A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) Discussion & Grading

Cmndr J Crichton · April 30 2010, 05:58 AM

I can't believe no one's started a thread! I'm somewhat interested in this movie. If only for Jackie Earl Haley. To me Robert Englund will always be Freddy Krueger. This remake I thought would never come. I would rather have seen a pseudo sequel to FVJ with Englund.

Then again, I thought no one could ever recreate Spock like Quinto did. I might catch a matinee of this movie next week. I unfortunately work the whole weekend. I am revisiting the Nightmare movies to tide me over now, though.

Plot synopsis: A re-imagining of the horror icon Freddy Krueger, a serial-killer who wields a glove with four blades embedded in the fingers and kills people in their dreams, resulting in their real death in reality.

startrekwatcher · April 30 2010, 06:02 AM

YOu just can't go back. I can't think off the top of my head of a good remake that bested the original. They've all been disappointments for me--Friday the 13th, Halloween, Halloween II, Amityville Horror, The Karate Kid etc--and I don't think this remake can topple one of my all time favorite horror flicks. Hollywood needs to stop remaking stuff--all it does is remind me how piss poor entertainment is these days.

Cmndr J Crichton · April 30 2010, 06:08 AM

startrekwatcher wrote:

I can't think off the top of my head of a good remake that bested the original.

Scarface. The Incredible Hulk, (I know pulling at strings), Batman Begins, Casino Royale.

Cmndr J Crichton · April 30 2010, 06:11 AM

Crap! I've mis-spelled street! Must've hit the R instead of the T. Can it be fixed?

Broccoli · April 30 2010, 06:40 AM

I'm really not a horror fan, but I'd go and see this because it was filmed partially at my high school.

Cmndr J Crichton wrote:

startrekwatcher wrote:

I can't think off the top of my head of a good remake that bested the original.

Scarface. The Incredible Hulk, (I know pulling at strings), Batman Begins, Casino Royale.

Scarface you can argue. However, Incredible Hulk and Batman Begins are reboots/reinterpretations and not direct remakes of a previous film.

Casino Royale kinda has its foot in both camps.

Mike Farley · April 30 2010, 08:12 AM

startrekwatcher wrote:

YOu just can't go back. I can't think off the top of my head of a good remake that bested the original.

The Ten Commandments, Ben Hur, The Maltese Falcon, The Thing, The Fly, The Blob...remakes and sequels have ALWAYS been a big part of Hollywood. The only difference is that now, in the home video age, the original movies are readily available while in the past, if you missed it, you missed it.

JacksonArcher · April 30 2010, 08:53 AM

I saw the movie at an advance screening Wednesday night in downtown Chicago. My verdict? Samuel Bayer's A Nightmare on Elm Street is definitely not as good as Wes Craven's original, for a variety of different reasons (Warning: mild spoilers follow)...

Wes Craven's film worked primarily because he was working with a small budget, so everything had this grungy and gritty look. Those limited resources allowed him to bend the line for what was real, and what was dream. This worked because we almost never fully remember our dreams, which is why they've always been so tricky to depict on film. We usually only remember fragments, and the great appeal of Craven's original film is that you were never sure when you were in the real world or in Freddy's world. The remake doesn't blur that line nearly as well, and because of Bayer's background as a music video director, he gives the dream sequences a heightened visual style, so it was obvious from the getgo that we're in Freddy's world and we lose a lot of that suspense.
One of the other big reasons why Craven's original film was so good was because it was ambiguous about Freddy Krueger's sketchy past. He was defined as a "child killer", and molestation was never strongly hinted at, but merely alluded. By making him simply a child killer, it made Krueger that much scarier, and in the original film he's played as a very sinister guy, whereas in the later sequels he becomes a one-line joke, a wise-ass that completely loses the sinister edge that he had that worked so well in the original. Jackie Earl Haley returns to that, resembling the Freddy from the first film the most, but he still has some one-liners even though they are more darkly sardonic than outright witty or sarcastic. Furthermore, his past is given much more attention, and while it very smartly toys with the idea that maybe he was innocent, it never really commits to that idea, and it brings the molestation angle into much greater focus, forcing Freddy to become less the embodiment of evil and revenge, but more a confused figure that we don't understand.
This has been my main criticism with all of the recent horror remakes is that they are soulless copies of what came before, and A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) is no different. It's far more polished than Craven's original, with a much bigger budget and the advantage of better digital effects, but as a consequence it loses a lot of the grit and realism that worked so well for Craven's original. The characters are merely tertiary stand-ins with no personality or real purpose, the visuals are flashy but empty, and at the end of the day there's nothing really remarkable about what you're seeing. A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) feels like a cheap cash-in, which is all the more frustrating because it isn't outright bad, and it may have been easier to hate had it been, but it's just passably mediocre and ultimately forgettable.

