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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Battlestar Galactica & Caprica

Battlestar Galactica & Caprica This forum was created by man. It rebelled. It evolved. And it has a plan.

 
 
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Old March 27 2010, 03:23 AM   #46
BenRoethig
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

When it comes down to it, what would we rather have costumes or better special effects?
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Old March 27 2010, 08:52 PM   #47
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

Teiwaz wrote: View Post
besides when has fashion been affected by political problems.

Actually...during WWII wide lapels for men (especially zoot suits) and pleated skirts for women were out due to shortages of material (and pressure from the government on excess of any kind in fashion due to the waste). Then in the 1950's the double breasted, super wide suit lapels and ties came roaring back for a time.

Not just political, but also practical I know, but it has happened.
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Old March 27 2010, 09:22 PM   #48
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

Darkman wrote: View Post
Teiwaz wrote: View Post
besides when has fashion been affected by political problems.

Actually...during WWII wide lapels for men (especially zoot suits) and pleated skirts for women were out due to shortages of material (and pressure from the government on excess of any kind in fashion due to the waste). Then in the 1950's the double breasted, super wide suit lapels and ties came roaring back for a time.

Not just political, but also practical I know, but it has happened.
You're right, sorry. I was'nt actually thinking about rationing (as it was known in the Uk, which started at the onset of war and lasted until a little into the 1950s). So here, there was no luxeries available (unless through the black market) until well into the 1950's. This less due to political wind as it was financial RE: the cost of the war and the fall of the British Empire.

I feel it's hard to really compare NUBsg at the beginning as regards culture and sense of security to modern day earth. We've gone form outright war to coldwar to terrorist threat with only a couple of years in between for a break. Perhaps the feeling in America does mirror it as 9/11 may have felt like an attack out of the blue. Living in London during the irish troubles I was always aware of risk, and I have relatives in the north of Ireland as well so it just feels like continuation of the same-old-same-old to me.
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Old March 27 2010, 11:25 PM   #49
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

BenRoethig wrote: View Post
When it comes down to it, what would we rather have costumes or better special effects?
I doubt a couple of custom suits would take much of a bite out of the special effects budget.
You could have the entire cast nude (after all, they say nudity is the style everywhere) and I'm sure the money saved would not improve the special effects any. Of course, you'd either have to pay the cast a hell of a lot more or employ actors (from the 'other' hollywood) in which case the acting would 'literally' suck...

Last edited by Teiwaz; March 27 2010 at 11:28 PM. Reason: I've gone mad!
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Old March 28 2010, 10:30 PM   #50
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

Teiwaz wrote: View Post
BenRoethig wrote: View Post
When it comes down to it, what would we rather have costumes or better special effects?
I doubt a couple of custom suits would take much of a bite out of the special effects budget.
You could have the entire cast nude (after all, they say nudity is the style everywhere) and I'm sure the money saved would not improve the special effects any. Of course, you'd either have to pay the cast a hell of a lot more or employ actors (from the 'other' hollywood) in which case the acting would 'literally' suck...
It's not just a couple of suits though. you need multiples of any costume worn by actors because they work long hours and the costumes will get dirty, damaged etc and need repairs.

And with something like Caprica where there's multiple costumers for an actor is can add up.

So by using off the shelf clothes which they could by quite cheaply it would represent a bit of save on production costs and the studios watch ever penny.

I've read of Paramount shifting costumes between actors to save a few dollars (I think at one stage Michael Dorn was wearing Avery Brooks costume or might of been the opposite way around).
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Old March 29 2010, 07:07 AM   #51
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

(If you haven't watched all of BSG, might not want to read this post, there could be spoilers about)

Close, unless your thinking of something else I am not aware of, in Star Trek: Generations Jonathan Frakes used Avery Brooks uniform, and Levar Burton used Colm Meany's costume. As for the costumes by the civilians in BSG, a thought, maybe in places for one reason or another there were still restrictions or rationing? Someone mentioned in this topic that the results of World War II, had that effect on clothing and other things, even into the 1950's. This was a result of war that lasted...how long? My history and dates escape me at the moment, particularly as the war began and ended at different times, depending on where your talking about. Anyway, using this line of thought, remember that the war with the Cylons lasted for twelve years, all indications pointing to it lasting closer to thirteen years and for all things considered...the Colonials were loosing the war. The war cost billions of lives, and was fought against an enemy that did not need to rest, or heal their injured. They could construct new soldiers on an assembly line and very likely in hours, put enough on the battle field to replace what was lost in an earlier battle. Perhaps, it was so costly for the Colonials, that even 40 years later, things were still restricted and cautious in some places (the CNP and networking of ships non withstanding).

