JMS Quits Superman & Wonder Woman

[Sci]

the Dagman wrote:

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He may have gotten the writing credit for most of the later seasons, but there were actually a room full of writers working on every episode. My pal Zoran spent some time in the writers' room when he went to the set in season 4, as well as me hearing about it from Larry DiTillio. So I got my info from first-hand witnesses.

Simple logic: Why have an executive story editor if the executive producer of the show is writing all of it? Answer: To insert the scenes written by other writers into the story broad strokes written by JMS and keep it all straight.

Bollocks. The Writer's Guild of America would never allow that.

I do not believe you.

[Lindley]

the Dagman wrote:

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as well as me hearing about it from Larry DiTillio. So I got my info from first-hand witnesses.

Larry DiTillio's B5 contract was not renewed after the end of season 2. He wasn't involved in the later years at all.

[the Dagman]

Sci wrote:

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Bollocks. The Writer's Guild of America would never allow that.

I do not believe you.

Then you don't really know or understand how the majority of television and motion pictures are written.

[Nerys Myk]

Admiral_Young wrote:

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Why did you think it sucked?

It didn't really live up to the hype. For all the boasting about how it was new modern spin on Superman it really didn't blaze any new trails. All the talk about "edgy" Jimmy and a new never before seen take on Lois never materialized. ( But I get the impression the folks who made those "promises" haven't a clue about Superman or his supporting cast's history.)

It's pacing and characterization was pretty amateurish and slow. Clark's job hunting was a waste of space. The villain was pretty forgetable and his connection to Superman was too cliched. The design was weak too. The skeletal wings and tail plus glam rock make up was just too grade school. Is he supposed to be the "devil" to Supes' "angel".

[Admiral_Young]

I'll agree that the villain Tyrell was pretty boring and did nothing to me, we saw too little though of Lois and Jimmy for them to really make an impression. I hope we get Lex in the next one.

[BDJ]

If I may,

I had great hope upon hearing that JMS was "re-imagining" Superman and Wonder Woman. I bought into the hype and I am not a fan of B5.
I was interested in the "walkabout" Superman and the WW changes.
Alas, I was let down in a very big way.
Superman Earth One had some interesting images and the younger Clark\Superman was kinda cool, BUT it felt a bit ... I don't know... clunky - for lack of a better term.
The villain was forgettable even though the new origin about the destruction of Krypton was kind of "okay".
After I read it I just felt kinda ... "meh". I wish I had my money back.
So maybe now someone could get their head outta their hiney and make Superman the awe inspiring leader and hero he can be. (not to mention doing the same for Wondy too!)
Of course there are so many cynical, hard core, badass wannabe readers out there. They wouldn't give Supes a chance unless he grew claws and slaughtered bad guys with them and used his head vision to cook them up and then devoured said bad guys! (with some fava beans and et.al.)
He'd hafta be covered in tats and listen to death core metal, y'know the sane and mature stuff!
Bye Bye JMS! Hopefully never to return! (jus' sayin')

[Admiral Shran]

Good!

While I was moderately entertained by B5, I found his Wonder Woman stuff very off-puting.

I haven't read any of his Superman stuff though.

[Reverend]

Admiral_Young wrote:

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I'll agree that the villain Tyrell was pretty boring and did nothing to me, we saw too little though of Lois and Jimmy for them to really make an impression. I hope we get Lex in the next one.

From what JMS has been posting on facebook, no, Lex won't show up in volume 2 but he does have a long term plan for how he will be introduced.

Tyrell and his race was I think the only thing about the GN that really bothered me. Not so concerned about the character himself since his only purpose was to help set-up the planetary assassination plot, but the idea that Krypton had a sister planet inhabited by their mortal enemies felt like slightly too much of a departure to me.

I mean if they were actually some break-away Kryptonian colony then I'd be OK with it, but a different race? I don't know. It doesn't sit right.

Lindley wrote:

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Larry DiTillio's B5 contract was not renewed after the end of season 2. He wasn't involved in the later years at all.

Indeed. Without any proof I'm calling bullshit on this. Claiming JMS basically slapped his name on other peoples' screenplays from what amounts to 90 odd episodes of television is a very serious and implausible accusation. Especially since this latest development has him taking a 75% pay cut.


As for those not liking his new storylines; you did read the part where those stories will be finished as he intended? The only thing he's not going to be doing is writing the actual scripts. The stories will still be his.
Mind you, in all honesty I think I'd rather have it that ways as, being a B5 fan I think I'm a little too familiar with his writing "voice" and certain familiar phrases, turns of speech and motifs rather jump out at me when I read is non-B5 work. For example, it felt a little odd hearing Angelina Jolie quoting John Sheridan.

[Admiral_Young]

I'm thinking Lex will be introduced somehow through the military storyline. Clark's job search while boring was meant to show that he attempted to do other options and to show he's smart, thus the equation that he came up with.

[the Dagman]

Reverend wrote:

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Indeed. Without any proof I'm calling bullshit on this. Claiming JMS basically slapped his name on other peoples' screenplays from what amounts to 90 odd episodes of television is a very serious and implausible accusation.

Whatever. If you people don't believe me, it is no skin off my nose. I am just an anonymous person on the internet to you. Nevermind the fact that I know Larry, I know he worked on the later seasons, and he was the "in" my friend Zoran used to visit the set in season 4. I guess all those pictures he brought back from the set with him, his wife he was on honeymoon with, and series stars like Andreas Katsulas in full make-up and Jerry Doyle were all fakes too. After all, I haven't seen the pictures in over ten years since my friend who has them moved to Utah. So I must be either deluded or lying, right? I mean, you guys have all that info that has been posted on the internet that supports your version. Just ignore the guy who actually got first hand accounts and knows the guy who would know for sure.

[Admiral_Young]

This isn't a B5 thread guys. Let's not have a pissing match here.

[Sci]

The WGA would never allow an executive producer to take someone's work, slap his name on it, and deny that person a co-writer credit; that would open up the studio and/or production company to all sorts of lawsuits and it would be a breach of WGA contract. And no staff writer would go along with it, because they'd never get any residuals if their names never appeared in the writing credits.

the Dagman wrote:

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So I must be either deluded or lying, right?

Yes.

[Admiral_Young]

How does a friend of yours bringing pictures back from a set of actors prove that Larry D worked on more episodes than he's credited for? I don't get that part.

[the Dagman]

^How could Larry have provided access to the closed set in season 4 if he wasn't on the show after season 1?

ETA: BTW, Larry was in the pictures too. There were shots of him and several staff writers as well. Ironically though, JMS was not on the set that day. There were no shots of him.

[Admiral_Young]

Okay what exactly are people arguing about here? Are we arguing about the number of episodes that Larry D is credited to have written or him working on the show?