However, there are some things that do work. Nancy, our heroine, is given a meaty subplot and character arc that directly ties into Freddy Krueger's past. It isn't developed much, but there is an emotional resonance and while the actress playing Nancy isn't the world's best, the role doesn't really require magnificent acting, but there's enough on the screen and in the script to really pull you in and root for this character. It was one of the bright spots about the recent Friday the 13th remake, where you have actual characters that are likable and you can root for. It does sort of conflict with those original films, where the teenagers were disposable because you were rooting for Jason or Freddy or Michael Myers to kill them, but I do like the fact that we're given some decent characters that have some resemblance of a character arc that allows the audience to become (even somewhat) emotionally invested in the story.

That said, A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) does take a much more serious and darker approach than what was taken with the Freddy the 13th remake, and I commend the filmmakers for at least trying. It is very visually appealing, even though that at times detracts from the film, and while Jackie Earl Haley's performance is strong, the Freddy character is uneven which is more to do with the mediocre writing than it does Haley's strong performance.

It's a bit upsetting and defeatist to say that A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) is probably the best recent horror remake, but that's more of a backhanded compliment when you take into consideration what horror has had to offer recently when it comes down to remakes (or "re-imaginings") such as Rob Zombie's terrible Halloween films, the aforementioned Friday the 13th and The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

T'Baio · April 30 2010, 02:46 PM

You know what's starting to really annoy me about the reviews for this film? Whether people think it's good or bad, I don't care. But there are a lot of reviewers out there mocking the concept of micro naps, derisively calling it pseudo this or that, or saying it's an awfully convenient plot device.

All these people are making themselves look really stupid.

Micro naps/sleeps are a real thing! I give the writers credit for doing their research.

So many reviewers...so many morons.

Cmndr J Crichton · April 30 2010, 06:02 PM

However, how was JEH as Freddy? Did he surpass, equal, or lower Englund's Iconic portrayal?

publiusr · April 30 2010, 07:00 PM

This Freddie is someone you could have a conversation with if he didn't kill you.
Now I like Robert's take of course. I always thought it would be nice to have Jason vs Michael Myers, since the Freddie vs Jason film had Freddie doing all the speaking.

On the comic side, I would love to see a story of famous villains in hell.

I think a Freddie vs Pinhead match would be interesting, with Robert's Freddie being a Hawkeye Pierce character to Pinhead's Charles Emerson Winchester (MASH).

Jason and others would simply be doormen in Hell, with Freddy and others being manservants for Angus Scrimm and others at the head of the table. Boris and Bela of course talk about old times.

Vincent Price is the Master of Ceremonies of course--and in my minds eye, does most of the speaking.

There Dexter is brought before them after his death to see what punishment is meeted out. They discuss his crimes, his methods, and other such matters. There is a B story where certain souls go missing in Hell. This is whispered about as even the masters of terror show concern. Barlow's visions flit about in Tintinnabulum.

A rioting band of racists is killed due to a freak accident. The famous Monsters of the movies (Forest J Ackerman in the background) are so horrified by the actions of these fools that even they are sickened, and so they are fed directly to Satan, whose three faces now gnaw at Stalin, Mao, and Hitler--who being flayed at the center mouth, Judas having been downed in the Sarlacc pitt as it were long ago...

