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Old September 13 2011, 03:17 AM   #16
Temis the Vorta
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Harvey wrote: View Post
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What a terrible idea for a TV series. I mean, I don't have any idea on how it could possibly be sustainable.
Don't watch Dexter?
Sure, and the series has become a poster child for premises unsustainable on television.
When I watched the first season, I figured the Dexter premise had about 4 or 5 good seasons in it. So far, there have been three good seasons and a couple meh ones. Eventually they'll get to the final season, which will probably be great because it will be the season when everything comes together. So that will be 4 good seasons, even if they drag it out to 12. That's about what I ever expected from the show.

I'd have been okay if the writers had planned out 5 kickass seasons instead of trying to drag it out further, and I think Hannibal could also have about 4 or 5 good seasons in it. Hard to say until we learn more specifics and see who they cast. Bad casting could screw the whole thing.

Fuller never bailed on Pushing Daisies. I'm not going to assume he's bailing on this show before it's even been greenlit. It's a bit early in the game for handwringing.

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Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
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What a terrible idea for a TV series. I mean, I don't have any idea on how it could possibly be sustainable.
Don't watch Dexter?
Dexter kills people guilty of murder. Hannibal eats good and evil people alike. I don't think they can be compared at all.
I'm thinking that has to be sarcasm...?

If not, there are two main characters. The FBI profiler/patient might be the real protagonist, and that should provide a more relatable point of view and more diverse story options. For instance, Hannibal Lector doesn't need to be in every episode. They might simply be the FBI profiler's case of the week. The article includes very little information on the series, so there's no way to tell how restrictive or broad the premise is, and how many seasons it can comfortably encompass.
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Old September 13 2011, 03:25 AM   #17
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
Fuller never bailed on Pushing Daisies. I'm not going to assume he's bailing on this show before it's even been greenlit. It's a bit early in the game for handwringing.
Well, to be fair, he didn't have time to.

Okay, I concede that Bryan Fuller doesn't bail on his projects (I think I have him confused with someone else who usually sets up great TV series, leave early, and then goes off to create another one) though he did bail on DLM. But his TV projects haven't been entirely successful for one reason or another.

But I really don't see how a Hannibal Lecter series could sustain an audience. As noted above Dexter has an ounce or two of "ethics" to his killing (he only kills murderers) Hannibal is just an animalistic serial killer who eats his victims.

I don't see how he'd be nearly enough an interesting character to sustain an entire series as for a series to work the main character has to be likable on some level, even if he's a sociopath or a criminal. (See: Tony Soprano.)

I don't think Hannibal Lecter can pull that off and, again, he's not been an interesting character to watch even in movies since Silence of the Lambs, why would a TV series change that?
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Old September 13 2011, 03:32 AM   #18
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

It's easy - Lecter is the villain of the story, and the FBI agent is the protagonist and the person we sympathize with. He suspects out that Lecter is a serial killer but for whatever psychologically based reason, he can't bring himself to expose his crimes.

It's Dexter, but with Doakes as the protagonist, and also with Doakes having more psychological attachment to Dexter and not just being out to get him so that their push-pull relationship can last for more than just two seasons.

They can get 4 or 5 cable-length seasons out of that premise. And maybe they'll figure out more complications to toss in. The FBI agent might have other plotlines that have nothing to do with Lecter.

Or, if the writers are really good, they might be able to get away with having a sociopath like Lecter as a semi-protagonist, just because he's so funny and slick and the audience will like him. Tricky, but theoretically possible. And we have the "out" of the FBI profiler if Lecter makes us feel too creepy about ourselves.
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Old September 13 2011, 03:44 AM   #19
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

It's still a series based on a movie made 20 years ago and has had two critically unsuccessful sequels.
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Old September 13 2011, 04:00 AM   #20
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
It's Dexter, but with Doakes as the protagonist, and also with Doakes having more psychological attachment to Dexter and not just being out to get him so that their push-pull relationship can last for more than just two seasons.

They can get 4 or 5 cable-length seasons out of that premise. And maybe they'll figure out more complications to toss in. The FBI agent might have other plotlines that have nothing to do with Lecter.
4-5 seasons? Eh, that sounds like you're stretching things pretty thin to me. Sounds like a premise that could be carried out in a six-hour miniseries, if that.
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Old September 13 2011, 04:12 AM   #21
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
Broccoli wrote: View Post
What a terrible idea for a TV series. I mean, I don't have any idea on how it could possibly be sustainable.
Don't watch Dexter?
Dexter was the first thing that sprung to mind that this potential show was trying to ape. However:

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
It's easy - Lecter is the villain of the story, and the FBI agent is the protagonist and the person we sympathize with. He suspects out that Lecter is a serial killer but for whatever psychologically based reason, he can't bring himself to expose his crimes.
So, this sounds like Dexter meets Smallville.

The problem between Dexter and this potential show is that Dexter is completely open ended and can pretty much go anywhere, change the status quo, shift character dynamics, and, in general, not beholden to anything in particular.

This show, however, already has a predetermined ending that will, unfortunately, holds the writers back from doing things. If the series was about Hannibal going to place to place and getting involved with various hi-jinks, that would be one thing. However, since the description partners him with Will Graham, it locks them into a particular format.

The show, if produced, might be well-written, but I can also see it getting old quick with Graham "almost finding out". Bringing it back to Smallville, they jettisoned the "can't find out" element about midway though the series with most characters and were able to pull it off. With this show, I can't see them doing that successfully, because if one learns that Hannibal is a killer, he'll eat you!
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Old September 13 2011, 06:24 AM   #22
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

It is possible that Fuller and the producers won't hold this series to established continuity, but even if they are beholding it to any sort of regular resemblance of the character's history, most of us know that Graham finds out that Hannibal is a killer and he catches him. So, on some level, the ending of the show is definitely pre-determined and foreseeable.

