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Old October 11 2011, 02:33 AM   #346
J. Allen
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

T'Boo wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Well, at least they're paying attention to their customers this time.
No, their stockholders.

If they were listening to their customers, their price increase might have been 25%, not 60%.

So they have "one company" for both DVDs and streaming. BFD. Does nothing for me. 60% price increase meant I had to change my plan. Either pay more for the same product, or else adjust my plan (getting less product) for the same price (which is the same as paying more...)

No win for the customer. None whatsoever. So those of you keeping both streaming and DVD don't have to log into two different sites. Whoop de fucking doo.
Which may simply be a diversionary tactic anyway. Appease someone over a non-existent plot of land, and you win more square acreage while making the customer think you're listening to them and giving ground.

Netflix: "We're raising prices and eating babies!"
Customer: "What?! That's wrong!"
Netflix: "You're right. Eating babies is wrong. We won't eat any babies, and after this, no more price increases! See? We listen!"
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Old October 11 2011, 03:48 AM   #347
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
Captain Craig wrote: View Post
I got an email directly from Netflix indicating the service split into two sites is indeed true.
I got an email today saying they changed the plan. Qwikster isn't happening.
That's what I meant. I didn't proof read my comment. I see the confusion. I meant the email confirms the split isn't happening.
My bad.
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Old October 11 2011, 05:42 AM   #348
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Guartho wrote: View Post
bigdaddy wrote: View Post
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Well, at least they're paying attention to their customers this time.

If they really knew anything they should have seen the issues before announcing it.
True, but there are so many CEOs who would've stayed the course anyway, being too proud, too stupid, or too both to admit they were going down the wrong path big time.
QFT.
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Old October 15 2011, 08:52 PM   #349
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

So, they had a p.r. disaster. Big deal. It's not worth the loss of half their stock value. The company's business is still solid. Investors will come back.
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Old October 16 2011, 01:58 AM   #350
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Snaploud wrote: View Post
So, they had a p.r. disaster. Big deal. It's not worth the loss of half their stock value. The company's business is still solid. Investors will come back.
As someone who did sell the stock, I would say there are SOME of those things DO effect the value of the company. Because of the handling of the rise in prices, MORE customers left than they had thought, some turning to other services. AND now that they are losing STARZ, that's a sizable chunk of content.

And the guy that's in charge... he's driving the car very poorly. I think investors will come back... slowly... but the mistakes this year aren't something to just ignore.
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Old October 16 2011, 06:53 PM   #351
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
Snaploud wrote: View Post
So, they had a p.r. disaster. Big deal. It's not worth the loss of half their stock value. The company's business is still solid. Investors will come back.
As someone who did sell the stock, I would say there are SOME of those things DO effect the value of the company. Because of the handling of the rise in prices, MORE customers left than they had thought, some turning to other services. AND now that they are losing STARZ, that's a sizable chunk of content.

And the guy that's in charge... he's driving the car very poorly. I think investors will come back... slowly... but the mistakes this year aren't something to just ignore.
Don't get me wrong. I would have sold my stock just like everybody else. Investor panic shouldn't be ignored. I just think now is probably a good time to buy back in.
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Old October 16 2011, 11:34 PM   #352
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Snaploud wrote: View Post
Professor Zoom wrote: View Post
Snaploud wrote: View Post
So, they had a p.r. disaster. Big deal. It's not worth the loss of half their stock value. The company's business is still solid. Investors will come back.
As someone who did sell the stock, I would say there are SOME of those things DO effect the value of the company. Because of the handling of the rise in prices, MORE customers left than they had thought, some turning to other services. AND now that they are losing STARZ, that's a sizable chunk of content.

And the guy that's in charge... he's driving the car very poorly. I think investors will come back... slowly... but the mistakes this year aren't something to just ignore.
Don't get me wrong. I would have sold my stock just like everybody else. Investor panic shouldn't be ignored. I just think now is probably a good time to buy back in.
Perhaps. I've thought about it.

However, ANOTHER interpretation: Netflix's stock was overvalued at it's high of close to 300.
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Old October 19 2011, 09:41 PM   #353
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Vdio, possible Netflix competitor?

I don't see why Vdio would be able to avoid Netflix's dilemma: that the content producers realize that cheap streaming undermines their business model, and that they are facing the same apocalypse that has already hit the music business - that the value of content inexorably sinks towards zero when it becomes digital - and will fight like holy hell to stave off the inevitable.

