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Old May 12 2010, 11:54 PM   #31
KB24
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

I'm surprised they think westerns don't appeal to kids. Hey Dude! anyone? Horse opera has so many built in wonders for kids, the big west, horses themselves,yes stereotypical Indians and bank robbers and trains. Maybe a juvenile focused series would be the way to go.

And yes,maybe paranormal also would work. That's what I loved about Dead Man's Gun, and TNT did that nice little movie Purgatory. There were several eps of DMG with Michael Dorn as a pinkerton, that would be fun to see him investigate the weird and injust in the West! Miniseries based on a few classic books would also appeal to young audiences. How about a Shane series anyone. I love that book.
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Old May 25 2010, 03:19 AM   #32
jefferiestubes8
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'Hell on Wheels' pilot ordered for AMC

from the pilot season thread:
Out Of My Vulcan Mind wrote: View Post
AMC has ordered a pilot for a western called Hell on Wheels about the construction of the transcontinental railroad in the 1860s.
whoo hoo! Thanks Out Of My Vulcan Mind !
That is the news to keep hope alive.
Considering the first transcontinental railway was completed in 1869 this would have steam locomotives and horses and all sorts of that stuff!


Endemol USA which has been making a push in scripted television under senior vp Jeremy Gold. Gold is serving as an executive producer on Hell on Wheels along with Joe and Tony Gayton and Endemol USA president-CEO David Goldberg.
AMC Orders Western Pilot From Endemol
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Old May 25 2010, 06:58 AM   #33
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss
Sure, but keep the spaceships out of it! *ducks*


KB24 wrote: View Post
I'm surprised they think westerns don't appeal to kids. Hey Dude! anyone? Horse opera has so many built in wonders for kids, the big west, horses themselves,yes stereotypical Indians and bank robbers and trains. Maybe a juvenile focused series would be the way to go.
Dunno... kids don't have as many backyards as they used to. Political correctness, production costs and Sputnik aside, it's hard to be a cowboy in the middle of suburbia or a city.
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Old June 22 2010, 04:01 PM   #34
jefferiestubes8
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"Last American Cowboy" series

auntiehill wrote: View Post
Possible, yes. Too expensive for networks to bother with? Definitely.
Until the AMC series Hell on Wheels
pilot gets picked up for a series this new show at least offers a western on TV :
A new documentary series (much cheaper to produce)
"Last American Cowboy"
Animal Planet, Mondays at 10 p.m. started June 14.
Following the families who own and operate traditional cattle ranches in Montana.
appears to be shot over 8 months.

USA today says:
one of the summer's more interesting reality ideas
This falls under the Professional activities & Special living environment docudrama sub-genre of 'reality television programming'. It's not a Competition/game show type show (thank God) but is it a substitute for scripted drama [Western episodic]? When shot over 8 months a docudrama is more of a documentary-style show.


a good 1:45 minute preview video here
Last American Cowboy: The Cowboy Way

some beautiful vistas in the cinematography, especially the helicopter shots that are Western feature film quality.
If you get Animal Planet HD you are even luckier.
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Old June 22 2010, 07:05 PM   #35
Timelord Victorious
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

Someone calling Mel Gibson to produce a TV Series of Maverick in a similar style as the movie he starred in? I'd watch that.
Of course he shouldn't play the title role, since he's getting to old for this shit. So cast Nathan Fillion please.
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Old June 23 2010, 12:46 AM   #36
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

Remember Hey Dude? I loved that show!

Honestly, I don't see why there aren't more youth oriented westerns. It's the one place where going juvenile or Smallville would work. Ranches and horses and Indian bonding and such. Heck the the rough yet simple life on the range. Though I have to say some of the too sweet kid bits from Dr. Quinn and Little House on the Prairie are tough to swallow sometimes, there's nothing wrong with an adventure western series for kids.

There should be a Shane miniseries! My husband hates westerns but now he's in love with the Red Dead Redemption game. Maybe a dark but youthful turn would be a possibility? I love Shane. I've read it more than any other book, and I do enjoy the Alan Ladd film. However, its about due for an ambigious retelling. What's the big deal with the stump? It's all told from a kid's eyes so he can't quite get the bigger picture of some potential kink between Mom and Shane. Dang now I want to go read it.

