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Old April 24 2010, 08:09 AM   #1
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
TOS Enterprise WIP

Hello

This thread is meant as a follow-up to another thread http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=114692&page=3 regarding TOS Shuttle storage. At the time, I was modeling the TOS Enterprise in Lightwave and had reached the flight deck/hangar deck portion and found TrekBBS I learned some interesting tidbits that I had not known before (and still am learning new things all the time.)

What I have determined to do as an experiment is to build out the internals (such as the shuttlebay, etc) much like some of the other neat threads that are going on here and then finish up with the external detailing.

The sources I am using are the 3 seasons of TOS episodes (excluding TAS) and some retro-inspiration from the first 6 movies.

It'll be slow going - mainly due to family and work, but I'll update periodically



An experimental concept for the support structure. At some I'm going to revisit the flight deck and shorten the length.
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Old April 24 2010, 08:15 AM   #2
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

When thinking about how the plumbing goes from the engine room to the warp nacelles and how much room I need to try and make near the flight deck I decided to build out the engine room.

Of course, the Enterprise went through several versions, so here is the one from the "Naked Time". Still need to do the front and hallways.

I think that those two "big machines" in the middle of the room must be movable by antigravs or something as they seem to be re-arranged alot

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Old April 24 2010, 02:18 PM   #3
Bernard Guignard
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Very nice work keep it up
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Old April 24 2010, 03:19 PM   #4
Mytran
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Location: North Wales
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

That engine room is looking fine! Just out of curiosity, how long did you make the "tubes" section?
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Old April 24 2010, 04:17 PM   #5
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Thanks

@Mytran - I think you are referring to the tube structures behind the giant grill that goes to the orange glowing end? Currently 10.7m. You can see that it still could be kinda short as it doesn't line up with the reference screenshot. I'm hoping to find a better screenshot that is more inline with that part as I understand it to be a forced-perspective piece.

However, I'm thinking that there are engine rooms in both hulls, so the ultimate length of that machinery will probably vary for practical purposes

Last edited by blssdwlf; April 24 2010 at 04:26 PM. Reason: However....
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Old April 24 2010, 08:16 PM   #6
Mytran
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Yes, that's the bit of machinery I was referring to. The tubes are a little short but as you pointed out it's going to depend on how much room you've got to play with! I assume this is a 947' long ship you're playing with?

The Engineering set was also used in The Enemy Within although the tubes are viewed at a slant. But that episode did give us the ceiling above those two big power units which were always being moved around.

Court Martial has a couple of blurry shots while Finnery and Kirk beat the tar out of each other, although this is a nice one.

The tube machinery did not change when the Engineering set was re-jigged after the 1st season, so these two shots from Journey To Babel are quite useful, being viewed as almost straight on.

You're right of course that the tubes were built as a forced perspective; as such, they change their apparant length depending on where the camera was at the time. A common setup was this:



...where you can see far more tubes than you should if it was "real". Fortunately the fandom has explained this away in numerous ways, so there's no problem using a "full length" tube set! However, it does illustrate the limitations of a FP set quite well.
As with all FP sets there's an optimum place of viewing - while I can't say for sure, I would imagine it's about 24' away from the centre of the grill, from about 6' off the ground (in other words the back wall of the set at head height).
Of course, the only way to really test this theory is to build it and have a look!
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Old April 25 2010, 03:23 AM   #7
wildstar
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Nice work!
Where do you plan on putting the engine room? (not to get into another debate about where or how many there are supposed to be).
If you search around, you'll find deck plans of TOS Enterprise, both in finished, and partially finished stages, if you don't have a plan yet on layout ideas.

Your engine room somehow "feels" smaller than it should be. Maybe it's just the lens you're using on your camera. The back wall feels closer than it should be, even though you're matching the live action shot. I don't know. I could be loopy.
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Old April 25 2010, 03:40 AM   #8
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Thanks Mytran for the reference shots I'll see if I can line up a shot to get a better estimate of the pipe structure.

The exterior model is scaled to 947' long.

@wildstar - I haven't planned the exact location yet on this one It most likely will be somewhere in the primary hull. The 2nd season engine room with the balcony area on the 2nd level I think would be best represented in the engineering hull.

The room does feel small - I had envisioned it to be larger.

One of the reasons I'm matching shots is as a check to be sure I'm staying somewhat accurate to the source material The camera was set to a focal length of 28mm that seem to best match the scene.
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Old April 25 2010, 03:58 AM   #9
wildstar
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Here's the stage plan if it helps:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3517/...6352ab33d4.jpg
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Old April 25 2010, 05:16 AM   #10
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

@wildstar - thanks for the image

@Mytran - no luck. I know I could manipulate the Court Martial screencap so that the pipes are perfectly centered to make a better aligned comparison, but it might not be a bad thing to keep the length a mystery

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Old April 25 2010, 08:33 AM   #11
Mytran
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

That's a shame, at first glance the Court Martial shot seemed pretty well centred! The Journey To Babel shot is less distorted (simply because it was filmed from further back) and only tilted at 1 degree.

To be "real" I figure the tubes section would have to be around 100' in length. However, trying to match it to the forced perspective set is always going to be dificult due to the reasons I mentioned in my last post. I wish you the best of luck!

As for size; the back wall should be 24' from the front one (the 2nd season set was 20'). However the set nowhere near matches the "maze" that is Engineering is often referred to as, hence many have speculated that there are several engine rooms within the Engineering Section, or at least a lot more than we ever saw on camera.

Last edited by Mytran; April 25 2010 at 08:59 AM.
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Old April 25 2010, 08:55 AM   #12
Albertese
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

In my current TOS Projects, I'm assuming that it's not forced perspective at all. Rather, it is actually a tapered bit of machinery just like the set-piece. After all, why does it have to be a FP set?

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Old April 25 2010, 11:13 AM   #13
Mytran
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Yes, that is the other solution to this problem (and also the one that Franz Joseph adopted, so it's got a good history!) If nothing else, it solves the viewing issues.

Do you have an in-universe explanation as to the mechanical reasoning behind the tapering shape?
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Old April 25 2010, 03:52 PM   #14
blssdwlf
Commodore
 
Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Mytran wrote: View Post
As for size; the back wall should be 24' from the front one (the 2nd season set was 20'). However the set nowhere near matches the "maze" that is Engineering is often referred to as, hence many have speculated that there are several engine rooms within the Engineering Section, or at least a lot more than we ever saw on camera.
Hi Mytran,

I've got some ideas about the "maze" for the "Enemy Within"

Out of curiosity, how did you get 24' for the length of the 1st season room? (I measured one of the 2 wall control panels from the "Journey to Babel" stage layout and tripled it but I admit it that my method is not very precise ) If there is a resource out there like stage notes indicating the dimensions of stuff I'd be very appreciative!

One more question for anyone who might know: how wide were the corridor/hallways? I'm measuring 3m from the stage layout but I'd like to be more accurate. Thanks in advance!

Last edited by blssdwlf; April 25 2010 at 04:05 PM.
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Old April 25 2010, 06:48 PM   #15
TIN_MAN
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Re: TOS Enterprise WIP

Check out Shaw's thread, "Another fan attempt at TOS deck plans". He just reposted his scaled Jefferies drawings for most of the sets. Also there are plans for the first season engine room available, I have a copy, but unfortunetly, it's humongoloid, and I don't have a scanner big enough to copy them on , so maybe someone else has them available and will ablige with a post?
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