At the very least, that could provide some reasonable explanation, and it's not like we completely know what happened in the 40 years between the war, save for a few personal experiences. As for the war analogy, and breaks, and what not, they went from an all out war (WWII?), to a 'cold war' (it's my understanding that an armistice is a simple agreement to not shoot each other, not actually bringing a peace, I could be wrong...) that, while it albeit lasted 40 years or so, things weren't truly over (Adama and his opposition to networking is a testament to this), to a terrorist attack that cost billions of lives, that was clearly planned out over a long period of time, to the war on terror, a statement that this was a battle with an enemy that could not be defeated.

So what I am saying is, maybe among all of this, simpler cuts in clothing were the norm, the preferred norm, to allow more resources towards defense and technology? I am sure things like the Valkyrie-type and Mercury-class Battlestars and whatever other warships they had, took some time to develop and consumed resources.

All and all though, I really don't see it as a lack of creativity, if anything, I thought it was creative to use what is more or less off the rack stuff for people in BSG, I don't know why, I just do.
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Old March 29 2010, 07:47 AM   #52
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

RandyS wrote: View Post
There was nothing contemporary about Original Galactica (except maybe the hair), the entire show was pure science fiction from start to finish.
Ah, those were the days...

Actually I do rather like the explanation that there's a sort of racial/genetic memory operating here. It is interesting.
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Old March 31 2010, 02:10 PM   #53
Teiwaz
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

An Armistice was signed to end the First World War, it ended without either side being truly 'beaten' (certainly not in the way Germany (or Japan were left after the second). It was only at the Treaty of Versaille and it's aftermath (which was one of the principle causes of the second world war) where the allied nations mostly conspired to carve out preferred territories from Germany.

From the first couple of NUBSG epsodes I've so far watched.
They had a station built where the humans and robots could meet every couple of decades or so by treaty.(1st episode). So I'm assuming a Peace Treaty was signed
The Galactica was to be decommissioned (1st episode).

I'm not sure what war-footing clothing rations have to do in the basic style of dress.
I've noted earlier from the half-3/4 or a season I've seen so far that the dress of the presidential staff gets tattier as the season progresses (obv, given that they don't have much of a change of wardrobe onboard).
I'm not convinced about genes or racial memory being a significant factor in clothing style (if genes were a factor they'd be wearing denims, surely LOL) (old joke - and v poor) for all the references to the colonies (a reference that used to by used by the British to refer to either the pre and post American proto states or Australia) they could also have been wearing tri-point hats. Hats aren't shown featured in the racial memory much even though through time people have worn hats for longer than the proto suit has existed.
Racial memory seldom remembers much of what people wore (I've read interpreted descriptions of what celtic priestesses actually wore which would make your hair stand on end (and probably made theirs stand up, given the climate) it's not what hollywood would have you believe, and may not be what we think it is in another generation), but racial memory will recall their stories, the old B5 idea of heroes becoming legend then religious icon then myth. These things are passed down first verbally then composed in books and later made into blockbuster movies (and first applauded then ripped to shreds on forums like this one).
What Adama believes in episode 1 hardly seems relevant to the society as a whole, I got the impression he was well respected by the crew but the administration of the government thought he was a relic to be retired with his decommissioned ship.

