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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Battlestar Galactica & Caprica

Battlestar Galactica & Caprica This forum was created by man. It rebelled. It evolved. And it has a plan.

 
 
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Old April 20 2010, 10:18 PM   #31
BolianAuthor
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

I have been able to enjoy both shows for what they are, and for the strong points of each. I don't particularly think Dirk Benedict was a good actor by any means, and I find it annoying to listen to his voice and speech pacing, but I can still enjoy TOS for its stories, and production values for the time, which was great. The thing that nuBSG totally ruined for me, not just with TOS BSG, but with ALL of science fiction in general, is the campiness...

After seeing nuBSG, I just cannot tolerate any form of campy sci fi... I just cringe and grate my teeth when I see it. Maybe this is why TNG is also my favorite Trek series... because the show dealt with serious and relevant issues in a way that wasn't as campy as TOS Trek did. I'm not saying that I like my sci fi dark and emo, but I DO appreciate that the story and characters be taken seriously, as well as the setting.
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Old April 20 2010, 11:26 PM   #32
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

Frontier wrote: View Post
I'm a tough critic, and I've never liked the old BSG. I tried it, I did, but I didn't like it. I won't bother with the reasons why; that isn't why I'm writing this thread. Debating the merits of one versus the other is utterly pointless.

What I want to say is... I think I finally get it. I think I get how you folks feel now, finally, after all this time.

The Razor/Plan soundtrack came on Saturday in the mail. I've been listening to it, re-listening to the others. I've been thoroughly dreadfully missing Galactica - my Galactica, nBSG. Missing Bill Adama, Kara Thrace, Saul Tigh, Laura Roslin, Colonial One, so on and so forth...

For whatever it's worth, from someone who never understood why anyone could miss the Old BSG... being here, now, missing my BSG?

I finally get it. What the new is to me, the old is to you.

Sounds like a simple realization, but not really. I've not been without nBSG in the pipe-line since the show began and I fell so thoroughly in love with it. Now I am. As I always will be.

Caprica kind of takes a degree of sting out of it, but only in so much as an aspirin.

Just like you fans of the old have been without for 30 years, now the rest of us are getting into the boat you've all been in for so long. We, too, are without and likely forever will be from here on out.

I don't know if anyone even cares about what I'm saying here, or if it'll just be ignored as some emotionally-based tripe I'm spouting at 1 AM because I'm feeling a bit blue.

But... for whatever it's worth... here's one nBSG fan who'll try and bite his tongue the next time I've got the chance to make a crack about the old show.

Because when you love something, and miss it, and know you'll likely never have it again... having someone rag on it just doesn't help.
What about us fans who like both?

I like both Galacticas starting with the same reason: the ship. Both are big-ass space aircraft carriers, the coolest ever in sci-fi. Beyond that, I like both Starbucks, both Adamas and i like the fact that Earth is the goal of the fugitives. I never missed the old Galactica because there was always a way for me to see it (reruns, VHS, DVD and online) and recently I've had new Galactica to tide me over.

What I've had a problem understanding is people on either side of the equation trashing the other fandom's show, mainly because I've come to love them both in spite of their flaws (and both shows have them. I'm not a complete lifer.).
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Old April 21 2010, 03:24 AM   #33
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

BolianAdmiral wrote: View Post

After seeing nuBSG, I just cannot tolerate any form of campy sci fi...


Sigh....Okay, I'm gonna try this one last time.

CAMPY=COMEDY

There was NOTHING campy about Original Galactica. Nobody said "Holy Whatever", there was no over the top acting. It was a drama. A family show. A straight sci-fi series.

The problem with the shows today is that they take good old fashioned family values and toss them in the john.

That's the thing with New Galactica. It takes itself TOO seriously with over the top angst and drama-emo bullshit. It was populated by whiny crybabies who would rather wallow in shit than try to improve their lot in life. Today's audeince have bee misled to believe this nonsense is "serious drama", and somehow "relevent". And the show collapses under it's own weight by not following through on it's premise. The whole point of the show is everything is bad, life is not worth living. And instead of taking it to it logical conclusion--the death of every last human being when the Cylons destroy the fleet, they actually make it to Earth, giving the show the sense of hope that it should have had from day one, but lacked.

This is deep? No. It's gratutious bullshit.
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Old April 21 2010, 04:08 AM   #34
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

RandyS wrote: View Post
Sigh....Okay, I'm gonna try this one last time.

