Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! - Page 10

Teelie · July 10 2009, 10:02 PM

The internet is not the wild, wild west like some people pretend it is. There are places on it like that, but just like the real world you have to follow the rules of wherever you happen to be. In Misc there is a limit to what you're allowed. Scroll down to TNZ and it's much looser. Go to some other board and you can post whatever you like, illegal, immoral, unethical, just plain wrong, no one will care. Obviously TBBS is not one of those places.

The board has rules that govern it for a reason. If you can't abide them, go elsewhere. That's why I don't post things here I would on another board and on some boards I wouldn't post stuff I could get away with in this one. There is a place for everyone but not everyone is for every place.

T'Bonz · July 10 2009, 10:05 PM

Garak wrote:

T'Bonz wrote:

Probably not 'til Sunday. I'm out-of-town and supposed to be on vacation!

Would it be sexist for me to say I have a very strong urge for Romulan Dark Ale?

Let's just say that it's fortunate for you that you're not at Shore Leave this weekend. All the trouble over this!

A Romulan kick in the nuts might ruin your weekend.

Garak · July 10 2009, 10:13 PM

T'Bonz wrote:

Garak wrote:

T'Bonz wrote:

Probably not 'til Sunday. I'm out-of-town and supposed to be on vacation!

Would it be sexist for me to say I have a very strong urge for Romulan Dark Ale?

Let's just say that it's fortunate for you that you're not at Shore Leave this weekend. All the trouble over this!

A Romulan kick in the nuts might ruin your weekend.

My most humble apologies.

Have fun at Shore Leave. Maybe next year I'll join and buy you a beer, I'm sure I owe you one. Several, actually.

Squiggy · July 10 2009, 10:14 PM

Let's look at the rape comment in context:

Rush Limborg wrote:

Had it not been for Palin, Obama WOULD have gotten his landslide. He did not...because of the crowds she drew.

Squiggyfm wrote:

I'm I going to have to dust off all my old election charts and maps and choke a bitch?

Obama won every swing state with the exeption of Missouori, which wasn't finalized for weeks because McCain only won by 3,900 votes out of 3,000,000 cast.

Obama won Indiana. The first time since Johnson's landslide of 1964 that Indiana went blue.

Obama won Virginia. Also the first time since Johnson's landslide of 1964 that Indiana went blue.

Obama won Omaha. The whitest place on Earth.

Obama won North Carolina. The home of Jesse Helms. The first time in 30 years North Carolina went Democrat.

Now, watch me as I rape your face. These are the county changes between 2004 and 2008:

Watch me as I rape your face again. This the how much each county changed. The darker the blue, the more Democratic, the darker the red the more Republican

Nationwide, the country went heavily for Obama with the only Republican gains in Tennessee, Arkansas, and the Appalachians. Well done Palin! What a electoral powerhouse you are.

Let's look at the national polling shall we?

Oh my. She seemed to have helped for a week or so...until she opened her mouth and showed the United States that Alaskans shouldn't be trusted to vote for their own governor and should be devolved to a territory.

There you go. There's my rampant sexism. Ohhhh no. Ooga booga, I'm keeping the proud female down.

trampledamage · July 10 2009, 10:40 PM

Both Squiggy and Sidious have been taken out of context. Not much you can do with Garak's posts - they were exactly what they appear to be!

I think using the quotes from the Sarah Palin thread has directed too close attention to that thread, where the issue really is that posters have been complaining to the moderators and admins about what they see as upsetting content in a lot of other threads.

If it was just the Sarah Palin thread, T'Bonz would be kicking butt and taking names, but there wouldn't be this thread.

Crusher Disciple · July 10 2009, 10:48 PM

trampledamage wrote:

Especially when we're talking about film stars (or I'm shit out of luck and about to get banned for my posts in the Karl Urban thread in Trek XI - much as I love him for his mind...)

*sigh* I'll get our purses then.

Yeah, I even started to think back about what I've posted about Chris, Karl and Zach in the ST XI forum. Even I slip up at times and have to reigh myself in.

sidious618 · July 10 2009, 10:49 PM

trampledamage wrote:

If it was just the Sarah Palin thread, T'Bonz would be kicking butt and taking names, but there wouldn't be this thread.

I think we need more examples if we want to discuss things in depth, y'know? Does not necessarily have to be a post copied and pasted but we need something more to go on.

