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View Poll Results: Grading
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Old July 28 2010, 04:52 PM   #391
T'Baio
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
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Old July 28 2010, 04:58 PM   #392
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

T'Baio wrote: View Post
No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
I got it right away.

The more I read reviews online, the more I realize that people just don't pay attention to what they're watching. Like how so many people got confused by the LOST finale, even though Christian laid it right out there what had been going on.
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Old July 28 2010, 05:10 PM   #393
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
T'Baio wrote: View Post
No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
I got it right away.

The more I read reviews online, the more I realize that people just don't pay attention to what they're watching. Like how so many people got confused by the LOST finale, even though Christian laid it right out there what had been going on.
God don't get me started on the LOST finale. There were online polls and 40%-48% of the people were confused and thought...
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Old July 28 2010, 06:09 PM   #394
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
I think you can either enjoy Nolan's films or simply don't bother. I say this because as a prolific filmmaker I think you know what to expect from watching a Christopher Nolan movie. He's established a firm reputation for making psychological suspense thrillers. Yes, they're very serious-minded. Nolan takes a very analytical and deliberate approach to his movies. However, if you would not prefer the type of storytelling, then don't bother.
To me, that's kind of like saying no one has the right to complain about Transformers 2 being big, dumb, and loud, because Michael Bay's movies have always been big, dumb, and loud. And yet the Transformers 2 thread on this very board was nothing but people complaining about how Michael Bay indulged in typical Michael Bay excess.

Setting aside the general weakness of the "if you don't like it don't watch it" defense, all the people gushing about this movie has sort of made it impossible to not go see it. Going by the comments in this thread, you'd think Nolan had invented a completely new system of filmmaking that will transform the fundamental experience of cinema and eventually lead to the second coming of Jesus. If you're a lover of film, all the gushing has sort of forced you see it, just to find out what all the fuss is about.
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Old July 28 2010, 06:13 PM   #395
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Level 2 Diagnostic wrote: View Post

Setting aside the general weakness of the "if you don't like it don't watch it" defense, all the people gushing about this movie has sort of made it impossible to not go see it. Going by the comments in this thread, you'd think Nolan had invented a completely new system of filmmaking that will transform the fundamental experience of cinema and eventually lead to the second coming of Jesus. If you're a lover of film, all the gushing has sort of forced you see it, just to find out what all the fuss is about.
That's one of the reasons I saw it. That, and the fact that the previews were intriguing without telling me a god damn thing about the movie. So many previews these days give away way too much information. I had seen several previews for Inception, but I honestly had no idea what it was about until I got into the theater.
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Old July 28 2010, 06:26 PM   #396
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Myasishchev wrote: View Post
Level 2 Diagnostic wrote: View Post
I think the thing I dislike the most about Nolan's films is they're so damn self-serious and self-important, to the point of being completely joyless. He doesn't seem to have any interest in injecting actual FUN into his movies. I thought this was a deliberate choice in Batman Begins, to avoid comparisons to the campy Schumacher films, but it appears this is just the way his movies are.
Well, this is absolutely true. I mean, I like it, but having seen most of Nolan's work, he takes a deadly serious approach to somewhat goofy ideas (Memento, Batman, Prestige, and Inception all have questionable underpinnings), and the aesthetic is, indeed, doom and gloom pretty much all the way through. I guess it's not for everyone, but except for the crumminess of Begins, and to a certain extent TDK, he hasn't actually disappointed me. The Prestige is pretty awesome because of its overserious approach--which is maybe even necessary given its central implausibility based on a Flash Gordon level of fealty to science.

(Now, I've never seen Insomnia or Following, but I don't suppose they're slapstick comedies either.)
I think it depends on your definition of "fun". To me, Nolan's films are very fun. I love dissecting the almost analytical nature that Nolan brings to his films in terms of how he structures them narratively and thematically. They're always interesting and incredibly visually striking. I mean, it's not like Nolan's movies are completely humorless, either. Most of his films -- especially his later films -- have a good deal of occasional jokey humor sprinkled throughout. The difference being that he doesn't let the humor dominate the proceedings. It's sparse, but enjoyable.

I don't see how this is any different from filmmakers like Alfred Hitchcock or David Fincher or Paul Greengrass or Bryan Singer who are very prolific filmmakers and make very serious films. What these filmmakers have in common is that their films happen to be very entertaining in the sense that they're very well made. Yet they usually take their subject matter very seriously.

I think you can either enjoy Nolan's films or simply don't bother. I say this because as a prolific filmmaker I think you know what to expect from watching a Christopher Nolan movie. He's established a firm reputation for making psychological suspense thrillers. Yes, they're very serious-minded. Nolan takes a very analytical and deliberate approach to his movies. However, if you would not prefer the type of storytelling, then don't bother.

Nolan makes the movies he wants to make, like any good filmmaker, and he only hopes that the films that he enjoys making are movies an audience would enjoy watching. That's the only thing you can do as a filmmaker. When you compromise your artistic integrity, that's when things have a tendency to roll downhill. Nolan is very passionate over the stories he wishes to tell and he's very good at them. They might not be to your liking, but you don't have to watch. You can always watch a movie from some other filmmaker who enjoys telling the type of stories you enjoy watching.
I really respect you as a poster, and I also love what I have seen by Nolan. However, one could think, by reading your posts, that you give every Nolan film a pass ebcause it's a Nolan film. I hope that's now what you are saying. How do you respond to some of the specific criticisms expressed in this thread?

