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Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old May 16 2009, 08:58 PM   #1
Warped9
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Rating all the films....

No one seems to have started this yet so it might as well be me.

The recent film has motivated me to revisit the previous ones and I'll be doing so over the next while. It's been awhile since I've really watched them so I may have something of a fresher perspective anew. I must also say that I'll be looking at the DE (or SE) versions of the films available on DVD of which I have TMP and TWOK and I'll pick up some of the others... Uh, I won't be bothering with the NextGen era films, but I saw some of them again recently when they were run on Space.

But for now.

The Motion Picture = B
I like TMP, but of course it isn't perfect. Time has shown this to be the one that has aged best. It looks gorgeous and shows us something that still looks very futuristic. Even the costumes look better as the '70s recede ever further behind us. The DE and restored footage also shows there's much more colour than is generally remembered after years of faded prints being rerun on TV. The re-edited DE also improves the overall pacing of the film and restores character moments that were missing from the theatrical release, and they're much appreciated. In the beginning things feel off, but it does echo the feeling that our friends have been separated for some time and are somewhat out of synch with each other. But by the end of the film everything feels warm and familiar again. Although the uniforms look better now, I still think they should have gone with something a little crisper looking and with more colour even if it was muted--I just think it would have provided something of a visual connection to TOS and would have looked a bit better. Because of Robert Wise's direction this film feels like a genuine science fiction movie and I like that very much.

On the downside as improved as the DE is the story still needs a little more meat, and that's why I can't rate it higher than a B. For years I wondered what it needed until I saw a '50s era film called Run Silent Run Deep that perfectly illustrated what TMP was missing. IN RSRD we have a young up-and-coming sub commander overshadowed by an older more experienced officer for a specific mission. Consequently there is friction between the two as well as division between crew members who side with one or the other commanding officers. This kind of interplay between visual spectacles of Vger would have gone a long way to giving TMP added substance and tension.

The Wrath Of Khan = B-
It's easy to see why this film is one of the most popular. It has energy, good pacing and a decent share of character moments. It isn't a bad story about the costs of revenge. It's easy to like this film as it feels much like many of TOS' 2nd season episodes.

All films have logic flaws, but for me there are too many in TWoK to the point that they often jar me right out of the story. The other things that disturb me are conceptual ideas presented here. I really disliked the new uniform designs--they were simply too much of a departure from what cam before and look out of place. The militaristic veneer laced throughout the dialogue was layed on a bit thick. And relegating the Enterprise to a training vessel rather than boldly going on the frontier just bugged my ass also while making the characters look a bit doddering.

The Search For Spock = B-
For me this is really an extension of TWoK and as such in execution it has pretty much the same strengths and the same weaknesses.

The Voyage Home = D
I laughed along with everyone else when I first saw this film, but subsequent viewings have greatly soured me on it. There are some okay character moments in it--my favourite being between Spock and Sarek at the end--but I really disliked the schizophrenic tones of the film: serious at the beginning, comedy in the middle and serious again at the end. And the comedy seemed more laughing at our heroes rather than laughing with them. When I think of good time-travel stories I recall "Tomorrow Is Yesterday" and "The City On The Edge Of Forever." Not this even though I understand why so many people like the film.

The Final Frontier = C-
There's a good story buried in this film, it's just a shame they failed to explore it. Instead they opted for over the top laughs. Again too many logic flaws for my liking to overlook. Some decent character moments, though: McCoy and his dying father, Spock's birth, Kirk's refusal to give in to Sybok's "healing" and Kirk confronting the Shakari entity. But this film looks like it was made on-the-cheap. And I really disliked seeing the Enterprise portrayed as something of a lemon. I rather liked the soundtrack though.

The Undiscovered Country = C
Another popular film that resonates like TWoK not only in overall feel yet also in its strengths and weaknesses. I was also bothered by too many nudge-and-wink references as well as the reminders that this was a swan song. It felt like they couldn't wait to push our heroes off stage.

Generations = C-
An obvious passing of the torch, but waaay too many logic flaws for my liking. I must say Kirk's death was moving, but it bummed me out as well, just as when Spock died in TWoK and when the Enterprise was destroyed in TSFS.

First Contact = D
Other than good pacing I didn't like anything about this film. I don't hate it, I just don't like any of it. I really disliked their treatment of time-travel and I really disliked their portrayal of Zefram Cochrane. For me this was essentially TNG writ large on the big screen. Some okay TNG chracter moments, but also a lot of the things I dislike about TNG.