Angry Angel · July 10 2009, 11:05 PM

Squiggyfm wrote:

Let's look at the rape comment in context:

<snip>

There you go. There's my rampant sexism. Ohhhh no. Ooga booga, I'm keeping the proud female down.

So you got caught on a crude remark, and now everyone needs to know that it was not sexism you were trying to convey you just didn't know any other way to get your point across?

Locutus already conveyed this part for you quite eloquently, you should have left it with that, cause you're really not that funny, you should have gone for a different choice of words in this forum.

sidious618 wrote:

I think we need more examples if we want to discuss things in depth, y'know? Does not necessarily have to be a post copied and pasted but we need something more to go on.

No, we don't need more examples nor do we need to over-analyze the whole thing. We get these kind of requests every year. Everybody just take the hint: less crude, more common sense, try to act your age instead of acting like your still in kindergarten.

sidious618 · July 10 2009, 11:08 PM

Angry Angel wrote:

No, we don't need more examples nor do we need to over-analyze the whole thing.

Too late! Besides this is the TrekBBS, what else would we do?

trampledamage · July 10 2009, 11:13 PM

Angry Angel wrote:

sidious618 wrote:

I think we need more examples if we want to discuss things in depth, y'know? Does not necessarily have to be a post copied and pasted but we need something more to go on.

No, we don't need more examples nor do we need to over-analyze the whole thing. We get these kind of requests every year. Everybody just take the hint: less crude, more common sense, try to act your age instead of acting like your still in kindergarten.

If everyone was acting like they were in kindergarten, our problems would be simple. Acting like young adults inexpert in how words can hurt or be wrongly perceived is more difficult to resolve.

Maybe it we got rid of all of the infractions and just had a generic one: "typing without due care and attention"

Trippy · July 11 2009, 12:09 AM

I think we, as posters (never mind that I'm green for the moment) need to remember that we are reading words. Communication over the internet on a message board. Words without inflection or body language. We are all writers of our posts, and should be held responsible for them. Remember that not everyone has seen the latest movie to have vulgar humour. Remember that you represent yourself with the written word. Remember to use a little more common sense when posting.

It all boils down to this. Post according to the situation and forum you are posting in. What flies (and is funny, shocking and wild and crazy) in TNZ does not fly in Misc. What flies in Misc. (topics of fun, questions, and some serious topics) doesn't always fly in the Lounges (for birthday threads and general chit chat).

It really is not that difficult. Use common sense. Represent your points with some basic writing skill. Post for the forum and occasion.

T'Bonz et al (us mods) just want a positive posting environment for all. That is all.

RJDiogenes · July 11 2009, 12:34 AM

Hermiod wrote:

Yet my WWRJD T-shirts remain unsold. Where's the justice ?

Dark times. Dark times.

All I'm going to say about all this hoopla is:

sidious618 · July 11 2009, 12:40 AM

That sums it up pretty well, RJ.

DonIago · July 11 2009, 12:41 AM

I have a couple of thoughts on this-

1) The comments didn't particularly bother me, or I would have notified a mod. I was a bit surprised that there wasn't any mod intervention earlier in the thread, which makes me wonder whether the mods were being notified, and if so, what was being done? Clearly whatever it was wasn't effective in this case. My view is if you don't notify the mods, you shouldn't complain about the content. Regardless of whether you notify the mods of course, fighting fire with fire is completely unhelpful.

2) If there's going to be a zero-tolerance policy on sexism, particularly one where the goal is to alleviate discomfort, than I would humbly submit that there should also be a zero-tolerance policy on homophobic remarks and remarks which imply that some people are better than others simply because of their belief structure, and I invite others who have been made similarly uncomfortable to bring up their own ideas for zero-tolerance policies. In short - slippery slope.

Spot's Meow · July 11 2009, 02:03 AM

sidious618 wrote:

Spot's Meow wrote:

What I mean is that at least if you (the general you) are being outright hostile about it, you are being honest about it. Honest that you're a sexist jerk, but still honest. All of the obsessing over women here can sometimes come off as an attitude of just seeing women as sexual objects, which gets pretty insulting after a while. But you can't call any specific person on it because they were just joking or they didn't mean any harm by it. Yet it fosters an atmosphere of seeing women in a certain light that is hurtful. So in that sense it is worse to me, because not only do you feel objectified but no one's even being honest about it and you can't really bring it up because they will just say you are being too sensitive about it.

