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Old August 14 2010, 06:06 PM   #31
Admiral_Young
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

I'm not a Judge Dredd expert by any means and maybe actual Dredd fans can pipe up here if there are any but I'm guessing that Dredd not taking off his helmet is part of the iconic symbolism from the comics and even Stalone himself in an interview I believe stated that he regretted doing that in his film. Dredd is part of a authoritarian state and the Judges are a symbol of that state's authority and power. I'm guessing that by taking off his helmet in the original movie that humanize Dredd which is fine I suppose if you are attempting to make him relate- able to the audience. As far as I know and again...Dredd fans please correct me...the reason why this particular aspect is such a big deal is that Dredd never takes off his helmet in the comics. Maybe fans thought that was the film's way of slighting the comics or something. I dunno. Either way in this film the helmet stays on.
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Old August 14 2010, 06:10 PM   #32
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
Anwar wrote: View Post
Cyclops' visor may have been part of the reason he was basically an extra in the movies...
Geordi wants to talk to you.
I bet LeVar was champing at the bit for years to get the 'cloned eye implants' for Geordi. That prop he had to slap on his face could not have been comfortable.
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Old August 14 2010, 06:17 PM   #33
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
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Too bad there aren't medals or rewards for getting facts straight.
I don't seek any. It's just my nature to be precise, to value and respect the facts for their own sake, and for the sake of any others who may value having accurate information.
Maybe you should change your name to Data.
Actually, the singular form of Data would be Datum. The word data (pronounced /ˈdeɪtə/ DAY-tə, /ˈdætə/ DA-tə, or /ˈdɑːtə/ DAH-tə) is the Latin plural of datum, neuter past participle of dare, "to give", hence "something given".



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Old August 14 2010, 06:20 PM   #34
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Although I don't know much about the Judge Dredd mythology, I can see why him taking off his helmet could be such a big deal.
I know I would be up in arms if Master Chief would take off his helmet in a movie adaptation of Halo
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Old August 14 2010, 06:21 PM   #35
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

^ There's a perfect example of another iconic character who never takes off his helmet.
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Old August 14 2010, 07:44 PM   #36
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Reverend wrote: View Post
Of course V was the main character. He/she was the title character for goodness sake and had just as much screen time as Evey. As important as she was, the whole film was about Evey discovering V, she was the audience's POV into the world.
Right. V didn't change, so the whole film was about Evey and how V changed her. And the title is not conclusive. The whale is not the main character of Moby-Dick.


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But if you want a more relevant example, how about the most glaringly obvious; Vader. Sure the films don't follow him around all the time
Right, because he wasn't the main character. Same for Cyclops and Geordi, though with those guys you could at least see their eyebrows.


Admiral_Young wrote: View Post
I'm not a Judge Dredd expert by any means and maybe actual Dredd fans can pipe up here if there are any but I'm guessing that Dredd not taking off his helmet is part of the iconic symbolism from the comics
Yes, thanks, I get that, but what may work in a comic or short film or video game (or may not; I've never read any JD and thus have no idea what the quality's like) doesn't necessarily translate well to a feature-length movie.

If they make a movie where the main character (I'm assuming the role isn't to be a Vader-like supporting player) never shows his face, it'd better either be one of the best movies of the year or expected to provide only a modest return, because I think that's going to turn a lot of people off.
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Old August 14 2010, 08:01 PM   #37
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

What's with the sarcastic yea thanks comment? I wasn't directing my comment at you directly but the entire thread and I as I stated I'm not a hardcore Dredd fan so I'm not sure what the big deal with the Helmet is. I was simply pointing out why it might be such a big deal.
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Old August 14 2010, 10:43 PM   #38
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Aragorn wrote: View Post
Why is he not allowed to ever show his face? Can't he take off his helmet when he's at home? Does he wear the helmet to sleep and in the shower?
Judge Dredd is a parody/homage of the laconic American action hero, the loner-riding-into-the-sunset type. He never shows his face for the same reason Clint Eastwood never tells ya his name in a Spaghetti Western. He may dress as a cop but maybe he got The Man With No Name confused with Dirty Harry. It's the same guy.