Insurrection = F
I hated this film. It was just stupid, stupid, stupid in any way I looked at it.

Nemesis = F
Same as above.

Star Trek = F
This film has a lot of energy and brisk pacing. But as I've elaborated elsewhere I see it as all adrenalin and zero smarts and logic flaws out the wazoo. I'm more disappointed and disheartened than angry because of what I feel is a greatly missed opportunity particularly with a reboot. That said I do see why many people like it--it's just that I can't agree.
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Old May 16 2009, 09:13 PM   #2
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Re: Rating all the films....

Forgive the double post. I wanted this to be a poll, but the poll setup is different from what I remember and I couldn't figure out how to arrange multiple options for each film.
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Old May 16 2009, 09:39 PM   #3
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Re: Rating all the films....

TMP: B-, a worthy effort but it has a lead pace
TWOK: B+, good action yarn
The Search for Spock: C+, forgettable sci fi, but well made
The Voyage Home: C+, entertaining but utterly silly and mired in 80s aesthetic
TFF: C, great premise, but the delivery was mostly average
TUC: A, excellent sci fi, excellent themes, very well made
Generationsl: B-, terrible logic, a needless killing off of Picards family, but the mood and tone of the film make up for it, also Malcolm Mac Dowell was good
FC: B+, good film, bit silly with the borg queen, didn't quite shake off the two parter syndrome but entertaining fun nonetheless.
Insurrection: N/A, haven't seen it.
Nemesis: D, well made, the pacing wasn't bad but the plot was seriously stupid.
Star Trek: A, excellent all round action flick, giving trek a much needed jolt of life, totally refreshing, brilliant performances, excellent fx and watchable.
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Old May 16 2009, 10:22 PM   #4
KingstonTrekker
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Re: Rating all the films....

Star Trek = F
This film has a lot of energy and brisk pacing. But as I've elaborated elsewhere I see it as all adrenalin and zero smarts and logic flaws out the wazoo. I'm more disappointed and disheartened than angry because of what I feel is a greatly missed opportunity particularly with a reboot. That said I do see why many people like it--it's just that I can't agree.


Sigh...yet another Trek XI hater trying to bring the movie down...
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Old May 16 2009, 10:23 PM   #5
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Re: Rating all the films....

Star Trek: A, excellent all round action flick, giving trek a much needed jolt of life, totally refreshing, brilliant performances, excellent fx and watchable.[/QUOTE]


Agreed!
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Old May 17 2009, 12:00 AM   #6
Herkimer Jitty
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Re: Rating all the films....

KingstonTrekker wrote: View Post
Sigh...yet another Trek XI hater trying to bring the movie down...
He's not trying to bring it down. It failed to meet his expectations and hopes. Cool down, man.

TMP - A

Probably the closest to hard big-brained science fiction Star Trek has ever gotten. However, it's saddled down by a sterile feeling in the acting, dialogue and elements of the visual design. The pacing is a bit slow, and it come sometimes be a bit of a drag. Still, it's one of only two Star Trek movies that feels like a big motion picture. And the smartest. And the film with the most delicious Probert-y goodness.

TWOK - A

You've got a great villian with a big sense of adventure and lots of really really intimate character moments which was a really refreshing thing to see after watching TMP. There's a lot of stuff about life and death, youth and age and winning and losing in this film. If TMP was The Human Adventure... TWOK was The Human Life.

TSFS - B

I don't understand the bad rap this film gets. Really, I don't.

TVH - C

Funny and for a time one of my favorites, but it's just not as...

good.

TFF - C--

Good premise, crap comedy and good character moments. Basically, what Warped9 said.

TUC - C

Mainly a product of its times. Still an entertaining movie, but a bit weak as a standalone without the Cold War ending and departure of the TOS crew as context.

GEN - D

Close to total failure. Decent character moments and seeing the Enterprise-D in all her glory barely manages to recover this from absolute fail.

FC - B

Corrects all the failings of Generations. However, it leaves the door open for INS and NEM and here is where the concept of the Borg as villians starts to run a bit thin.

INS - X-

An F is not enough to describe this shit. Burn it.

NEM - F-

Well, at least it's more watchable than Insurrection.

