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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
Excellent 706 62.70%
Above Average 213 18.92%
Average 84 7.46%
Below Average 46 4.09%
Poor 77 6.84%
Voters: 1126. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 30 2009, 03:31 PM   #2461
Ovation
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Borgminister wrote: View Post

You really shouldn't go around calling people "idiot" or "troll" in this forum. It's grounds for a warning. TNZ is the place to cut loose like that.
Nooooooo, really?

I've always looked at TNZ as the place for gentile and civilized discourse.

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Old June 30 2009, 03:33 PM   #2462
SalvorHardin
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Ovation wrote: View Post
Borgminister wrote: View Post

You really shouldn't go around calling people "idiot" or "troll" in this forum. It's grounds for a warning. TNZ is the place to cut loose like that.
Nooooooo, really?

I've always looked at TNZ as the place for gentile and civilized discourse.

The irony is that the 2 or 3 Trek XI threads that exist in TNZ were largely more gentle and civil than many threads have been in this forum
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Old June 30 2009, 06:39 PM   #2463
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

archeryguy1701 wrote: View Post
Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about following precedences that it was never very consistant on in the first place. The writers did what they probably felt that the needed to to get the story along, and I can live with that. Besides, Star Trek that came before has already set the precedence that you can travel back in time and make your own changes, only to go forward in time and find everything exactly how you left it. Anyone with common sense would know that this is bull-shit.
This.
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Old June 30 2009, 07:11 PM   #2464
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Ovation wrote: View Post
3D Master wrote: View Post
Ovation wrote: View Post
Nope.
Wrong.
Yes. Yes you are.
No. No, I'm not.

Which part of "The vast majority of Trek, non-Trek fans and critics enjoyed and praised his movie" do you consider incorrect? Whichever one you chose, you'll be wrong, so don't bother.
In case you hadn't noticed, I answered someone who was claiming that the creators couldn't win because people were lynching them on the time travel method used. I pointed out that that's not the reason people were lynching JJ and his movie.

To anyone with a brain and not a troll, that means he and my answer were talking about those who find severe fault with a movie; unless he himself is already wrong in assuming everyone finds fault with the movie. In the latter case, that's not my mistake, in the first; you're either an idiot for not realizing we are talking about the subset of people who find this movie abysmal, or you're a troll for attempting to make it look like those who find this movie abysmal are disconnected with reality.

So what are you? An idiot or a troll?
You really shouldn't go around calling people "idiot" or "troll" in this forum. It's grounds for a warning. TNZ is the place to cut loose like that.
I didn't call anyone anything. I invited you to call yourself something.
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Old June 30 2009, 08:44 PM   #2465
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

3D Master wrote: View Post
Ovation wrote: View Post
3D Master wrote: View Post
In case you hadn't noticed, I answered someone who was claiming that the creators couldn't win because people were lynching them on the time travel method used. I pointed out that that's not the reason people were lynching JJ and his movie.

To anyone with a brain and not a troll, that means he and my answer were talking about those who find severe fault with a movie; unless he himself is already wrong in assuming everyone finds fault with the movie. In the latter case, that's not my mistake, in the first; you're either an idiot for not realizing we are talking about the subset of people who find this movie abysmal, or you're a troll for attempting to make it look like those who find this movie abysmal are disconnected with reality.

So what are you? An idiot or a troll?
You really shouldn't go around calling people "idiot" or "troll" in this forum. It's grounds for a warning. TNZ is the place to cut loose like that.
I didn't call anyone anything.
Oh, I think it's pretty clear that when you inferred that he must be the one or the other, it was nothing more than a sneaky flame. By then saying this:

3D Master wrote: View Post
I invited you to call yourself something.
You've essentially admitted that you were trying to goad him into a particular response (which he's declined to accommodate you by giving, by the way.) That's trolling.

So warned. Comments to PM
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Last edited by M'Sharak; June 30 2009 at 11:32 PM. Reason: be
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Old June 30 2009, 08:49 PM   #2466
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Anticitizen wrote: View Post
Regarding the time travel/alternate timeline:

Absolutely nothing in the movie suggests that its events are in an 'alternate' timeline that's co-existing alongside the 'prime' timeline. And absolutely nothing suggests that it's the same timeline that's been altered. We're not given indications either way, Uhura's wild guess notwithstanding.

Therefore, we must turn to other Trek for our interpretation of the events - previous time travel stories. Traditionally, in Trek, if you go back in time and change something, you alter the existing timeline you came from - not branch off into another timeline.

See 'Return to Yesterday', 'Yesterday's Enterprise,' 'City on the Edge of Forever', 'First Contact, whatever episode in which Data's head - from the past - is found (which means they went back in time to their OWN timeline)... etc etc etc.

