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Old May 4 2010, 02:52 AM   #31
JD
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Rush Limborg wrote: View Post
Starfleet Intelligence recruits a pair of genetically enhanced agents: Dr. Julian Bashir, of station Deep Space 9, and Sarina Douglas, a woman whose talents Bashir helped bring to fruition, and whom Bashir thinks of as his long-lost true love.
I feel like letting out a Klingon Death Scream.

(counts to ten, does some "plexing")

Okay...now:

Captain Ezri Dax and her crew on the U.S.S. Aventine play a dangerous game of cat and mouse with a Typhon Pact fleet that stands between them and the safe retrieval of Bashir and Douglas from hostile territory.
All right...that makes it easier to swallow.

Mr. Mack...I will see how this works out...and I wonder if this will turn into a possible triangle--Ezri/Sarina/Bashir. I think I'd love to see that--especially if it "knocks some sense" into Ezri, and gets rid of that attitude she'd had towards Bashir throughout the relaunch. (I actually wrote an alternate version of Ezri's "Come to I'nora" moment for the FanFic forum....)

But I sincerely hope that this book does NOT close any doors for Ezri. She and Julian have suffered enough from that break-up. For goodness sake, it's bad enough that we get the "aw, gee, the Bashir/Ezri feelings weren't REAL, it was just a redo of Worf/Ezri--just a by-product of the Jadzia/Bashir feelings".

But NOW--to have THIS happen!



I'm sorry, I'm just...a little worked up about that break-up.

Seriously...I'll look forward to this. But, if some details of this...relationship...were possible...?

(And...FWIW, I think the "moments" between Ezri and Julian are reaonable rivalry for the last scene in "Chrysalis", IMANSHO. )
Just keep in mind that this is 5 years after the end of their relationship, which (I don't think) lasted even a year. Personally, I doubt that there relationship will play to big a role in the story,since they hopefully would have resolved any major issues by then.
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Old May 4 2010, 03:15 AM   #32
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

"Next time, on a very special Star Trek: Aventine...."
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Old May 4 2010, 11:57 AM   #33
Rush Limborg
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Just keep in mind that this is 5 years after the end of their relationship, which (I don't think) lasted even a year.
It lasted longer than Julian/Sarina, I can tell you that.

And hey--the first Troi/Riker romance didn't last that long--and yet look how they ended up!

But anyhow--it suddenly occured me: "Wait a minute--the title is Zero Sum Game! In a "zero sum game", someone wins, and someone loses. Therefore...if a major focus is going to be on Bashir's (alleged) feelings for Sarina...and this is a zero sum game...that indicates a triangle is coming!"

And...if that is where Mr. Mack's taking it--there is precedent. If you remember in "Chrysalis", Sarina goes back to her catatonic state, and Bashir discusses his struggle to find out what's wrong with her...with Ezri.

My point is, at the end of the scene, where Julian is trying to talk to Sarina, and get through to her...you can see Ezri in the background, watching them. You can't see her reaction--the background is blurred for effect--but I should think that leaves a lot of room open for interperetation.

Personally, I doubt that there relationship will play to big a role in the story,since they hopefully would have resolved any major issues by then.
Considering how completely...unfounded...her justification was for the break-up in the first place*...something tells me that Ezri, at least, shoved that into the back of her mind. Again, much as Deanna and Will did.

On a last note...I tend to be weary when the writers tend to "discourage without denouncing" a certain theory on the future novels. To wit: I and others were wondering if the tensions between the Allies and the Typhon Pact would lead to outbreaks of conflict--battles, etc. As I recall, the writers were all trying to downplay that with "Oh, don't you think you've had enough of war?" even though that wasn't QUITE what I was talking about....

And now we find, lo and behold, that it IS a Cold War, with espianoge, sabotage, and military build-ups, and other close calls!

So in other words...considering the apparent downplay of any notion of Ezri being Bahsir's real true love--as of now, anyway...that gives me some hope.

Some, but not a lot.



*Not a slam of Mike and Andy--just a passionate feeling about a creative decision made for Unjoined.
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Old May 4 2010, 12:41 PM   #34
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

The zero sum game in Zero Sum Game could be a reference to the Federation/Pact standoff and/or the Breen having stolen the Slipstream hence the spec ops mission to destroy it.

