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Old July 29 2011, 03:19 PM   #16
Saquist
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

NASA makes me sick...
Billions down the drain ...
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Old July 29 2011, 03:21 PM   #17
Deckerd
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Of course NASA could have done something much more worthwhile with a few bucks, a handful of smash, a button and a bit of string.
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Old July 29 2011, 04:33 PM   #18
jefferiestubes8
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alternate uses outside orbit

the VASIMR engine a a 200-kilowatt plasma ion plasma rocket will be tested on the ISS.
October 2013 date set from the thread : ion plasma rocket being developed - VASIMR

The International Space Station orbits in the Thermosphere, between 320 and 380 km (200 and 240 mi).
The outermost layer of Earth's atmosphere extends from the exobase upward to 10,000km
The exosphere is almost a vacuum. Objects in the exosphere, like the Hubble Space Telescope (shown here), can be very hot when exposed to scorching sunlight or extremely cold when immersed in shadow.
Now why can't this VASIMR engine move the ISS to the edge of the exosphere and just beyond? It can be a total failsafe backup lifeboat if there is some major catastrophe where astronauts cannot land safely on Earth and must need a safety area lifeboat they can attach to returning from a trip beyond Earth's orbit.
A large sunshade can be attached to one side of most of the modules similar to Skylab before 2020 when they abandon human habitation and full power aboard the ISS. Perhaps there can be some standby power module for remote powerup.

Alternately why not move the ISS outside the exosphere to dead space and then Why not make a centrifugal space-station?
or possibly towing it to some high-altitude orbit Space Station around the Moon ? that could also be used as a lifeboat for any future missions to the moon by any countries.
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Old July 29 2011, 04:48 PM   #19
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Re: alternate uses outside orbit

jefferiestubes8 wrote: View Post
Alternately why not move the ISS outside the exosphere to dead space
Because getting massacred by rampant Necromorphs generally isn't a good thing.
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Old July 29 2011, 07:04 PM   #20
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Re: alternate uses outside orbit

jefferiestubes8 wrote: View Post
Now why can't this VASIMR engine move the ISS to the edge of the exosphere and just beyond? It can be a total failsafe backup lifeboat if there is some major catastrophe where astronauts cannot land safely on Earth and must need a safety area lifeboat they can attach to returning from a trip beyond Earth's orbit.
A large sunshade can be attached to one side of most of the modules similar to Skylab before 2020 when they abandon human habitation and full power aboard the ISS. Perhaps there can be some standby power module for remote powerup.

Alternately why not move the ISS outside the exosphere to dead space and then Why not make a centrifugal space-station?
or possibly towing it to some high-altitude orbit Space Station around the Moon ? that could also be used as a lifeboat for any future missions to the moon by any countries.
This simple answer to your questions? The ISS is too heavy to do those things. It would cost tons of money.
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Old July 29 2011, 07:07 PM   #21
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Why was it put in that orbit? I mean at that distance. I know it was only meant to last until 2015 at the outside but why that distance?
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Old July 29 2011, 07:13 PM   #22
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Saquist wrote: View Post
NASA makes me sick...
Billions down the drain ...
I see you didn't actually read any of the posts in this thread.
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Old July 29 2011, 10:40 PM   #23
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

I'm not going to claim to be able to do all the math involved, but I am aware of some issues some others apparently aren't aware of:
  • The higher orbit the more propellant it takes to reach that orbit and return to Earth from that orbit. The practical result often translates into an inability to supplement already full tanks, thus the weight of the cargo (and or the module) must be reduced in order to reach that higher orbit. Since US shuttle participation was considered necessary the chosen altitude already precluded station visits by the heavier Columbia (ironically equipped with more/heavier re-entry thermal protection)
  • The station's orbit is at a significant angle to Earth's equator. To a great extent this is what prompts the brief "launch window"periods for spacecraft planning a visit. The visiting spacecraft needs to be launched as the Earth's rotation brings the launch site under the station's orbital plane (a few minutes twice a day). There are sometimes other constraints to launch opportunities like lighting (at launch and/or abort sites), weather and clearing shipping from areas where boosters will fall. If a spacecraft is in the wrong orbital plane it would take an enormous amount of propellant to change its orbital plane.
  • While there were some periods during early construction when the station was unattended for months at a time, I'm not sure it can still operate without crew on board to occasionally adjust and/or repair some of the equipment. I've heard some of the oxygen generation equipment is particularly delicate and not completely understood by currently available personnel.
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Old July 29 2011, 10:56 PM   #24
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

I guessed a higher orbit was unattainable by the available servicing vehicles. I also assumed that an amalgamation of so many constituent parts from two decades would have a finite lifespan. That's why I'm impressed they are going for an extended 5 year operational timescale.
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Old July 29 2011, 11:07 PM   #25
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Yeah, 2020 is actually good news but it's being spun as some kind of failure.
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Old July 30 2011, 12:06 AM   #26
Saquist
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Saquist wrote: View Post
NASA makes me sick...
Billions down the drain ...
I see you didn't actually read any of the posts in this thread.
You saw what you want to see.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Yeah, 2020 is actually good news but it's being spun as some kind of failure.
It is. The project just became a waste of tax payer dollars if the station doesn't accomplish it's goal. To have to construct another one to properly and effectively set up bases on the moon and Mars is exactly the kind of pork-barrel spending that was mentioned that killed NASA in the first place.

I believe the real reason ISS is in the low orbit is both a consideration of easy access and and better protection from radiation.
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Old July 30 2011, 02:25 AM   #27
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Saquist wrote: View Post
Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Saquist wrote: View Post
NASA makes me sick...
Billions down the drain ...
I see you didn't actually read any of the posts in this thread.
You saw what you want to see.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Yeah, 2020 is actually good news but it's being spun as some kind of failure.
It is. The project just became a waste of tax payer dollars if the station doesn't accomplish it's goal. To have to construct another one to properly and effectively set up bases on the moon and Mars is exactly the kind of pork-barrel spending that was mentioned that killed NASA in the first place.

I believe the real reason ISS is in the low orbit is both a consideration of easy access and and better protection from radiation.
Sorry, all you've posted here is a bunch of spin without any substance. Par for the course for your posts, I've noticed. You seem to be criticizing the ISS for not accomplishing missions it wasn't designed for in the first place.

I am also upset that my car cannot drive across the Atlantic Ocean. Clearly, it is a failure as a vehicle.
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Old July 30 2011, 08:38 AM   #28
Deckerd
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

The ISS story is definitely a success story.
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Old July 30 2011, 09:04 AM   #29
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

The orbit chosen for ISS was a compromise between Russia and the U.S..

Basically, it's one of the few orbits obtainable by both Soyuz and Shuttle. (with them still having adequate cargo mass)
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Old July 30 2011, 10:53 AM   #30
Saquist
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Re: International Space Station to be decommissioned in 2020?

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post

Sorry, all you've posted here is a bunch of spin without any substance. Par for the course for your posts, I've noticed. You seem to be criticizing the ISS for not accomplishing missions it wasn't designed for in the first place.

I am also upset that my car cannot drive across the Atlantic Ocean. Clearly, it is a failure as a vehicle.
You don't have to be sorry for your opinion. It doesn't offend me in the least. Just don't expect me to share it. I have absolutely no power over your misconceptions and I don't really have a duty to correct them either. We all have our prejudices. Once Burned Twice Shy.

And it's okay if you're upset about the lacking of your current automobile...next time get a better one.

Last edited by Saquist; July 30 2011 at 11:23 AM.
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