But something else disturbs the Masque, as the Man in the Pallid Mask returns from Bethmoora, represented by a Tatterdemalion figure with skin tight fabric drwn taut over a skull with no skin--lit from within--and of course, wearing a top hat. The demasking begins as Charon spills his bag over the pit as waves lap the shore, waters receeding in fear of what the moon brings.

Satan, the great evil one himself, is torn asunder by something far below. You see the humanoid legends scatter, as the shadow of Cthulhu and his brother rise to take over hell.

Along the shore the cloud waves break,
The twin suns sink behind the lake, The shadows lengthen In Carcosa. Strange is the night where black stars rise, And strange moons circle through the skies, But stranger still is Lost Carcosa. Songs that the Hyades shall sing, Where flap the tatters of the King, Must die unheard in Dim Carcosa. Song of my soul, my voice is dead, Die thou, unsung, as tears unshed Shall dry and die in ...Lost Carcosa. —"Cassilda's Song" in The King in Yellow Act 1, Scene 2

nx1701g · April 30 2010, 09:00 PM

publiusr wrote:

I think a Freddie vs Pinhead match would be interesting...

That was the original proposed ending to Freddy Vs. Jason. Jason and Freddy would wake up in Leviathan's Hell and Freddy would go to stab Jason. Right before he'd connect a chain would pull his hand back and Pinhead would be standing there telling the two they had eternity to play or something to that effect.

Silvercrest · April 30 2010, 09:18 PM

I believe the line was going to be, "Gentlemen, what seems to be the problem here?"

nx1701g · April 30 2010, 09:19 PM

^ Ah I think that you're right. I'm probably thinking about another line the character had in one of his films.

Wonder what his lines will be like in the remake of Hellraiser (yes they have one in development).

Cmndr J Crichton · May 1 2010, 04:50 AM

nx1701g wrote:

publiusr wrote:

I think a Freddie vs Pinhead match would be interesting...

That was the original proposed ending to Freddy Vs. Jason. Jason and Freddy would wake up in Leviathan's Hell and Freddy would go to stab Jason. Right before he'd connect a chain would pull his hand back and Pinhead would be standing there telling the two they had eternity to play or something to that effect.

That would;ve been awesome! Only thing cooler would've been Ash stepping out of the shadows. He could say something like 'Which one of you freaks knows the way out of here?'

(Whoever fixed the thread title, thanks!')

Admiral_Young · May 1 2010, 04:58 AM

^ Damn all of those things sound really cool...especially the Ash suggested.

April 30 2010, 05:58 AM	#1
Cmndr J Crichton Commodore Location: Moya	A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) Discussion & Grading I can't believe no one's started a thread! I'm somewhat interested in this movie. If only for Jackie Earl Haley. To me Robert Englund will always be Freddy Krueger. This remake I thought would never come. I would rather have seen a pseudo sequel to FVJ with Englund. Then again, I thought no one could ever recreate Spock like Quinto did. I might catch a matinee of this movie next week. I unfortunately work the whole weekend. I am revisiting the Nightmare movies to tide me over now, though. Plot synopsis: A re-imagining of the horror icon Freddy Krueger, a serial-killer who wields a glove with four blades embedded in the fingers and kills people in their dreams, resulting in their real death in reality. __________________ A Digital Frontier to shape the human condition...not just a book plug.

April 30 2010, 06:02 AM	#2
startrekwatcher Rear Admiral	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading YOu just can't go back. I can't think off the top of my head of a good remake that bested the original. They've all been disappointments for me--Friday the 13th, Halloween, Halloween II, Amityville Horror, The Karate Kid etc--and I don't think this remake can topple one of my all time favorite horror flicks. Hollywood needs to stop remaking stuff--all it does is remind me how piss poor entertainment is these days.

April 30 2010, 06:11 AM	#4
Cmndr J Crichton Commodore Location: Moya	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading Crap! I've mis-spelled street! Must've hit the R instead of the T. Can it be fixed? __________________ A Digital Frontier to shape the human condition...not just a book plug.