Content producers currently are very powerful and will remain so for the time being. Netflix is relatively weak, and Vdio certainly has no potential that I can see to have more clout. In the long run, the content producers will lose this contest, but they aren't close to losing yet.
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Old October 20 2011, 03:39 AM   #354
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

Temis the Bleeding Aorta wrote: View Post
I don't see why Vdio would be able to avoid Netflix's dilemma: that the content producers realize that cheap streaming undermines their business model, and that they are facing the same apocalypse that has already hit the music business - that the value of content inexorably sinks towards zero when it becomes digital - and will fight like holy hell to stave off the inevitable.
It could be something similar to Amazon's MP3 store being given a sweetheart deal by the music companies (lower prices, no DRM) to help break Apple's popularity with the iTunes Music Store and reduce their negotiating power. Netflix doesn't have quite as solid a bargaining position as Apple did, but it's still the king of movie rentals, and the way things are (well, were) going, its popularity with customers and, thus, influence over the studios can only go up.

(On the other hand, that apparently wasn't very effective against Apple. While they did ultimately cave on variable pricing, they got universal DRM-free tracks for their trouble).
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Old October 20 2011, 09:19 AM   #355
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

The note posted on Amazon.com's front page this morning:

Amazon.com wrote:
Dear Customers,

We have more good news for Amazon Prime members – Prime Instant Video is growing again. We've now licensed TV programs from PBS including day-after broadcast shows like Frontline and NOVA, more than 1,000 episodes of shows like Masterpiece, Antiques Roadshow, and popular Ken Burns documentaries The Civil War, Baseball, Jazz, and, for a limited time, the first episode of Prohibition.

PBS joins recently announced FOX television shows 24, Arrested Development, The X-Files, Ally McBeal, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and The Wonder Years.
Coming soon, we'll be adding Malcolm in the Middle, King of the Hill, and episodes from Julia Child's classic cooking series, The French Chef. We continue to add new Prime Instant Video titles to our catalog at no additional cost. Prime membership remains $79 a year.

Looks like somebody's upping the game just a bit. I mean, sure, they're a long way off from taking Netflix down, but this is just a sign of what Netflix stands to lose if they can't hold it together as the race really begins.
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Old October 20 2011, 03:28 PM   #356
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

J. Allen wrote: View Post
T'Boo wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Well, at least they're paying attention to their customers this time.
No, their stockholders.

If they were listening to their customers, their price increase might have been 25%, not 60%.

So they have "one company" for both DVDs and streaming. BFD. Does nothing for me. 60% price increase meant I had to change my plan. Either pay more for the same product, or else adjust my plan (getting less product) for the same price (which is the same as paying more...)

No win for the customer. None whatsoever. So those of you keeping both streaming and DVD don't have to log into two different sites. Whoop de fucking doo.
Which may simply be a diversionary tactic anyway. Appease someone over a non-existent plot of land, and you win more square acreage while making the customer think you're listening to them and giving ground.

Netflix: "We're raising prices and eating babies!"
Customer: "What?! That's wrong!"
Netflix: "You're right. Eating babies is wrong. We won't eat any babies, and after this, no more price increases! See? We listen!"
Y'know, this makes a LOT of sense - never looked at it from that angle, but it definitely makes serious sense. It effectively misdirects almost everyone's attention away from the price gouge. This may have been their plan all along.

A shame, really. They were a breakthrough small company that built and grew through real innovation. Now, in the past couple of years, it seems like all the folks that originally created it have cashed out and moved on, and all that's left are the kids running the candy store.
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Old October 20 2011, 08:45 PM   #357
Temis the Vorta
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

J. Allen wrote: View Post
The note posted on Amazon.com's front page this morning:

Amazon.com wrote:
Dear Customers,

We have more good news for Amazon Prime members – Prime Instant Video is growing again. We've now licensed TV programs from PBS including day-after broadcast shows like Frontline and NOVA, more than 1,000 episodes of shows like Masterpiece, Antiques Roadshow, and popular Ken Burns documentaries The Civil War, Baseball, Jazz, and, for a limited time, the first episode of Prohibition.

PBS joins recently announced FOX television shows 24, Arrested Development, The X-Files, Ally McBeal, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and The Wonder Years.
Coming soon, we'll be adding Malcolm in the Middle, King of the Hill, and episodes from Julia Child's classic cooking series, The French Chef. We continue to add new Prime Instant Video titles to our catalog at no additional cost. Prime membership remains $79 a year.