The Bashir/Sarina relationship will be interesting to see I think. I always liked her character and thought that she'd be a great fit for the good Doctor. Ezri has grown so much as a person these past years, I think getting back into it with Julian would be a step backwards. That said, I'm not 100% opposed to it if done right... and with David Mack on the case I can say for sure that it'll be done right no matter the relationship outcomes (at least IMO - link back to the Mack Appreciation Thread http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=109712).
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Old May 4 2010, 01:07 PM   #35
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Rush Limborg wrote:
On a last note...I tend to be weary when the writers tend to "discourage without denouncing" a certain theory on the future novels. To wit: I and others were wondering if the tensions between the Allies and the Typhon Pact would lead to outbreaks of conflict--battles, etc. As I recall, the writers were all trying to downplay that with "Oh, don't you think you've had enough of war?" even though that wasn't QUITE what I was talking about....

And now we find, lo and behold, that it IS a Cold War, with espianoge, sabotage, and military build-ups, and other close calls!
Uh, not quite right.

In fact, the term "cold war" and anything/everything the term implied was used pretty much from the beginning as a comparison. What folks were trying to say (and kept getting run over) was that this was not going to be another all-out war, ala the Dominion War, the Borg invasion, etc.

Of course, I didn't say much at all, so......


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Old May 4 2010, 02:08 PM   #36
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

And what I've been saying about the Typhon Pact all along was not that it would be all hunky-dory, which would obviously be an absurd proposition because then there'd be no story, but that it would be a more complicated situation than Yet Another Evil Empire Bent On Annihilating Us All. That complexity, as I've said many times, gives the situation the potential to go either way. The Typhon Pact could evolve in a benevolent direction or a more negative one, and it's the events of the next few years of story time that may determine which path history takes. Which is why it's a huge mistake to assume that the Typhon Pact is simply going to be a bunch of eeevilll moustache-twirlers out to destroy the UFP. There are many, many possible sources of crisis and conflict here, not just wars and invasions. That's the point I've been trying to make -- not that there wouldn't be conflict, but that some people were being way too simplistic in their assumptions about what kinds of conflict could occur.

Star Trek, with a few exceptions, has not historically been a franchise about war. It's mostly been about seeking, and usually finding, alternatives to war. So it's always been bewildering to me that some people have been expecting this to be just another war story.
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Old May 4 2010, 02:30 PM   #37
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

And I hardly think anyone really proposed that it would be war, per se. It's a given that after the Borg, another war would obliterate most of the major powers--particularly the UFP.

But the intensity with which The Big Boys promoted the idea of the UFP being "neighbors" with the Pact, for me, sent up a red flag that eveyone was covering for something. Lo and behold...

But the point is, the cryptic silence here...is setting me on edge once again. Maybe it's just nerves--but as you all said, we'll find out at Shore Leave.


Okay. Next:

USS Hartington wrote: View Post
The zero sum game in Zero Sum Game could be a reference to the Federation/Pact standoff and/or the Breen having stolen the Slipstream hence the spec ops mission to destroy it.

The Bashir/Sarina relationship will be interesting to see I think. I always liked her character and thought that she'd be a great fit for the good Doctor.
Maybe...but I'd always thought that Bashir's crush on her was simply out of desperation--out of a desire to be lonely no longer. He projected the idea of romance onto a girl who had only just joined the outside world. He himself said as much.

Ezri has grown so much as a person these past years, I think getting back into it with Julian would be a step backwards.
You're saying that her leaving him was en example of her maturing?

I'd say it was to the contrary. Her conflicts with him over the relaunch were out of a decidedly immature "My ideas are right, and how dare Julian question that?"

Her claim in Unjoined that maybe their feelings were all a fake--that it was just a by-product of Jadzia--was, to me, just a subconcious excuse to sidestep the fact that she was shoving him aside, taking him for granted, and so on.

To the contrary--Ezri "wising up" to her problem, and making things right with Julian, would be a MAJOR step forward.

IMANSHO, of course.

That said, I'm not 100% opposed to it if done right... and with David Mack on the case I can say for sure that it'll be done right no matter the relationship outcomes (at least IMO - link back to the Mack Appreciation Thread http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=109712).
Oh, not just your opinion. Mack's treatment of the new Captain Ezri Dax was just supremely AWESOME!

Although...I do have something to say about his having her occasionally engage in...shall I say...more colorful metaphors.

"Lonnoc, what I need you to do is get your back on the bridge," and so forth.

Sorry, but...of all the characters on Trek...I never thought Ezri capable of profanity. She never did it on the show, so...