When I was little, every summer my dad would hack away on this huge stump that was left when we put in our pool. I'd sit there and say, 'It's just like Shane!' Every year, over and over I'd say it. Eventually my father would get so pissed and start really chopping at this stump. 'I know! I know! It's just like %^&*# Shane!'

teehee

So why isn't somebody making a humorous kid western or a darker mature series?
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Old June 23 2010, 03:40 AM   #37
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

stj wrote: View Post
The classic Western is a racial mythology. Integration finished the classic Western, though it took television, a very reactionary medium, some years to notice. No modern Western can get away with reducing the native Americans to savages joyfully slaughtered, or even vanishing noble savages sensitively mourned, the occasional enlightened variant. Putting the African Americans and Chinese back into the landscape paints the American Eden in different colors.
None of your objections are relevant. A perfectly good Western could be made from the perspective of a black character. It's probably already been done, in fact, I just haven't heard about it.
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Old June 23 2010, 03:49 AM   #38
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
stj wrote: View Post
The classic Western is a racial mythology. Integration finished the classic Western, though it took television, a very reactionary medium, some years to notice. No modern Western can get away with reducing the native Americans to savages joyfully slaughtered, or even vanishing noble savages sensitively mourned, the occasional enlightened variant. Putting the African Americans and Chinese back into the landscape paints the American Eden in different colors.
None of your objections are relevant. A perfectly good Western could be made from the perspective of a black character. It's probably already been done, in fact, I just haven't heard about it.
We tend to be very proud of our Buffalo Soldiers. The last TV Western I saw featured a Black preacher who married a Native American in the Oklahoma Indian territories but he was lynched after trying to protect her fro a rape mob.
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Old June 23 2010, 03:50 AM   #39
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

KB24 wrote: View Post
TNT did that nice little movie Purgatory.
I loved that film. It was genuinely creepy towards the end. And Eric Roberts played the nastiest villain I've ever seen in a western.
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Old June 23 2010, 07:50 AM   #40
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

Totally bizarre that my posts showed up out of order!

It may be taboo, but I like the racial wrongs in westerns. My favorite movie is The Searchers, and it is such a weird mix of 19th century racism mixed with 50s segregation. Looking with a modern lense however, we can see this ideologies as wrong. What's wrong with having a show that shows history's ills?

It's a long review, but here's an excerpt from my thesis on The Searchers:


The Statements

Despite its wonderful cast and visuals, The Searchers is not a western where the good guys where white hats and the bad boys are all in black. It’s reflections on racism, Manifest Destiny, and the Confederacy are clear enough to any modern viewer. From the first mention of Ethan’s allegiance to the South to Laurie’s final declaration that a bullet in Debbie’s brain is best, we know this picture says a lot more than most westerns or most of its McCarthy era compatriots. Not only commenting on its story material, The Searchers also says a lot about its time. There are no black actors in sight-and I’m sure if I researched enough I could find out that surely there were real American Indians involved in the production. Nevertheless, you can’t see any of them onscreen. Painted white actors- Scar actor Henry Brandon was born in Germany!-portray the stereotypical feather headdress wearing Injuns, and the Mexicans offered all wear sombreros. Today The Searchers doesn’t look dated; it simply looks like a film of its time that’s bravely commentating on a hundred years prior. Unfortunately, our nation’s true colors seem to have changed little in that time.



Like other John Ford pictures, The US Cavalry makes an appearance here. Instead of being the hero, however, The Searchers offers a somewhat underhanded treatment of the Army. First the Cavalry and its Indian Agencies interfere with Ethan’s search and provide little help. Later, Lieutenant Greenhill is made out to be a dumb, spoiled boy who doesn’t know what he’s doing-and he and his bugler are the only significant Cavalrymen in the picture. Some viewers think a brief scene in which Captain Clayton has an undisclosed rear end injury is out of place; however, I think he was stuck in the butt with Greenhill’s sword. He’s warned earlier by Clayton to take care with his ‘knife’, and to me the butt wound represents the pain in the backside that Northern interference and reconstruction was to the still proud South.