CAMPY=COMEDY

There was NOTHING campy about Original Galactica. Nobody said "Holy Whatever", there was no over the top acting. It was a drama. A family show. A straight sci-fi series.
Camp isn't comedy. From Websters, "when the usage appeared, in 1909, it denoted: ostentatious, exaggerated, affected, theatrical, and effeminate behaviour, and, by the middle of the 1970s, the definition comprised: banality, artifice, mediocrity, and ostentation so extreme as to have perversely sophisticated appeal."

Now, maybe a guy quitting his job to manage an act of six-eyed lounge singers or literally dating two women at the same moment (fine family values, that!) isn't ostentatious, exaggerated, or affected, but it sure as hell isn't serious drama.

...giving the show the sense of hope that it should have had from day one, but lacked.
Okay, Since I pretty much already said this once, I'm going to straight-up rip-off an old post. Consider this an episode of "The Best of David cgc"

With the glaring lack of humor,
"33"
Tigh: If the crew doesn't hate the XO, he's not doing his job. Besides, I gotta make the Old Man look good.
Adama: I always look good.
Tigh: Look in the mirror.

"The Passage"
Adama: I hear they're eating paper. That true?
Tigh: No. Paper shortage.

of happiness,
"Resurrection Ship, Part II" Final scene

of optimism,
"Miniseries"
Adama: It won't be an easy journey. It will be long and arduous. But I promise you one thing. On the memory of those lying here before you, we shall find it. And Earth will become our new home. So say we all!

"33"
Billy: Update on the head count.
Roslin: Subtract how many?
Billy: Actually, you can add one. A baby was born this morning on the Rising Star. A boy.
Roslin: A baby?
Billy: Yep.
Roslin: Thank you.

"Flight of the Phoenix"
Tyrol: It's just a ship, ma'am.
Roslin: Oh, you're much too modest. After what we've been through, it would be very easy to give up, to lose hope. But not here. Not today. This is more than a ship, Chief. This is an act of faith. It is proof that despite all we've lost, we keep trying. And we will get through this, all of us, together. I promise.

"Sometimes a Great Notion"
Adama: Men and women of the Fleet, this is the Admiral. The discoveries of the past few days have been painful for all of us. As you know, we cannot stay on Earth. But this is not a new challenge. The Thirteen Tribes of Kobol stood exactly on the same spot that we are right now. They experienced dreadful losses. Their planet was a graveyard. They needed a home. So they set out in the void of deep space with nothing but their ships and their guts. And the Thirteen succeeded. They were not super-men. They were ordinary people, like us. What they can accomplish, we can accomplish. We will find a new home. This is a promise I intend to keep.

the show demonstrated a real lack of humanity.
I'm always amazed when people miss the fact that the entire premise of the show was the validity and power of hope through adversity. Not just people who dislike it, and claim that it was all doom and gloom, but fans, as well. I was surprised every time I saw someone say they were expecting a downer ending to the show, with everyone dying or something. It was inevitable that there'd be a light at the end of the tunnel, otherwise the series would've made no sense.

Still, posts like that make me consider taking notes the next time I watch BSG, and itemizing every single moment of levity, happiness, humor (among the characters, not situationally, which costs us a good amount of Baltar comedy, but situational humor doesn't reflect on the characters' personalities), and hope. Hope is, of course, the easiest one, as you may have noticed above.
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Old April 21 2010, 07:27 PM   #35
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

David cgc wrote: View Post
Okay, Since I pretty much already said this once, I'm going to straight-up rip-off an old post. Consider this an episode of "The Best of David cgc"



"33"
Tigh: If the crew doesn't hate the XO, he's not doing his job. Besides, I gotta make the Old Man look good.
Adama: I always look good.
Tigh: Look in the mirror.

"The Passage"
Adama: I hear they're eating paper. That true?
Tigh: No. Paper shortage.
You forgot:

Miniseries:
Adama: (looking at Dualla and Billy) They need to start having babies.
Tigh: (looking confused) Is that an order?
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Old April 22 2010, 12:59 AM   #36
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

David cgc wrote: View Post
I'm always amazed when people miss the fact that the entire premise of the show was the validity and power of hope through adversity. Not just people who dislike it, and claim that it was all doom and gloom, but fans, as well.
The reason I don't see the hope you think is in New Galactica is because,

You ready?

Here it comes:

THERE ISN'T ANY!!!!!

And the fact that some of your fellow fans don't see it either, tells you everything you need to know right there. The entire show was about the people whining about their miserable lives BEFORE the fall of the colonies. Kara is a glaring example of this.

Well, I've made my points, and nobody wants to listen, so. I'm out. Go back and watch your "arty" "deep" "Philoshpical" show with it's kewl explosions children. My friends and I will go watch real TV.
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Old April 22 2010, 01:27 AM   #37
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

RandyS wrote: View Post
And the fact that some of your fellow fans don't see it either, tells you everything you need to know right there.
Does that mean if I found someone who didn't like the show but thought it was about overcoming adversity, that would prove that you were wrong?