In that respect, it absolutely resembles Smallville. Unless Fuller, the writers, and producers can find a way to make the series itself interesting and entertaining, but then again once you know the ending of the story, it takes away a lot of the suspense. I am assuming this show will be a procedural, and most of the suspense from these kind of shows comes from not knowing the outcome.

I think, though, that my biggest problem with this show is that the character itself has sort of lost his allure and appeal. That's mostly Thomas Harris's fault, but after four movies (five if you're including Manhunter) I'm not sure there's much left to say about the character that hasn't been already said. Even further, I think what made the character the most interesting was Anthony Hopkins' portrayal. Once you remove that element, the character becomes infinitely less interesting (something Hannibal Rising proved). The producers are going to have a very difficult time finding an actor who can portray Lecter even on a tenth of the level that Hopkins portrayed him.

I will concede, though, in one respect: At least the show is attempting to tread new territory in the Hannibal Lecter mythology. The dynamic between Lecter, who is still active in his career while trying to remain anonymous, while interacting and consulting with Will Graham could provide for some interesting psychological interplay. I always liked the Will Graham character and I thought his interaction with Lecter was fascinating. Here we are allowed to even further explore that interaction, and furthermore, delve into the meat of their relationship, which really sounds more interesting anyway.

So, bottom-line, I'm not entirely convinced that this show is a good idea (for either Fuller or in general) but at least the premise has potential. On one final note, though: they should change the title. Hannibal is the name of Harris's novel and the name of the film adaptation starring Anthony Hopkins and Julianne Moore. In order to differentiate this from that, and to give it a unique identity, the show should probably seek a different title. Besides, it also hints that Lecter will be the main character (i.e. protagonist) but of course that's just speculation on my part.
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Old September 13 2011, 06:34 AM   #23
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

You guys are all basing your comments on the assumption that this pilot even gets picked up somewhere and we should know that this always isn't automatic. Especially given all the pilots that were passed on or abandoned this year, even "High profile" genre ones like "Wonder Woman" who had a very high profile "showrunner" in David E. Kelly attached to it didn't get picked up.

That being said...if this does get picked up it sounds like an interesting premise, but I haven't really been interested in anything Lecter oriented since "Silence of the Lambs".
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Old September 13 2011, 06:54 AM   #24
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

^ That's why I kept referring to it using terms such as "potential show" and "if produced"!
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Old September 13 2011, 07:49 AM   #25
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Ok, hypothetically, if this show gets picked up, I will tune in.
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Old September 13 2011, 11:47 AM   #26
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

It occurred to me that there is a very successful series of mystery stories that could serve as a model, of sorts, for this series: Nero Wolfe.

The stories concern a genius detective who never leaves his townhouse to actually investigate crime: Nero Wolfe himself. All the actual legwork is done by his assistant, Archie Goodwin, who narrates the stories.

The Lecter/Graham team could be a twisted version of the Wolfe/Goodwin pairing. If they mashed this up with Dexter, a season would involve Graham investigating a single case, while Lecter both assists him, plays mind games with him, and pursues his own avocation as a serial killer and cannibal. The final season would portray the endgame in this relationship, in which Graham investigates Lecter himself, without realizing it.
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Old September 13 2011, 08:42 PM   #27
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

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The Lecter/Graham team could be a twisted version of the Wolfe/Goodwin pairing.
Now that's creative thinking! I'm not going to write off this show considering that there's probably about a 30% chance that it will even make it through all the hoops and go to series.
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Old September 13 2011, 09:26 PM   #28
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

This sounds ... weird.


Firstly, the last really good Lecter movie was 20 years ago. I actually don't mind either Hannibal or Red Dragon - though I still think Manhunter is the best Lecter movie and Brian Cox the best Hannibal. I haven't seen Hannibal Rising as the book was so bad.

Secondly, this seems an odd choice for Bryan Fuller, given his past record. Having said that, he's a hugely talented guy and his involvement is easily the most attractive thing about such a show.

Thirdly, if this is to remain in continuity with the movies (and with the DeLaurentis family being involved, it may well be), they'll need to set it in the late 1970s - early 1980s. They can't set it in the modern day and remain in continuity, as Hannibal was a child, orphaned during WWII. Of course, they could 'reboot' and update it, but Hannibal's cannibalism compulsion arose from seeing Russian soldiers eat his little sister at the end of the war. How would a modern-day Hannibal develop this fixation?

Fourthly, the more of Hannibal we've seen, the less interesting he's been. Brilliant in small doses in Manhunter and Silence, OTT and hammy in Hannibal, cliched and dull in Hannibal Rising. All the accusations which can be levelled at the Star Wars prequels for ruining the character of Darth Vader can be levelled at it but with much more force.


And finally, we basically know the story of Graham and Lecter. And we know it will end with Graham finding out that the brilliant psychiatrist on who's help he's been reliant is a killer. And that Hannibal will stab him but will be caught. Fair enough, you can tell a brilliant story where the audience knows the ending - I'm just not sure that this is the one to tell
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Old November 7 2011, 09:45 PM   #29
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

Bump! This project is still moving ahead, though it's early days

http://www.deadline.com/2011/11/nbc-...al-television/
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Old November 7 2011, 10:47 PM   #30
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Re: Bryan Fuller making Hannibal Lecter series!

I look forward to seeing where this goes...with a nice bottle of Chianti...
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