April 30 2010, 08:53 AM	#7
JacksonArcher Vice Admiral	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading I saw the movie at an advance screening Wednesday night in downtown Chicago. My verdict? Samuel Bayer's A Nightmare on Elm Street is definitely not as good as Wes Craven's original, for a variety of different reasons (Warning: mild spoilers follow)... Wes Craven's film worked primarily because he was working with a small budget, so everything had this grungy and gritty look. Those limited resources allowed him to bend the line for what was real, and what was dream. This worked because we almost never fully remember our dreams, which is why they've always been so tricky to depict on film. We usually only remember fragments, and the great appeal of Craven's original film is that you were never sure when you were in the real world or in Freddy's world. The remake doesn't blur that line nearly as well, and because of Bayer's background as a music video director, he gives the dream sequences a heightened visual style, so it was obvious from the getgo that we're in Freddy's world and we lose a lot of that suspense. One of the other big reasons why Craven's original film was so good was because it was ambiguous about Freddy Krueger's sketchy past. He was defined as a "child killer", and molestation was never strongly hinted at, but merely alluded. By making him simply a child killer, it made Krueger that much scarier, and in the original film he's played as a very sinister guy, whereas in the later sequels he becomes a one-line joke, a wise-ass that completely loses the sinister edge that he had that worked so well in the original. Jackie Earl Haley returns to that, resembling the Freddy from the first film the most, but he still has some one-liners even though they are more darkly sardonic than outright witty or sarcastic. Furthermore, his past is given much more attention, and while it very smartly toys with the idea that maybe he was innocent, it never really commits to that idea, and it brings the molestation angle into much greater focus, forcing Freddy to become less the embodiment of evil and revenge, but more a confused figure that we don't understand. This has been my main criticism with all of the recent horror remakes is that they are soulless copies of what came before, and A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) is no different. It's far more polished than Craven's original, with a much bigger budget and the advantage of better digital effects, but as a consequence it loses a lot of the grit and realism that worked so well for Craven's original. The characters are merely tertiary stand-ins with no personality or real purpose, the visuals are flashy but empty, and at the end of the day there's nothing really remarkable about what you're seeing. A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) feels like a cheap cash-in, which is all the more frustrating because it isn't outright bad, and it may have been easier to hate had it been, but it's just passably mediocre and ultimately forgettable. However, there are some things that do work. Nancy, our heroine, is given a meaty subplot and character arc that directly ties into Freddy Krueger's past. It isn't developed much, but there is an emotional resonance and while the actress playing Nancy isn't the world's best, the role doesn't really require magnificent acting, but there's enough on the screen and in the script to really pull you in and root for this character. It was one of the bright spots about the recent Friday the 13th remake, where you have actual characters that are likable and you can root for. It does sort of conflict with those original films, where the teenagers were disposable because you were rooting for Jason or Freddy or Michael Myers to kill them, but I do like the fact that we're given some decent characters that have some resemblance of a character arc that allows the audience to become (even somewhat) emotionally invested in the story. That said, A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) does take a much more serious and darker approach than what was taken with the Freddy the 13th remake, and I commend the filmmakers for at least trying. It is very visually appealing, even though that at times detracts from the film, and while Jackie Earl Haley's performance is strong, the Freddy character is uneven which is more to do with the mediocre writing than it does Haley's strong performance. It's a bit upsetting and defeatist to say that A Nightmare on Elm Street (2010) is probably the best recent horror remake, but that's more of a backhanded compliment when you take into consideration what horror has had to offer recently when it comes down to remakes (or "re-imaginings") such as Rob Zombie's terrible Halloween films, the aforementioned Friday the 13th and The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.

April 30 2010, 02:46 PM	#8
T'Baio Admiral Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading You know what's starting to really annoy me about the reviews for this film? Whether people think it's good or bad, I don't care. But there are a lot of reviewers out there mocking the concept of micro naps, derisively calling it pseudo this or that, or saying it's an awfully convenient plot device. All these people are making themselves look really stupid. Micro naps/sleeps are a real thing! I give the writers credit for doing their research. So many reviewers...so many morons. __________________ Posthuman: A Science Fiction Web Series at www.sfntv.com and www.whatisameme.com, on the TrekBBS, and on the social network.

