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Old January 3 2011, 08:35 PM   #31
Robert Maxwell
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Well, I assume those are just shapes and not the actual textures that will be used for the tiles, right, Jadzia?
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Old January 3 2011, 08:45 PM   #32
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
Interesting. The direction you seem to be heading in seems like you could make some sort of Tron RPG, The dungeon made up of lightcycle trails or something.
I can visualise that. It's a nice idea.

I think that would be best made as a 3D game with a WoW-like camera.

I don't think plain/thin light cycle walls would look right in 2D, unless we downgrade to wireframe.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Well, I assume those are just shapes and not the actual textures that will be used for the tiles, right, Jadzia?
Correct.
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Old January 3 2011, 09:47 PM   #33
Owain Taggart
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Jadzia wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
Interesting. The direction you seem to be heading in seems like you could make some sort of Tron RPG, The dungeon made up of lightcycle trails or something.
I can visualise that. It's a nice idea.

I think that would be best made as a 3D game with a WoW-like camera.

I don't think plain/thin light cycle walls would look right in 2D, unless we downgrade to wireframe.

True, although the way I was thinking about it was to have the walls drawn from an isometric perspective, unless that's what you meant by 3D. Thin 3D walls, though I can imagine that would be even harder to do due to perspective and wanting everything to mesh together.

Weapons could be discs, with more powerful ones as you progress, with the goal to get to Tron, similar to the original movie, although I haven't seen it yet, I can imagine you could put some of the sequel's elements in it.
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Old January 3 2011, 10:00 PM   #34
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
Jadzia wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
Interesting. The direction you seem to be heading in seems like you could make some sort of Tron RPG, The dungeon made up of lightcycle trails or something.
I can visualise that. It's a nice idea.

I think that would be best made as a 3D game with a WoW-like camera.

I don't think plain/thin light cycle walls would look right in 2D, unless we downgrade to wireframe.

True, although the way I was thinking about it was to have the walls drawn from an isometric perspective, unless that's what you meant by 3D. Thin 3D walls, though I can imagine that would be even harder to do due to perspective and wanting everything to mesh together.

Weapons could be discs, with more powerful ones as you progress, with the goal to get to Tron, similar to the original movie, although I haven't seen it yet, I can imagine you could put some of the sequel's elements in it.
the Tron Dungeon would work @ a wireframe level. with random elements and proper graphic work the whole thing could come together by just pushing a few buttons.

Game creation software is expensive but well worth it for the right group of programmers and artists in the end the money is the compensation for the upfront stuff.

I have not taken the plunge into more gaming work due to the falling three dimensional fourperson chess game creation failure that happened like eight years ago on my end.

these days I just test the new games that are in beta or alpha ..,

this seems alpha stage

idea: sound interactive triggers??

reach a hole in the floor player hears a creek then falls unless the person is moving quickly??

anyway if you need graphic backgrounds I can let you have any of my fractals which are really four dimensional dungeons based on some math.
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Old January 4 2011, 08:50 PM   #35
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
True, although the way I was thinking about it was to have the walls drawn from an isometric perspective, unless that's what you meant by 3D.
I'd call that isometric.

What I meant by 3D was polygon/model based with 3D camera, which is something I don't do.

I think in general there's been a lot of disagreement over the meaning of 2D and 3D. The term 2.5D was invented to help, but it has ended up being applied to pretty much everything that occurred between Pong and WoW.

Weapons could be discs, with more powerful ones as you progress, with the goal to get to Tron, similar to the original movie, although I haven't seen it yet, I can imagine you could put some of the sequel's elements in it.
Unfortunately I don't own the IP, so am not going to be making a Tron game.


think wrote:
idea: sound interactive triggers??
I don't know if arcade games should rely on sound feedback. Traditionally appearing in noisy arcade halls with loud music playing, the player couldn't be expected to hear and react to every sound effect... and that defines the mood of arcade games for me. It's an option I'll consider, but I think I'd prefer to have the game rely on visual feedback, and just use sound effects aesthetically.

anyway if you need graphic backgrounds I can let you have any of my fractals which are really four dimensional dungeons based on some math.
That's very kind of you think. However, I generally swap graphics around until I'm happy with them. I don't know yet if fractals would fit with the theme. But I shall keep your offer in mind, thanks.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:24 PM   #36
Owain Taggart
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Jadzia wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
True, although the way I was thinking about it was to have the walls drawn from an isometric perspective, unless that's what you meant by 3D.
I'd call that isometric.

What I meant by 3D was polygon/model based with 3D camera, which is something I don't do.

I think in general there's been a lot of disagreement over the meaning of 2D and 3D. The term 2.5D was invented to help, but it has ended up being applied to pretty much everything that occurred between Pong and WoW.