What we are asking for is honesty, not gushing. I'm not making any accusations that you simply gushing, but I just want to express something difficult without pointing fingers or naming names. You said upthread that, in response to the idea that you wanted to find out that a specif dream really wasn't Fisher's but it was someone else's and it was filled with filled with Fisher's subconscious, you mentioned your desire to see the film again. Be honest here: if one goes to see the film again to understand a film's structure, can one not help but only see the structure, the machinations of the plot.

Honestly, I felt surprising detached from the events of the film the second time I saw it. I was knew too much, I was paying more attention to how Nolan structured and foreshadowed things than I was to the actual story, philosophy, or characters. Whatever it was was that elevated the film to greatness, that made it more than the sum of its parts, was lost by the second viewing.

When you do go see it again, and you come back here to comment on it, tell us if you felt this at all, and don't simply praise it because it's a Nolan film.
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Old July 28 2010, 09:40 PM   #397
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

T'Baio wrote: View Post
No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
I missed it completely the first time I watched the movie, didn't hear the conversation at all my hearing must have tuned out or something. But I got it right away during this second viewing.

I got to say again that I loved, loved, loved this movie. It's just a mind fuck and Leo didn't annoy me at all in it and, well, I've got a thing for young, cute, brown-haired girls so I thought Kitty Pryde did a good job.
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Old July 29 2010, 05:30 AM   #398
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

There was still gravity on GoldenEye level because of the time dilation
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Old July 29 2010, 06:06 AM   #399
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

T'Baio wrote: View Post
No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
Yes, I was paying attention, I just didn't waste a lot of flops on a mumbled one-liner equating piss and rain. I heard the joke, and the editing immediately suggested to me that he had to take a (dream-literal) piss somewhere, and then actual important stuff happened and I forgot about it because it was chaff.

I'm pretty sure I didn't pay ten dollars to sit there and pick my nose, but maybe I need to go see it again so the crucial nature of the tiny scene obliquely explaining Dileep Rao's metaphorical urine does not pass me by.

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote:
There was still gravity on GoldenEye level because of the time dilation
Then shouldn't it have just been in freefall for longer?

I mean, the van fell for a few seconds, hence the hotel at level 2 was in freefall for a few minutes, thus the Arctic Fortress Playset at level 3 should lose gravity for ______ .

I guess it was simply shielded from the effects, why not.
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Old July 29 2010, 07:06 AM   #400
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Myasishchev wrote: View Post
T'Baio wrote: View Post
No one's getting the pee thing? Seriously, do people pay attention at all?
Yes, I was paying attention, I just didn't waste a lot of flops on a mumbled one-liner equating piss and rain. I heard the joke, and the editing immediately suggested to me that he had to take a (dream-literal) piss somewhere, and then actual important stuff happened and I forgot about it because it was chaff.

I'm pretty sure I didn't pay ten dollars to sit there and pick my nose, but maybe I need to go see it again so the crucial nature of the tiny scene obliquely explaining Dileep Rao's metaphorical urine does not pass me by.



I completely forgot about the line until you said that.
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Old July 29 2010, 07:58 AM   #401
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Lindley wrote: View Post
One thing that did bug me a bit....why wasn't the gravity going all wonky on the ice level as well?
For the same reason Saito could delay the inevitable result of his gunshot wound a little more with each level they went down.
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Old July 29 2010, 03:46 PM   #402
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

They did feel some of the shock on the Goldeneye level...hence the avalanche. But it dissipates each level it goes down.

Saw it again last night, and while I still think it's a really entertaining movie that is more intelligent than most, I think it's greatest flaw is how literal it is. It's really not complicated, really is not a mind fuck in any way...it's just a well written story with well written convolutions. Those do threaten to strangle the picture at times, and I wonder if all the "brilliant, mind fuck" talk is merely a result of those overly complicated, deus ex machina convolutions. As in, it's so overly worked over and folded within itself, with faux, unnecessary risk creations such as limbo, that it just seems brilliant if you don't look past the facade.

Don't get me wrong, I love the film and think it's very well done and is one of the best movies of the year by far. But that's because it's a great science fiction-y, action oriented heist yarn with good characterization and an added level of depth that is really entertaining...not because it's brilliant or a mind fuck.
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Old July 29 2010, 06:22 PM   #403
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

I'm not sure how I would rate it. Yes, the movie navigates its own internal logic with a deft and expertise that is quite rare today. It's just that its own internal logic is so unbelievably stupid. If you give it points for its dexterous filmmaking, you also have to take away points for the ludicrous conceit behind it all. There is just way too much suspension of disbelief required to remain engaged in the story, which consistently hovers between ridiculous and absurd.
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Old July 29 2010, 07:37 PM   #404
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

T'Baio wrote: View Post
It's really not complicated, really is not a mind fuck in any way...it's just a well written story with well written convolutions.

I wonder if all the "brilliant, mind fuck" talk is merely a result of those overly complicated, deus ex machina convolutions.
It's because people are stupid.

I was going into the movie thinking it would confuse the hell out of me and have this huge shocking ending that would be a mind fuck.

It wasn't, and it didn't. It was just an enjoyable movie that the masses want to believe was a "mind fuck" because they are so fucking stupid they can't understand a movie that explains everything perfectly.
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Old July 29 2010, 07:43 PM   #405
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
And it seems that Nolan is constantly trying too hard to fool his audience that you can't relly enjoy it.
How is he trying to fool his audience? This is a very straightforward story.
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