Therefore I tend to lean toward the interpretation that the original timeline has been destroyed and does not exist.

It means, of course, that Spock Prime should be doing his damndest to fix the timeline, as he's been known to do in the past when time travel screws it up, but I'm sure that won't happen.
Good post and I agree. They are living in an altered form of their own past. As to why Spock isn't fixing it? Why would he ever want to deny nuSPOCK some quality time with Uhura. Even Nimoy is down with that!!!!

Rob
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Old July 2 2009, 08:46 PM   #2467
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Praetor wrote: View Post
archeryguy1701 wrote: View Post
Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about following precedences that it was never very consistant on in the first place. The writers did what they probably felt that the needed to to get the story along, and I can live with that. Besides, Star Trek that came before has already set the precedence that you can travel back in time and make your own changes, only to go forward in time and find everything exactly how you left it. Anyone with common sense would know that this is bull-shit.
This.
Yes its a very good point.
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Old July 2 2009, 08:54 PM   #2468
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
Praetor wrote: View Post
archeryguy1701 wrote: View Post
Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about following precedences that it was never very consistant on in the first place. The writers did what they probably felt that the needed to to get the story along, and I can live with that. Besides, Star Trek that came before has already set the precedence that you can travel back in time and make your own changes, only to go forward in time and find everything exactly how you left it. Anyone with common sense would know that this is bull-shit.
This.
Yes its a very good point.
A point that is easily lost on the purists who have elevated TOS to some sacred scroll in a golden ark.
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Old July 3 2009, 01:50 PM   #2469
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

as to why spock prime isnt trying to fix perhaps he has seen over the years just how dangerous that can be with what happened as the aftermath of yesterday's enteprise and the creation of sela.
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Old July 3 2009, 07:29 PM   #2470
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

indranee wrote: View Post
fucking life has plot holes.
Hehehehehehe. Very true. And real life can also have the most amazing coincidences and hanging plot threads, which would look like a work of supposedly-weak fiction if it were made into a movie or a novel.
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Old July 3 2009, 07:48 PM   #2471
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Anticitizen wrote: View Post
It means, of course, that Spock Prime should be doing his damndest to fix the timeline, as he's been known to do in the past when time travel screws it up, but I'm sure that won't happen.
If he finds a starship to slingshot around a sun, what exactly should he do to destroy Nero's ship as it comes through the black hole? Somehow convince Starfleet to meet the Narada with a stronger fleet than 47 Klingon warbirds?
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Old July 3 2009, 08:59 PM   #2472
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
indranee wrote: View Post
fucking life has plot holes.
Hehehehehehe. Very true. And real life can also have the most amazing coincidences and hanging plot threads, which would look like a work of supposedly-weak fiction if it were made into a movie or a novel.
real life makes no sense!!
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Old July 3 2009, 09:33 PM   #2473
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Anticitizen wrote: View Post
It means, of course, that Spock Prime should be doing his damndest to fix the timeline, as he's been known to do in the past when time travel screws it up, but I'm sure that won't happen.
If he finds a starship to slingshot around a sun, what exactly should he do to destroy Nero's ship as it comes through the black hole? Somehow convince Starfleet to meet the Narada with a stronger fleet than 47 Klingon warbirds?
Red matter. Or, since he can apparently beam stuff from light-years away and through shields, beam a bomb on board from afar. It doesn't really matter.
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Old July 4 2009, 04:58 AM   #2474
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Anticitizen wrote: View Post
It means, of course, that Spock Prime should be doing his damndest to fix the timeline, as he's been known to do in the past when time travel screws it up, but I'm sure that won't happen.
If he finds a starship to slingshot around a sun, what exactly should he do to destroy Nero's ship as it comes through the black hole? Somehow convince Starfleet to meet the Narada with a stronger fleet than 47 Klingon warbirds?
Interstingly enough Orci or Kurtzman, which ever one was doing to Q and A at Trekmovie has commented that the warp slingshot around a sun timetravel thing doesn't work in NuTrek.

Anticitizen wrote: View Post

Red matter. Or, since he can apparently beam stuff from light-years away and through shields, beam a bomb on board from afar. It doesn't really matter.
All of Spock Prime's red matter slamed into the Narada at the end of the movie and he can't make more until 2387 if and thats if the technology is even still created in this timeline, also you still can't beam through shields so that wouldn't work.

Last edited by Hartzilla2007; July 5 2009 at 04:46 AM.
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Old July 4 2009, 06:33 PM   #2475
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Re: The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

i think the point that the narada destroyed the 47 klingon ships is the best case about just how hard it would be to change history.
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