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Old November 13 2011, 11:26 PM   #61
M'rk, son of Mogh
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

T'Girl wrote: View Post
TNG, The Child. Allow me to clarify, the ship couldn't use it's faster than light warp drive to move between star systems owing to the power demands of the replicator.
You mean the bio-containment module used to transport the virus strands?

That's not a replicator.
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Old November 14 2011, 12:48 AM   #62
Deks
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Actually, I recall the instance when Geordi informed Picard that they would have to use a lot of replicators (all of them if I'm not mistaken) to create numerous things in terms of containment for the viral particles and as a result the ship couldn't go to Warp because power was being taken by the replicators.
It WAS also mentioned that replicators do use a lot of power.
HOWEVER... this is a singular example of when there was a large demand on the replicators... and on a SHIP no less.
On the planets surface, a fusion based generator would provide MORE than enough power to a single replicator because a starship has a warp core with finite reserves (renewable of course through various methods, but probably not to the level of a planet bound energy source) and a TON of other systems that need to be simultaneously powered.

If each house has a fusion based generator, you can probably run have several replicators connected to it.
They would never be used ALL the time either way because you'd only replicate things you actually need at specific intervals.
My point is that powering a house which is planet bound that has a replicator is NOT A PROBLEM.
Whereas a ship might be due to power reserves.
It's usually not the issue if ships are close to Federation space.
Voyager was intentionally rationing their replicator use because they were low on power already, and other times they were replicating no problem either way.
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Old November 14 2011, 01:08 AM   #63
BillJ
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

M'rk, son of Mogh wrote:

And money is obviously not a part of that, from everything the characters have always said.
You have a few instances of them mentioning that the Federation doesn't use money, everything else from TOS to the TNG pilot to DS9 to Voyager to Enterprise have mentioned the use of money.

I think it fair to say the "no money" wasn't one of the "weird rules", whether Gene personally believe in the philosophy or not Trek under his watch didn't use it.
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Old November 14 2011, 06:52 AM   #64
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Here is a complete list of all pro money and anti money references.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/in...es/economy.htm
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Old November 14 2011, 05:39 PM   #65
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Admiral M wrote: View Post
The Ferengi were pretty much depicted as "space pirates" in their first appearances. Roddenberry was still involved with the show at this time and I think that pretty much renders that "rule" void.

It seems that the main thing that Roddenberry was against was depicting the Federation at war. He reasoned that war was something that the humans of Trek would have left behind and therefore there would always be ways for the Federation to settle any conflict without going to war.

He was also really against any internal plotting and conspiracies where the Federation was concerned. The episode "Conspiracy" of TNG's first season was originally going to be about an actually conspiracy that was free of alien influence. According to some sources, Roddenberry wouldn't allow this and it was rewritten to include the alien invasion. It's also claimed that Roddenberry had been screened TUC just prior to his death and when the film had concluded he planned on contacting his lawyers. Others say that Roddenberry enjoyed the movie, despite it's "anti-trek" plot.

The Dominion War arc in DS9 was something that had never been done in Star Trek and it was a big risk. Fortunately, the risk paid off and many consider the arc to have produced some of the finest episodes of the franchise. The episode "In The Pale Moonlight" is considered by some to be the greatest episode of the franchise, despite it being almost completely "non-trek".

Apparently, Roddenberry disagreed with the decision to kill off Spock in TWOK so much, that he was rumored to have leaked the death scene to the media with the hope that fans would boycott the movie. I'm not sure what his motivations for doing this would be, but perhaps not having any decision in killing off a character that he created may have served as a reason if this story is true.
I've read/heard all kinds of insane stories about Roddenberry and the six Trek movies. I read once that he was even upset with IV, because it wasn't the exact same time-travel idea that he had been pitching.

