of the non-canon books explore his background?
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Old December 17 2011, 10:25 AM   #540
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Re: TheGodBen Revisits Deep Space Nine

The novel Forged In Fire, while mostly being about Sulu gaining command of Excelsior, focuses heavily on the origins of the Albino. It's been a while since I've read it, so my memory's a little sketchy, but from what I recall, he's Klingon, the albino-ness stemming from his mother attempting to cure the Augment virus if not for herself then for her son, because it would let him claim his family name and position.

I'll agree about the under-development of Jadzia as a separate character from Dax. I happen to love her, but I openly admit that it's pretty clear that there was a better understanding of who Curzon was than who Jadzia was, so they just made her Curzon-lite. It'd be interesting to have seen her question if she was still Jadzia or if Dax or Curzon had overwhelmed her. Don't we even see that to a small extent in Season 3's Facets? Would have been nice if it had led to a story for Jadzia. Ah well. Missed opportunities and all that.
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