Last edited by Teiwaz; March 31 2010 at 02:11 PM. Reason: hair today, gone tomorrow
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Old March 31 2010, 09:15 PM   #54
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

I guess it's safe to say this, considering you've hinted you know it, and pretty much saw the answer already. The pace between the Cylons and the Colonials were from an Armistice, which brought about the only real 'end' the war had. They sent an officer to Armistice station each year and the Cylons sent no one. This is in the miniseries, and granted it can be a stretch, but it could be a plausible answer.
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Old March 31 2010, 10:15 PM   #55
Teiwaz
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

StarshipDefiant wrote: View Post
I guess it's safe to say this, considering you've hinted you know it, and pretty much saw the answer already. The pace between the Cylons and the Colonials were from an Armistice, which brought about the only real 'end' the war had. They sent an officer to Armistice station each year and the Cylons sent no one. This is in the miniseries, and granted it can be a stretch, but it could be a plausible answer.
Oh, was that it.
Can you remember how long that went on? Did it stipulate or did it say they just met every year and not declare for how long it went on.
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Old April 9 2010, 01:28 AM   #56
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

I rather like the idea that Colonial society is a sort of mirror to our own -- to the point where the Colonials, just before the Fall, had fashions similar to our own today, and had, 40 years before the Fall in the Caprica prequel, fashions similar to those of 1950s America.
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Old April 9 2010, 11:56 PM   #57
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

Here is the relevant port of the Series Bible regarding the contemporary look of the show:
Culture and Society

Colonial society is very similar to 21st century Earth society and can be considered a parallel world for all intents and purposes. People watch TV, they follow professional sports, they use telephones, drive cars, have apartments, battle bureaucracies, wear ties, etc. etc.

This is a deliberate creative choice -- we are not trying to present a society of "weird space people." The people of Galactica and their world have been intentionally designed to evoke present-day American society as a way of drawing the viewer into the drama instead of wowing them with the trappings of a completely fantastical culture and society. Clearly, there are differences, but our creative intention is to make this series about us, rather than a fictitious them.
Source: http://leethomson.myzen.co.uk/Battlestar_Galactica/
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Old April 10 2010, 12:48 AM   #58
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

I'm reading through the character bios now. It's pretty cool seeing how much stuff there was that was in the show from the beginning and either ended up revised or was only included late in the show (like the names of Starbuck's parents, the death of Roslin's father and sisters (which was changed to be in her adult life from happening when she was a teenager) and Lee and Kara's first meeting).

Oh, and I've finally found out what those damn intervals the pilots are always talking about are. (The time between their launch and the launch prior to theirs, presumably so they don't smash into the Viper next door after they leave the tube)
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Old April 10 2010, 03:22 AM   #59
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

Teiwaz wrote: View Post
StarshipDefiant wrote: View Post
I guess it's safe to say this, considering you've hinted you know it, and pretty much saw the answer already. The pace between the Cylons and the Colonials were from an Armistice, which brought about the only real 'end' the war had. They sent an officer to Armistice station each year and the Cylons sent no one. This is in the miniseries, and granted it can be a stretch, but it could be a plausible answer.
Oh, was that it.
Can you remember how long that went on? Did it stipulate or did it say they just met every year and not declare for how long it went on.
It didn't say how long they did it, but it was for some time, deleted scenes would have shown the Armistice officer arriving to the station over the years. I'd say it was close to the forty years that the Armistice was in place. Other then that, they just said the Colonials sent an officer to the station each year, and the Cylons had sent no one.
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Old April 12 2010, 01:20 AM   #60
Temis the Vorta
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Re: Is there a lack of creativity in NuBSG Costumes and culture Lack

MetroKid wrote: View Post
Here is the relevant port of the Series Bible regarding the contemporary look of the show:
Culture and Society

Colonial society is very similar to 21st century Earth society and can be considered a parallel world for all intents and purposes. People watch TV, they follow professional sports, they use telephones, drive cars, have apartments, battle bureaucracies, wear ties, etc. etc.

This is a deliberate creative choice -- we are not trying to present a society of "weird space people." The people of Galactica and their world have been intentionally designed to evoke present-day American society as a way of drawing the viewer into the drama instead of wowing them with the trappings of a completely fantastical culture and society. Clearly, there are differences, but our creative intention is to make this series about us, rather than a fictitious them.
Source: http://leethomson.myzen.co.uk/Battlestar_Galactica/
I can understand that point of view. To try to create a new look for a society on the cheap will lead to nonsense. To create a wholly original look that doesn't lapse into Stargate Ren Faire costumes, Star Trek spandex or Jedi robe cliches would require a lot of creativity and effort, and that requires a large budget.
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