(I know--Spock never cursed, until TVH--and that was the point. He was expirimenting, and it was funny. Maybe...)
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Old May 4 2010, 02:37 PM   #38
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Rush Limborg wrote:
But the intensity with which The Big Boys denounced the idea of war, quite frankly, sent up a red flag that eveyone was covering for something. Lo and behold...
It was being denounced because people were complaining about "yet another war," and Christopher and others were trying to tell everyone to calm down, not jump to conclusions, not to prejudge....you know, to try and avoid pretty much everything that always happens whenever any new project is announced. I realize you think you cracked some super secret code, but everything you needed to know at the time was laid out right there for everyone to see...how devious of us, eh?
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Old May 4 2010, 02:47 PM   #39
Rush Limborg
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Dayton Ward wrote: View Post
Rush Limborg wrote:
But the intensity with which The Big Boys denounced the idea of war, quite frankly, sent up a red flag that eveyone was covering for something. Lo and behold...
It was being denounced because people were complaining about "yet another war," and Christopher and others were trying to tell everyone to calm down, not jump to conclusions, not to prejudge....you know, to try and avoid pretty much everything that always happens whenever any new project is announced. I realize you think you cracked some super secret code, but everything you needed to know at the time was laid out right there for everyone to see...how devious of us, eh?
Well, I believe it was Edgat Allen Poe who asserted that the best place to hide anything...is in plain sight.
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Old May 4 2010, 03:23 PM   #40
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Rush Limborg wrote: View Post
But the intensity with which The Big Boys promoted the idea of the UFP being "neighbors" with the Pact, for me, sent up a red flag that eveyone was covering for something. Lo and behold...
That observation is wrong on every possible level. First of all, I'm not "The Big Boys." I'm a freelance author speaking only for myself, an author who happened to be aware of some of the early development process of this miniseries, not to mention what was already published in A Singular Destiny, making it clear that those people who stereotyped the six Pact members as unremittingly hostile were simply wrong. ASD made it quite explicit that the Pact as a whole halted the independent aggressive acts of the Kinshaya and Tholians, so anyone who thought that the entire Pact was out to invade or destroy the UFP was grossly misreading what was already there.

Second, for the three hundredth time, I never said there would be no tensions or conflicts with the Pact. I just said they would be more complex and subtle than just another war or invasion, and that the Pact itself was too complex and multifaceted to dumb down to just another Evil Empire. I wasn't saying the books would be peaceful, just that they wouldn't be anything as boring and repetitive as another war story. I said there was the potential for the Pact to evolve into a neighbor with whom stable relations were possible, but I also said, over and over again, that there was also the potential for the Pact to develop in a more negative way. That was the complexity that made the situation so interesting and challenging. If I did stress the positive potentials disproportionately, it was only to counter other people's kneejerk assumptions that only the negative potentials existed. I was trying to point out that they were both present.

Third, as I already pointed out before, the blurbs as posted reinforce my point rather than contradicting it. One describes a Cold War espionage mission. One describes a competition over technology, something that would go under the category of economic competition. One describes the two factions of Romulans clashing with their respective allies apparently playing a peripheral role. None of them depicts the Pact as a single monolithic enemy fighting a shooting war with the Federation. They depict the Pact as several distinct factions with distinct agendas and portray a wide range of different types of crisis and competition. That is exactly what I said would be the case all along.

Fourth: I'm not a liar. If I have a secret to keep, I just won't say anything. At most, I may say something ambiguous enough to be misleading. But I don't lie outright, because that would be a scummy thing to do. Not to mention the fact that, as established in the previous paragraph, nothing I said before was actually untrue.

So you couldn't be more totally off-base about this.
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Old May 4 2010, 04:50 PM   #41
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Chris...I deeply apologize if that was how I came across. "The Big Boys" was a reference to your being a big name author in TrekLit.

I do not believe you are a liar by any account--nor did I accuse you of being one. Furthermore, I did not accuse anyone of lying--at all.

All I meant was simply what you said here:

Christopher wrote: View Post
At most, I may say something ambiguous enough to be misleading.
Nothing more...nothing less.
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Old May 4 2010, 09:34 PM   #42
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

David Mack has posted the cover for Zero Sum Game on his blog.


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Old May 4 2010, 09:48 PM   #43
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Really aiming to artistically take after Destiny, eh?

I love it though. Great color design, great image of Bashir, nice use of the graphical elements around the edges. Cool stuff.
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Old May 4 2010, 09:53 PM   #44
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Ezri is looking fine. I'd expected the Aventine to be more... visible, though.
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Old May 4 2010, 09:55 PM   #45
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Re: Official Final Typhon Pact blurbs

Well, it's incredibly long and narrow, so unless it's flying diagonally across the page it'd be pretty hard to make it all that prominent. It's just not shaped very well to fit in a MMPB-dimension image.
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