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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Future of Trek

Future of Trek Discussion of future Trek projects.

View Poll Results: CGI Star Trek
Yes 58 76.32%
No 18 23.68%
Voters: 76. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 10 2009, 12:08 AM   #16
jefferiestubes8
Commodore
 
Location: New York City
A Star trek CGI series

This location looks to me like it very well could be a structure on a Star Trek TV series alien planet.
http://xbox360media.gamespy.com/xbox...0044040537.jpg

It is from a videogame on the PS3 that was released this month.
How about the idea of a CGI Trek series and then a PS3/XBOX360 game released in 1080p that used the same locations (and the same CG models) similar to this idea?
As fans we could explore these locations ourselves in realtime being able to walk all around the 'sets' in full high definition quality.
When will Michael Okuda & John Ives & Alan S. Kaye [set designer on STVI:TUC, DS9, Insurrection, Nemesis] start making their CG models available as a PS3 official Star Trek volume 1 'game' that is more of a interactive encyclopedia to explore the Star Trek Universe much more than a MMORPG like Star Trek Online.
I want official Trek TV and feature film designers creating the alien world and alien ship designs that are the CG models used in a game as well as a CG canon series.

Last edited by jefferiestubes8; June 10 2009 at 12:20 AM.
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Old June 10 2009, 01:55 PM   #17
jefferiestubes8
Commodore
 
Location: New York City
motion capture for animating characters

Motion capture technology has gotten to the point now that 'passive' motion cature cameras shoot at up to 120fps.
That is action-movie explosion slow motion speed. Once that data is captured and the characters are animated a director can place the camera anywhere including moving it or doing the whole "The Matrix" speed
-ramp-to-360-look. We will start to see more technocrane style shots designed in CG animation by directors working in this medium.
James Cameron's "Avatar" releasing in December 2009 supposedly will change things in regards to motion capture technology so you can expect copycat films to surface in 2011 and 2012. Will a Trek CG series be starting production around then?
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Old June 12 2009, 03:21 PM   #18
Starbreaker
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Re: motion capture for animating characters

I would watch it. However, I would also watch new Filmation episodes...
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Old June 12 2009, 05:53 PM   #19
RobertScorpio
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Location: San Diego
Re: motion capture for animating characters

Starbreaker wrote: View Post
I would watch it. However, I would also watch new Filmation episodes...
LOL..i agree. This is a sympathic forum!!!

rob
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Old June 13 2009, 07:57 PM   #20
jefferiestubes8
Commodore
 
Location: New York City
A Star trek CGI series

check out this
3D CGI short film [Length 7:47]
http://www.3dm3.com/video/2009/06/09/oceansize/
Oceansize is a short 3D movie made by 4 students of Supinfocom Arles in 2008
The camera moves are really cool. Great lighting and sets.
The human character animation is lacking though. Some nice atmospheric effects with lighting.
It is also pretty simple sound design. mostly music and only some sound effects.


Recently viewed part of an episode from Star Wars: The Clone Wars TV show and it really looks good too with the exception of the character animation. The sets & locations, ships, props are really top notch. The lighting was great too on the characters (even thought the character's stylized animation leaves a lot to be desired)

So how much different are these two animations then? Both suffer from bad character animations. SW:The Clone Wars spent between $1-2 million per episode including the orchestral music, voice acting, sound work. Oceansize was made by 4 students. You can guess how low a budget they had...
How do you feel about a Star Trek series being CGI animated like these two?

Star Wars: The Old Republic trailer cost a lot to make and it's only 4 minutes. That level of quality would cost too much to make a TV series. Possibly a TV movie would be doable though... The sets & CG character models can be reused.

Last edited by jefferiestubes8; June 13 2009 at 08:08 PM.
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Old June 17 2009, 04:13 PM   #21
RobertScorpio
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Location: San Diego
Re: A Star trek CGI series

jefferiestubes8 wrote: View Post
check out this
3D CGI short film [Length 7:47]
http://www.3dm3.com/video/2009/06/09/oceansize/
Oceansize is a short 3D movie made by 4 students of Supinfocom Arles in 2008
The camera moves are really cool. Great lighting and sets.
The human character animation is lacking though. Some nice atmospheric effects with lighting.
It is also pretty simple sound design. mostly music and only some sound effects.


Recently viewed part of an episode from Star Wars: The Clone Wars TV show and it really looks good too with the exception of the character animation. The sets & locations, ships, props are really top notch. The lighting was great too on the characters (even thought the character's stylized animation leaves a lot to be desired)

So how much different are these two animations then? Both suffer from bad character animations. SW:The Clone Wars spent between $1-2 million per episode including the orchestral music, voice acting, sound work. Oceansize was made by 4 students. You can guess how low a budget they had...
How do you feel about a Star Trek series being CGI animated like these two?