If that doesn't work in movies, then the premise of Judge Dredd doesn't work in movies and we'll have an interesting failure.

However, I also expect that the movie won't lean too heavily on Dredd as the lead character and there will be other characters in the story whose liveliness and abundant personalities (I can think of many examples from the comics) will more than compensate for Dredd's lack of visible persona.
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Old August 14 2010, 11:07 PM   #39
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

If anyone is interested in reading the script...give me a pm and I'll be happy to email it to you.
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Old August 14 2010, 11:29 PM   #40
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

The whole Dredd never taking his helmet off thing basically grew over time to the point where it almost became a running joke (in one issue Dredd keeps his helmet on in the bath for Grud's sake!) certainly in early Dredd strips it was implied that he was hideously deformed in some way, but this seems to have been dropped over time. Now it's more of a statement. Dredd isn't a man, he IS the Law.

Of course any 2000AD fan realises we saw Dredd full (facial) frontal for several weeks in a row in


As for the casting...well the ideal Dredd is obviously Clint of about 30 years ago, and my own personal choice would have been Clive Owen, but Karl Urban? I wouldn't have thought of him, but now he's announced I like the idea, I like the idea a lot! Right sort of age too. Not too old, not too young. Also not too famous but not a complete unknown.

For the record though, and as someone who started reading 2000AD with Prog 219!, I had to say, I don't think the Stallone film is quite the abomination its made out to be. Very flawed but MEga City 1 looks the part, and Sly isn't that bad, and as for Rob Schneider, it isn't like the comic Dredd hasn't had a succesion of comedy sidekicks. Max Normal? Walter the Wobot?
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Old August 14 2010, 11:53 PM   #41
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

The whale is not the main character of Moby-Dick.
It will be in Ridley Scott's reimagining of Melville's classic story.

Okay, so there is no such thing planned...yet.
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Old August 15 2010, 12:04 AM   #42
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

@Starkers great points and that's what I was trying to get across in my post...Dredd and his fellow Judges ARE THE LAW and a symbol of the authoritarian state they represent and reinforce. Taking off the helmet would humanize Dredd to the point where the "fear' (that's not the word I was wanting to use but it will do) the criminals and population perceive is diminished. Not sure if I'm making my point clearly enough.
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Old August 15 2010, 01:16 AM   #43
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
Won't be the same with out Stallone's

"I'M DA LAAAWWW!"

and Rob Schneider

It will be infinitely better.
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Old August 15 2010, 01:40 AM   #44
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

For the record though, and as someone who started reading 2000AD with Prog 219!, I had to say, I don't think the Stallone film is quite the abomination its made out to be. Very flawed but MEga City 1 looks the part, and Sly isn't that bad, and as for Rob Schneider, it isn't like the comic Dredd hasn't had a succesion of comedy sidekicks. Max Normal? Walter the Wobot?
I tend to agree it wasn't that bad as a film in it's own right. I rather enjoyed bits of it. If anything I thought the movie's Mean Machine was a little played down!
I'd certainly be curious to see a director's cut version as I gather the film was ratehr heavily edited by the studio (the ending in particular) and it very clearly shows in places. Notice how you see the clones hatch but in the next scene they're all gone? I'm not saying a DC would drastically improve matters, but I'm curious to see how different it could have been.
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Old August 15 2010, 03:26 AM   #45
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Re: The Law Returns. This Time With His Helmet On! Judge Dredd!

Rob Schneider was much less of a problem than Armand Assante or Diane Lane. I thought his character gave us decent insight into Stallone's, and allowed us to see a fuller picture of the world environment. When he was on the screen, I was entertained. When Lane was, I was not.

That being said, I'm another one of the people who basically enjoyed the Stallone version. But I've never read the comic at all.
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