The entire show was about the people whining about their miserable lives BEFORE the fall of the colonies. Kara is a glaring example of this.
I'm so, so glad I didn't waste my time researching a fresh set of examples for you. I'd be more than a little irritated if I'd put some bit of time into that post for you to just ignore the whole thing and say, "I'm right because I am!"
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Old April 22 2010, 01:48 PM   #38
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

RandyS, disagreeing or not, frustrated or not, take care in your replies here.
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Old April 22 2010, 04:49 PM   #39
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

RandyS wrote: View Post
David cgc wrote: View Post
I'm always amazed when people miss the fact that the entire premise of the show was the validity and power of hope through adversity. Not just people who dislike it, and claim that it was all doom and gloom, but fans, as well.
The reason I don't see the hope you think is in New Galactica is because,

You ready?

Here it comes:

THERE ISN'T ANY!!!!!
He just pointed out moments of CLEAR hope. In fact, the stark situation makes the hope more poignant, more "real", IMO, rather than layering it on thick with a big ol' smile and group hug.

It's not there isn't hope. You just need a big neon sign pointing to it, with nothing to muddy the waters up. You refuse to see it, even though it clearly is there.

NewBSG, a show without hope? No, just old fans who want it old fashioned and don't pay attention.
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Old April 22 2010, 05:42 PM   #40
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

Of course TOS has to be the more realistic series... I don't know how I didn't realize that it's so normal for people to throw out witty one-liners while smoking stogies and chasing women, just hours after everything you've ever known has been totally destroyed, including your family...
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Old April 22 2010, 06:01 PM   #41
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

stonester1 wrote: View Post
He just pointed out moments of CLEAR hope. In fact, the stark situation makes the hope more poignant, more "real", IMO, rather than layering it on thick with a big ol' smile and group hug.

It's not there isn't hope. You just need a big neon sign pointing to it, with nothing to muddy the waters up. You refuse to see it, even though it clearly is there.

NewBSG, a show without hope? No, just old fans who want it old fashioned and don't pay attention.
stonester1, same thing for you as for RandyS. You are making this personal, and that way lies madness. Not to mention infractions... or in this case "infraktions".

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Old April 22 2010, 06:32 PM   #42
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

Neroon wrote: View Post
stonester1 wrote: View Post
He just pointed out moments of CLEAR hope. In fact, the stark situation makes the hope more poignant, more "real", IMO, rather than layering it on thick with a big ol' smile and group hug.

It's not there isn't hope. You just need a big neon sign pointing to it, with nothing to muddy the waters up. You refuse to see it, even though it clearly is there.

NewBSG, a show without hope? No, just old fans who want it old fashioned and don't pay attention.
stonester1, same thing for you as for RandyS. You are making this personal, and that way lies madness. Not to mention infractions... or in this case "infraktions".

Nicely put, Neroon. I salute you, sir.

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Old April 24 2010, 12:06 AM   #43
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

BolianAdmiral wrote: View Post
Of course TOS has to be the more realistic series... I don't know how I didn't realize that it's so normal for people to throw out witty one-liners while smoking stogies and chasing women, just hours after everything you've ever known has been totally destroyed, including your family...
Starbuck didn't have any family. He was orphan who's home and family was the Galactica. That's rather the point of him being so much less effected than everyone else.
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Old April 24 2010, 02:21 AM   #44
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

3D Master wrote: View Post
BolianAdmiral wrote: View Post
Of course TOS has to be the more realistic series... I don't know how I didn't realize that it's so normal for people to throw out witty one-liners while smoking stogies and chasing women, just hours after everything you've ever known has been totally destroyed, including your family...
Starbuck didn't have any family. He was orphan who's home and family was the Galactica. That's rather the point of him being so much less effected than everyone else.
that he knew of......
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Old April 24 2010, 02:26 AM   #45
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Re: I Think I Finally Get It (For Those Fans of Old BSG)

Marc wrote: View Post
3D Master wrote: View Post
BolianAdmiral wrote: View Post
Of course TOS has to be the more realistic series... I don't know how I didn't realize that it's so normal for people to throw out witty one-liners while smoking stogies and chasing women, just hours after everything you've ever known has been totally destroyed, including your family...
Starbuck didn't have any family. He was orphan who's home and family was the Galactica. That's rather the point of him being so much less effected than everyone else.
that he knew of......
Yeah... when it comes to his emotional responses, that's all that matters.
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