I'm sorry to inform you of this but no matter your gender and no matter your age you see attractive people in a sexual light. It's a fact (unless you're asexual). So, no, if someone comments on Jessica Biel or George Clooney they are not being a sexist jerk. That's a ridiculous, and yes overly sensitive, way of looking at things. It's complaints like this that cause the real ones to be brushed away because wolf has been cried too many times.

Well I don't think that comments about Jessica Biel being hot are sexist, that was your example, not mine. I don't even care about the Palin thread. I am thinking of the threads that are more focused towards actual posters such as picture threads. My whole point was that it isn't specific instances that make it bad, it is a general atmosphere that just doesn't feel all that welcoming after a while.

July 10 2009, 10:02 PM	#136
Teelie Vice Admiral	Re: Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! The internet is not the wild, wild west like some people pretend it is. There are places on it like that, but just like the real world you have to follow the rules of wherever you happen to be. In Misc there is a limit to what you're allowed. Scroll down to TNZ and it's much looser. Go to some other board and you can post whatever you like, illegal, immoral, unethical, just plain wrong, no one will care. Obviously TBBS is not one of those places. The board has rules that govern it for a reason. If you can't abide them, go elsewhere. That's why I don't post things here I would on another board and on some boards I wouldn't post stuff I could get away with in this one. There is a place for everyone but not everyone is for every place.

July 10 2009, 10:40 PM	#140
trampledamage Clone Location: trampledamage is doing her homework	Re: Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! Both Squiggy and Sidious have been taken out of context. Not much you can do with Garak's posts - they were exactly what they appear to be! I think using the quotes from the Sarah Palin thread has directed too close attention to that thread, where the issue really is that posters have been complaining to the moderators and admins about what they see as upsetting content in a lot of other threads. If it was just the Sarah Palin thread, T'Bonz would be kicking butt and taking names, but there wouldn't be this thread. __________________ Space is disease and danger wrapped in darkness and silence - Dr. McCoy And he says that like it's a bad thing...

July 11 2009, 12:09 AM	#146
Trippy NaNoWriMo Victim Location: Ontar-ri-ario	Re: Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! I think we, as posters (never mind that I'm green for the moment) need to remember that we are reading words. Communication over the internet on a message board. Words without inflection or body language. We are all writers of our posts, and should be held responsible for them. Remember that not everyone has seen the latest movie to have vulgar humour. Remember that you represent yourself with the written word. Remember to use a little more common sense when posting. It all boils down to this. Post according to the situation and forum you are posting in. What flies (and is funny, shocking and wild and crazy) in TNZ does not fly in Misc. What flies in Misc. (topics of fun, questions, and some serious topics) doesn't always fly in the Lounges (for birthday threads and general chit chat). It really is not that difficult. Use common sense. Represent your points with some basic writing skill. Post for the forum and occasion. T'Bonz et al (us mods) just want a positive posting environment for all. That is all. __________________ Fanfic LJ LJ2

July 11 2009, 12:40 AM	#148
sidious618 Admiral Location: New York, US	Re: Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! That sums it up pretty well, RJ. __________________ We've met before, haven't we?

July 11 2009, 12:41 AM	#149
DonIago Rear Admiral Location: Burlington, VT, USA	Re: Misc - Several issues - Misc Posters Read! I have a couple of thoughts on this- 1) The comments didn't particularly bother me, or I would have notified a mod. I was a bit surprised that there wasn't any mod intervention earlier in the thread, which makes me wonder whether the mods were being notified, and if so, what was being done? Clearly whatever it was wasn't effective in this case. My view is if you don't notify the mods, you shouldn't complain about the content. Regardless of whether you notify the mods of course, fighting fire with fire is completely unhelpful. 2) If there's going to be a zero-tolerance policy on sexism, particularly one where the goal is to alleviate discomfort, than I would humbly submit that there should also be a zero-tolerance policy on homophobic remarks and remarks which imply that some people are better than others simply because of their belief structure, and I invite others who have been made similarly uncomfortable to bring up their own ideas for zero-tolerance policies. In short - slippery slope. __________________ --DonIago It was the best of Trek, it was the worst of Trek... "If I lean over, I leave myself open to wedgies, wet willies, or even the dreaded Rear Admiral!"

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