STAR TREK

CSI

ABOUT US

April 30 2010, 06:02 PM	#9
Cmndr J Crichton Commodore Location: Moya	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading However, how was JEH as Freddy? Did he surpass, equal, or lower Englund's Iconic portrayal? __________________ A Digital Frontier to shape the human condition...not just a book plug.

April 30 2010, 07:00 PM	#10
publiusr Fleet Captain	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading This Freddie is someone you could have a conversation with if he didn't kill you. Now I like Robert's take of course. I always thought it would be nice to have Jason vs Michael Myers, since the Freddie vs Jason film had Freddie doing all the speaking. On the comic side, I would love to see a story of famous villains in hell. I think a Freddie vs Pinhead match would be interesting, with Robert's Freddie being a Hawkeye Pierce character to Pinhead's Charles Emerson Winchester (MASH). Jason and others would simply be doormen in Hell, with Freddy and others being manservants for Angus Scrimm and others at the head of the table. Boris and Bela of course talk about old times. Vincent Price is the Master of Ceremonies of course--and in my minds eye, does most of the speaking. There Dexter is brought before them after his death to see what punishment is meeted out. They discuss his crimes, his methods, and other such matters. There is a B story where certain souls go missing in Hell. This is whispered about as even the masters of terror show concern. Barlow's visions flit about in Tintinnabulum. A rioting band of racists is killed due to a freak accident. The famous Monsters of the movies (Forest J Ackerman in the background) are so horrified by the actions of these fools that even they are sickened, and so they are fed directly to Satan, whose three faces now gnaw at Stalin, Mao, and Hitler--who being flayed at the center mouth, Judas having been downed in the Sarlacc pitt as it were long ago... But something else disturbs the Masque, as the Man in the Pallid Mask returns from Bethmoora, represented by a Tatterdemalion figure with skin tight fabric drwn taut over a skull with no skin--lit from within--and of course, wearing a top hat. The demasking begins as Charon spills his bag over the pit as waves lap the shore, waters receeding in fear of what the moon brings. Satan, the great evil one himself, is torn asunder by something far below. You see the humanoid legends scatter, as the shadow of Cthulhu and his brother rise to take over hell. Along the shore the cloud waves break, The twin suns sink behind the lake, The shadows lengthen In Carcosa. Strange is the night where black stars rise, And strange moons circle through the skies, But stranger still is Lost Carcosa. Songs that the Hyades shall sing, Where flap the tatters of the King, Must die unheard in Dim Carcosa. Song of my soul, my voice is dead, Die thou, unsung, as tears unshed Shall dry and die in ...Lost Carcosa. —"Cassilda's Song" in The King in Yellow Act 1, Scene 2 Last edited by publiusr; April 30 2010 at 07:24 PM.

April 30 2010, 09:18 PM	#12
Silvercrest Rear Admiral Location: Lost in Moria (Arlington, WA, USA)	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading I believe the line was going to be, "Gentlemen, what seems to be the problem here?" __________________ Day 174. Still down here. The oddest thing just happened. A dwarf skeleton wearing a chain just fell past, in a nearby shaft. For some reason I expect to see a halfling come down next.

April 30 2010, 09:19 PM	#13
nx1701g Admiral Location: Aboard the Executor...	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading ^ Ah I think that you're right. I'm probably thinking about another line the character had in one of his films. Wonder what his lines will be like in the remake of Hellraiser (yes they have one in development). __________________ Star Trek: The Continuing Voyages RPG - Recruiting New Players! The Terminator Chronicles - The Sarah Connor Chronicles Continue! Not Dead Yet.

May 1 2010, 04:58 AM	#15
Admiral_Young Fleet Admiral Location: Metropolis	Re: A Nightmare on Elm Streer (2010) Discussion & Grading ^ Damn all of those things sound really cool...especially the Ash suggested. __________________ Admiral Young Chief of Operations Ignoring the The Last Stand since 2011.