Also seeming to rub the wrong way in The Searchers is the juxtaposition of religion and violence. The local reverend is also the ranger captain for goodness sake, and he has no problem shouting Hallelujah after he’s shot a few Indians. Clayton also comments in the opening moments of the film that Debbie still isn’t baptized-does this mean she’s more susceptible to those Injun ways? Before a battle with Scar, Mose erroneously prays, ‘That which we are about to receive, we thank thee, oh Lord.’ Shortly thereafter, Martin has mixed feelings about his first Indian kill, but he quickly gets over it and continues firing. This observance of white hypocrisy parallels the relationship between Ethan and Scar, for both fights to avenge killed family. Ethan constantly refers to evil Bucks, non-human Comanche, scalping-he even shoots the eyes out of a dead Indian so the man will ‘wonder forever between the winds’.


Why don’t we think good of Scar-a man who has lost two sons-when he takes in a young and lost Debbie and raises her as his own? Are we to be pleased when Ethan scalps Scar? It’s not a question of if the situations were reversed, for in many ways Ethan and his Indian enemies are not that different. We’re supposed to like the white guys even if we know their ways are wrong and hate the Indians for their misunderstood violence. Although The Searchers has a feel good ending, the getting there is uneasy, complex, and complicated. The irony is that Ethan hopes to find Debbie and return her to the Jorgensen’s homestead. It’s not even really her home, merely neighbors from when Debbie was five years old. We are given the impression that she’s better off with an unrelated white family than Indians who raised her as their own. It’s never even considered that she might be better off staying where she’s acclimated. In fact, it’s quite the opposite. Once Ethan sees Debbie as a full-fledged squaw, his sentiments that living as a Comanche isn’t worth the living are fulfilled.


http://ithinkthereforeireview.blogsp...rs-part-2.html

ETA: Oh hey, didn't think the pics would come up here, neat!
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Old June 24 2010, 01:16 AM   #41
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

Oh, I do remember "The Young Riders". I enjoyed it very much as a kid... God knows what I would think about it now.
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Old June 26 2010, 02:08 PM   #42
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

The Western is a dead genre right now so no they wouldn't make a Western TV show.

However, the popularity of genres increases and decreases in different periods of time. Westerns will be back at some point in time.

An 'episodic' Western would probably and hopefully get laughed off of TV though. Nowadays they need to and should include character and story development in a series.

stj wrote: View Post
The classic Western is a racial mythology. Integration finished the classic Western, though it took television, a very reactionary medium, some years to notice. No modern Western can get away with reducing the native Americans to savages joyfully slaughtered
That's an excellent point. That certainly would make it harder for not-so-talented writers to write a good Western nowadays than it would be for similar writers to do so in the past.

However, I'm sure they could still get away with portraying Cowboys vs. Indians in a war situation by doing it in a non-racist way. Just because it hasn't been done before (AFAIK) doesn't mean that it cannot be done.

Failing that, they could always leave it as Cowboys vs. Other Cowboys.
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Old June 26 2010, 04:07 PM   #43
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

You know, a lot of the more well-regarded westerns are not about "Cowboys vs Indians" or show the Native Americans in a more sophisticated way. I'm not nearly as familar with TV westerns as I am movies but most don't strike me as one-note either, especially something like "Have Gun Will Travel" where Paladin regular takes up arms for Indians, Mexicans, and Chinese.
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Old June 26 2010, 04:48 PM   #44
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

A "Western" that treated cowboys and Indians in a non-stereotypical or non-racist way probably would be considered a period drama, not a "Western." This may be a path already started by Deadwood, but I haven't seen any of that. The thing about period dramas is that there's lots of periods to pick from.

Almost anyone picking the US West circa 1848 to 1890 is probably attracted by the Western racial mythology to start with. Anyone interested in US/American Indian relations would find Tecumseh, or King Philip, or Handsome Lake, or the Pequot War or any number of other fascinating stories. The other Western tropes either have modern counterparts, lawman vs. chaos in particular. Or, they are now very remote from modern experience, like cowboy vs. settler, or cow vs. sheep (rural experience was still much in living memory fifty years ago.)
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Old June 26 2010, 06:25 PM   #45
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Re: a new Western as a TV episodic series? discuss

So a western is only about Cowboys and Indians and everything else is a period piece? And the only people interested in stories in that period are only drawn to that racial conflict? I think your definitions are too narrow.
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