Something like that.
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Old November 15 2011, 01:45 AM   #66
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

brian577 wrote: View Post
Here is a complete list of all pro money and anti money references.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/in...es/economy.htm
The anti-matter thing really makes life easier for people...once they found a way to harness the energy. They found a way to stabalize it somehow. [chuckle] But is it common enough where they use the dilithium crystal much for the replicators, or is it only mostly for space traveling?
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Old November 15 2011, 04:37 AM   #67
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Paradon wrote: View Post
brian577 wrote: View Post
Here is a complete list of all pro money and anti money references.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/in...es/economy.htm
The anti-matter thing really makes life easier for people...once they found a way to harness the energy. They found a way to stabalize it somehow. [chuckle] But is it common enough where they use the dilithium crystal much for the replicators, or is it only mostly for space traveling?
Actually dilithium IS what stabilizes antimatter
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Old November 15 2011, 03:02 PM   #68
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

brian577 wrote: View Post
Paradon wrote: View Post
brian577 wrote: View Post
Here is a complete list of all pro money and anti money references.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/in...es/economy.htm
The anti-matter thing really makes life easier for people...once they found a way to harness the energy. They found a way to stabalize it somehow. [chuckle] But is it common enough where they use the dilithium crystal much for the replicators, or is it only mostly for space traveling?
Actually dilithium IS what stabilizes antimatter
I thought dilithium was the focal point of the matter/anti-matter interaction? Channeling the newly created energy to the warp nacelles.
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Old November 15 2011, 03:34 PM   #69
Deks
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Dilitihum is used to focus M/AM reactions as described in early TNG.
It's not a power source though... and I would imagine it's possible to replicate, but it's molecular structure could be sufficiently taxing on energy reserves to make it impractical.
Instead, they can recrystalize it for extended use, and of course mine the rest.

Replicators were said that they can make fully powered weapons such as phasers, which happen to contain their own energy source.
It stands to reason a replicator would be able to do this. It uses specific amount of energy which will be turned into matter (phaser) and another smaller portion of it is rearranged into a form used by the weapon which is immediately integrated into the energy storage area upon materialization.
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Old November 20 2011, 01:43 AM   #70
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

The Dominion wrote: View Post
because the government handles the major resources
I would imagine that we all see the future "utopia" through our own eyes.
The thought of your that I quoted is just plain scary.

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Old November 24 2011, 01:40 PM   #71
Arpy
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Consider that technology has made it unnecessary for humans to work or trade much at all. Ships clean themselves...maybe all buildings do. Ships can perform automated repairs...maybe all pieces of technology (communicators to whole cities) can repair themselves without manual support.

No one goes hungry, thirsty, cold, or uneducated given replicator and computer interfaces. No one needs to leave a planet, or in some cases a room to see arrays of wonders that would shame our greatest explorers. Ships can navigate and repair and run themselves with no crew save one to command them - I wonder if there are AI contingencies for what the ships are to do in the case of the whole crew being out of commission.

People aren't all that necessary to keep this level of technology, of society, going. They are freed up to contemplate things. And they play and fiddle with technologies to understand them so as to make better versions.

Perhaps people are leaders, innovators, researchers, and occasional specialist...where the transporter may need a cheif there to work some artful science the machine can't automate.

It seems to me though that that life is pretty swank, and that traditional employment vs. traditional consumption dynamics will be different here.

Hell, Trek doesn't even address the very real world AI's that'll be everywhere, and our eventual immortalities plugging in to benign Matrixes and Collectives.

...Economics will change - lets just try to remember to change them for the better. New economies, like all new frontiers are settled and acted upon by both saints and sinners.
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Old November 24 2011, 09:07 PM   #72
T'Girl
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

Arpy wrote: View Post
No one needs to leave [snip] a room to see arrays of wonders that would shame our greatest explorers.
No, looking at a monitor showing a mountain, or employing a holodeck, is hardly the same as actually traveling to a mountain, and perhap even climbing it.

The only shame a great explorer would feel is that someone in the future might think that it's all the same.

By the example of the shows, the ships may be able to clean themselves to an limited extent, but are incapable of maintaining and repairing themselves.

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Old November 25 2011, 01:40 PM   #73
Arpy
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Re: Gene Roddenberry's weird rules

I get your meaning but lets not romanticize exploration. An absolutely realistic holo recreation of Everest or offworld hotspots is just as fine as taking a trip there yourself. ...That is not taking into account any interest in meeting the locals - only being interested in the physical feat.

Real explorers (interested in publishing new discoveries) in the future are in Starfleet or on some new colony world by themselves...that includes populated world in which the exploration is interacting with sophisticated foreign cultures and publishing My Time in Suburbia on Cardassia Prime.
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