Star Wars: The Old Republic trailer cost a lot to make and it's only 4 minutes. That level of quality would cost too much to make a TV series. Possibly a TV movie would be doable though... The sets & CG character models can be reused.
I'm all for it. But it really comes down to writing. The best CGI can't make up for bad writing.

As for the CLONE WARS? I totally agree. I can't stand the characters, but the vocal work is pretty good. The dude doing Obi Wan has his voice down good!! Sounds just like McGregor. The FX (space fighting and ships and all that) are pretty damn good. Imagine that for a TREK CGI? Yeah...go for it.

Rob
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Old June 19 2009, 01:29 PM   #22
jefferiestubes8
Commodore
 
Location: New York City
Star trek CGI series - backgrounds/ ship interiors

zach21uk's game has some great CG models that would be adequate for a CGI series ship interior backgrounds. They need a little atmospheric effects interaction with lighting but they look good.
check out the these screenshots:
Sovereign Class Interior
Defiant Engineering
Nebula Bridge

since a show could essentially use an engine and CG model like this for backgrounds and other software for the characters it is possible if rendered at high quality 1080p.

It has it's own thread here.
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Old June 19 2009, 02:07 PM   #23
O'Dib
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Re: A Star trek CGI series

I would love to see any show attempt to employ "A Scanner Darkly" methods. It allows for actual actors to look cartoonized, and interact with CG sets and characters much more seamlessly.
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Old June 19 2009, 02:39 PM   #24
jefferiestubes8
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Location: New York City
A Star trek CGI series

O'Dib wrote: View Post
I would love to see any show attempt to employ "A Scanner Darkly" methods.
Very interesting idea O'Dib.
I thought about it too last month but using live-action.

The downside is you would have to have the actors in basic costumes, pay the actors for screentime (vs. just narration), do all the rotoscoping work which is VERY time consuming as well as the cinematographer has to light it with some lighting for mood as the rotoscopers are basically emulating what they see.

It would be less work to do reference video with actors doing the narration.
The video sped up the animation processes of the facial movements. No costumes needed at all and no makeup.
Image Metrics is a animation company that uses mo-cap. and does cinematics for videogames. They used this technique for the God of War III videogame.
source: Post Magazine, May 2009 , page 26.
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Old June 19 2009, 02:43 PM   #25
jefferiestubes8
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Location: New York City
Re: A Star trek CGI series

this old thread is kind of interesting and just stumbled across it.

Real Life Looking CGI Trek
http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=38235
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Old June 19 2009, 02:55 PM   #26
O'Dib
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Re: A Star trek CGI series

jefferiestubes8 wrote: View Post
The downside is you would have to have the actors in basic costumes, pay the actors for screentime (vs. just narration), do all the rotoscoping work which is VERY time consuming as well as the cinematographer has to light it with some lighting for mood as the rotoscopers are basically emulating what they see.
Right, I did some research myself AFTER posting the idea. I thought rotoscoping was an effect you can achieve by running footage through a computer filter, no animators involved. It's probably possible, but not as good looking.
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Old June 23 2009, 02:45 PM   #27
jefferiestubes8
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Location: New York City
example of location in CGI

another great example of a location/world envisioned with CGI.

2014 Commonwealth Games village
42 second HD video for
2014 Commonwealth Games in Glasgow.
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Old June 30 2009, 07:11 PM   #28
jefferiestubes8
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Location: New York City
full size screengrabs with different lighting adjustment

I took the screengrabs from the NX-01 mod for 'Star Trek Elite Force' PC game.
from here & added some grain and darkened the lighting to show it a little more filmic. They can look pretty good.
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Old June 30 2009, 08:35 PM   #29
BrownShatner
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Re: A Star trek CGI series

Star Trek Elite Force is an older game based on the Quake 3 engine. So that doesn't even reflect what can be done with modern video game technology, much less production-quality CGI.

My problem with the CGI approach is might come-off as more of a low-budget Saturday Morning type show. It's hard to imagine it being used as a 'prime-time' production.
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Old June 30 2009, 10:10 PM   #30
jefferiestubes8
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Re: A Star trek CGI series

BrownShatner wrote: View Post
the CGI approach is might come-off as more of a low-budget Saturday Morning type show. It's hard to imagine it being used as a 'prime-time' production.
I only used what I found that was adequate for a visual example. While it was not 1080p high definition...
BrownShatner check out these two posts:
http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?...71&postcount=3
http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?...2&postcount=20

Lucasanimation spent 1-2 million on The Clone Wars series per 22 minute episode they say.I doubt Paramount/CBS is willing to spend that much but based on the examples on this thread it can look good for less.
If we can get over the facial animation being so realistic (spending the time & $) this medium is adquate for Trek storytelling broadcast in HD or Blu-ray.

and this CG model
http://images116.fotki.com/v713/file...5350_1copy.jpg
looks pretty close to a photo from the set
http://www.startrek.com/imageuploads...02/320x240.jpg

Last edited by jefferiestubes8; July 1 2009 at 03:40 PM.
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