Looks like somebody's upping the game just a bit. I mean, sure, they're a long way off from taking Netflix down, but this is just a sign of what Netflix stands to lose if they can't hold it together as the race really begins.
The value to me of Netflix is the ability to get pretty much anything that's been released on DVD (that I've heard of anyway). I'm not interested in signing up for a Chinese menu of competing services, each with a different lineup. Life is complicated enough.

137th Gebirg wrote: View Post
J. Allen wrote: View Post
T'Boo wrote: View Post

No, their stockholders.

If they were listening to their customers, their price increase might have been 25%, not 60%.

So they have "one company" for both DVDs and streaming. BFD. Does nothing for me. 60% price increase meant I had to change my plan. Either pay more for the same product, or else adjust my plan (getting less product) for the same price (which is the same as paying more...)

No win for the customer. None whatsoever. So those of you keeping both streaming and DVD don't have to log into two different sites. Whoop de fucking doo.
Which may simply be a diversionary tactic anyway. Appease someone over a non-existent plot of land, and you win more square acreage while making the customer think you're listening to them and giving ground.

Netflix: "We're raising prices and eating babies!"
Customer: "What?! That's wrong!"
Netflix: "You're right. Eating babies is wrong. We won't eat any babies, and after this, no more price increases! See? We listen!"
Y'know, this makes a LOT of sense - never looked at it from that angle, but it definitely makes serious sense. It effectively misdirects almost everyone's attention away from the price gouge. This may have been their plan all along.
If it was all a diversionary tactic, it was the stupidest one in the history of diversionary tactics.

Nah, it was plain ole incompetence, a massive PR blunder. Netlfix has a problem - content providers are not going along with their game plan to move their business from DVDs in the mail to streaming, and Netflix doesn't have nearly the power to strongarm them. They should have let their customers understand that they, Netflix, is not at fault in this situation.

They could have diverted customer ire towards the studios by pretending to go along with Starz' arrogant insistence that its Sony and Disney titles be priced at a premium. Customers will never accept this, of course. When you walk into a movie theater, do you expect to pay more for a movie produced by Sony than by Universal or Paramount?

Nobody pays attention to what studio produces anything. Studios can't insist on premium pricing for products that the consumer does not regard as premium or even different from competitors. (This strategy might possibly work for Disney, which is unusual among studios in having a unique image.)

But Netflix could have played along and priced Sony and Disney at a premium, making damn sure that customers understood that it was coming from the studios, not from them. And then watch in glee as everyone deletes Sony and Disney movies from their queues. That would undermine the studios' delusional contention that they have the ability to price their products at a premium, which strengthens Netflix' hand.
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Old October 20 2011, 08:56 PM   #358
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

J. Allen wrote: View Post
The note posted on Amazon.com's front page this morning:

Amazon.com wrote:
Dear Customers,

We have more good news for Amazon Prime members – Prime Instant Video is growing again. We've now licensed TV programs from PBS including day-after broadcast shows like Frontline and NOVA, more than 1,000 episodes of shows like Masterpiece, Antiques Roadshow, and popular Ken Burns documentaries The Civil War, Baseball, Jazz, and, for a limited time, the first episode of Prohibition.

PBS joins recently announced FOX television shows 24, Arrested Development, The X-Files, Ally McBeal, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and The Wonder Years.
Coming soon, we'll be adding Malcolm in the Middle, King of the Hill, and episodes from Julia Child's classic cooking series, The French Chef. We continue to add new Prime Instant Video titles to our catalog at no additional cost. Prime membership remains $79 a year.

Looks like somebody's upping the game just a bit. I mean, sure, they're a long way off from taking Netflix down, but this is just a sign of what Netflix stands to lose if they can't hold it together as the race really begins.
The biggest problem that Amazon faces... they don't have the content. I looked further... ONLY the first season of Arrested Development? Lots of First seasons of things... but, not complete...

They are a long way from securing enough content to compete.
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Old October 25 2011, 04:29 AM   #359
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

And their nightmare continues...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Netfli...18757.html?x=0
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Old October 25 2011, 12:27 PM   #360
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Re: Netflix shoots itself in the foot... aka no more free streaming

So I guess the bottom line here is that Netflix got greedy. Most people joined up for the DVD-by-mail service, and Netflix has been using the profits from that to build up their streaming service. But now, they've pissed off so many customers on both services, they're going to take a loss.

I wonder what was so bad about the DVD service that they opted not to focus on that? It may have more infrastructure requirements (warehouses, shipping, etc.) but at least the costs are predictable. Streaming is going to kill them. The licensing fees they will end up paying are going to wring the life out of the company. It's already happening and will only get worse.

A shame, too, because I like Netflix. They have just made a total clusterfuck of this year.
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