Right, and I agree. I think that it could done done using isometric perspective rather than 3D. I just wanted to make sure we were thinking about the same thing here I think of 3D as something with a moveable camera. That helps with the distinction, as something isometric usually is static. And I agree about the term 2.5D. I remember early 3D shooters such as Duke Nukem 3D often got the term 2.5D applied to them because they technically weren't real 3D compared to what we got later on, and instead used tricks, so the term got muddied even further.
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Old January 4 2011, 11:30 PM   #37
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

My main criticism against Isometric is that it can feel awkward controlling a character, since graphics follows diagonals but the controller is horizontal/vertical. Replacing keyboard with mouse control, we'd be into Diablo 2 territory, which obviously works well.

I did a little to my procgen program this evening. It may not look much, but it begins creating a game map from the connectivity worked out earlier. These are the main structural walls defining the layout/flow of a dungeon. Obstacles, doors, collectables, generators and monsters can be added into this. I'm intending for the game screen to show about 16x16 tiles, which is a bit wider than the 12 tile corridor width seen in the left picture.

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Old January 5 2011, 12:09 AM   #38
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Very nice! I look forward to your next update.
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Old January 9 2011, 02:33 AM   #39
Jadzia
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Today I've been looking at FMOD. This is an API for managing sounds, and I've never used it before. In previous games I've used DirectSound, but I'm trying to move away from directx.

FMOD is over featured for my needs, so have spent a bit of time this evening seeing how it all works and making a simple front end for it using the 3D sound interface.

So now all I need to call is one or two functions like

"Use this file as sound effect 1"
"Play sound effect 1 at these 3D coordinates"

I like simple no-nonsense abstractions.
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Old January 9 2011, 02:49 AM   #40
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Have you ever looked into Nethack, the king of dungeon crawlers?
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Old January 9 2011, 03:09 AM   #41
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

FMOD is a nice library, I definitely recommend it.
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Old January 9 2011, 02:02 PM   #42
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Rett Mikhal wrote: View Post
Have you ever looked into Nethack, the king of dungeon crawlers?
I've heard of it, but I think that's a turn based game.

Real time games can be quite a bit different to make because the game (rather than the player) sets the pace, which means I have to manage the timing/delays between everything that happens in the game. One aspect of time management is animation.

Also in real time games, things have velocity, and positions of characters and projectiles are generally not aligned with the tile grid. So the simulated physics is another aspect of time management.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
FMOD is a nice library, I definitely recommend it.
What I like most is that it supports a good number of file types, so I can mix together compressed/uncompressed/samplebank audio, and they can be buffered to memory or streamed on the fly. I just hope my sound functions work properly when it all comes together.

Also, I don't have a 3D sound system, so I have no idea if/how much sounds are being moved along the forwards-backwards axis.
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Old January 9 2011, 05:16 PM   #43
Rett Mikhal
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Jadzia wrote: View Post
Rett Mikhal wrote: View Post
Have you ever looked into Nethack, the king of dungeon crawlers?
I've heard of it, but I think that's a turn based game.

Real time games can be quite a bit different to make because the game (rather than the player) sets the pace, which means I have to manage the timing/delays between everything that happens in the game. One aspect of time management is animation.

Also in real time games, things have velocity, and positions of characters and projectiles are generally not aligned with the tile grid. So the simulated physics is another aspect of time management.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
FMOD is a nice library, I definitely recommend it.
What I like most is that it supports a good number of file types, so I can mix together compressed/uncompressed/samplebank audio, and they can be buffered to memory or streamed on the fly. I just hope my sound functions work properly when it all comes together.

Also, I don't have a 3D sound system, so I have no idea if/how much sounds are being moved along the forwards-backwards axis.
Yes, Nethack is turned based. However the reason I suggested it is because of the head crushing depth it possesses. There's a phrase called "The DevTeam thinks of everything."

If you put on a silver ring and punch a werewolf, it counts as a silver weapon and does extra damage to them.

If you throw a cockatrice corpse at a monster, and it hits, the monster will turn to stone. Ditto for wielding it as a weapon (with gloves, of course!)

If you are levitating and you fire something, Newton's second law sends you backwards in the air due to lack of friction.

So, there's a lot of neat ideas in there. Just thought I'd throw that out in the open.
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Old January 9 2011, 08:30 PM   #44
Jadzia
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Rett Mikhal wrote: View Post
Yes, Nethack is turned based. However the reason I suggested it is because of the head crushing depth it possesses. There's a phrase called "The DevTeam thinks of everything."
Okay. Thanks for your suggestion.

I'll consider some of those things, but they do sound best suited to turn based rpg where the player has time to manage an inventory and think about their options.

In contrast, the arcade game formula is something like 75% reflex + 25% working knowledge.
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Old January 10 2011, 05:10 AM   #45
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Re: My Dungeon Game [work in progress]

Have you actually considered some sort of background story so far, or have you been purely coding? Because although I may be rather useless about every other aspect of designing video games, most of the people I share my writing with seem to think I'm a pretty decent writer.
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