Star Trek (2009) - A-

A very crowd-pleasing action film, which I enjoyed greatly. A very fun blockbuster no doubt, but it feels more like a repaired version of Star Wars than Star Trek. Not that I'm complaining, mind you.
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Old May 17 2009, 01:02 AM   #7
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Re: Rating all the films....

1. The Undiscovered Country: Really captured the essence of what Trek is about to me, masking the drama and history of a real world issue (the end of the Cold War) in a sci-fi setting. I liked how Kirk and crew had to overcome their own biases, and how we got to see a watershed event unfold on screen. The perfect goodbye to the TOS crew. A+

2. The Wrath of Khan: So far the best Trek villain on the big screen. Spock's death is iconic as was so many other scenes. A+

3. First Contact: Loved the dim lighting, the tension and pacing of this film, it felt almost like a horror movie. Truly the last ensemble TNG film. Had some very powerful performances from Patrick Stewart and Alfre Woodard. The Borg Queen was creepy and sexy all at the same time. A+

4. Star Trek: Breathed new life into the franchise. It was a whole lot better than what I expected, and the alternate universe twist is a nice compromise that can keep old fans while making new ones, and changing whatever has come before that Abrams, etc. feel won't work today. A

5. The Search for Spock: This one grew on me over time. Kruge wasn't as good as Khan but he was pretty badass in his own right. David's death and Kirk's reaction are still heart touching. A-

6. The Voyage Home: Total change from TWOK and TSFS, but the comedic break was much needed and well handled. This film recognized and recognized the humor of TOS. A-

7. Generations: This is the only TNG film that felt like a TNG film to me. It wasn't perfect, it was rushed, but for the most part I enjoyed it. B+

8. The Final Frontier: I thought the idea was intriguing, even if the FX and storyline didn't live up to it. The character moments made this for me. B-

9. Nemesis: I liked Tom Hardy, but I thought the day-glo outfits and the vampiric look for the Remans were over the top. There were a lot of other criticisms I have, but I've made them countless times before. The action and battle scenes were okay, as was the lighting and FX. A missed opportunity for TNG to go out with a bang. Sigh. C

10. Insurrection: A forced comedy, and a too small story. This movie wasn't bad, it just wasn't necessary. C-

11. The Motion Picture: Boring film. I liked the concept, but the execution was just too tedious. I wish more had been done with Decker and Illia. D

I'm a pretty charitable grader.
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Old May 17 2009, 01:56 AM   #8
Kelso
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Re: Rating all the films....

Uggh... I'm horrible at grading movies. It's like choosing my favorite kid. I'll give it my best attempt....


The Motion Picture/ Wrath of Khan (A+) My favorites. These are easily the best films of the bunch.


The Undiscovered Country/First Contact/ Star Trek (2009): (A-) My... second favorites! Fun space adventures, all.


The Search For Spock/Voyage Home/Final Frontier/Generations: (B) Even the bad Trek movies are fun to watch... am I being to generous?


Insurrection/Nemesis: (F) Okay, most of the bad Trek movies are fun to watch.

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Old May 17 2009, 05:07 AM   #9
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Re: Rating all the films....

The Motion Picture C-
The Wrath Of Khan A+
The Search For Spock A-
The Voyage Home A
The Final Frontier D
The Undiscovered Country A-
Generations B-
First Contact A+
Insurrection C+
Nemesis B-
Star Trek A
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Old May 17 2009, 10:10 AM   #10
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Re: Rating all the films....

Motion Picture: F
Horrible pacing, plodding, drawn-out...everything. It's a lullaby, not a film.

Wrath of Khan: D-
Better than TMP, tho that's not saying much. A lame villain, boring battles, gratuitous violence to the point of just being silly, tho it did have a couple of good moments

Search for Spock: Can't Comment

Voyage Home: B+

The premise is completely ridiculous, but it's a really fun romp, and a good time from start to finish.

Final Frontier: Can't Comment

Undiscovered Country: A

A great movie to send off TOS. Tons of great character moments, an interesting plot, some cool ship-to-ship stuff, and Sulu's USS Excelsior teacup was awesome.

Generations: B
Not bad, not amazing. Flawed, but it has more good than bad I think and it's still fun to watch.

First Contact: A+
Debut of the Ent-E, the new uniforms, and one of the coolest space battles in the franchise. I think the Picard/Revenge thread was handled really well, and the atmosphere was amazing. The Borg Queen is the one "Dammit, it was almost perfect" of the movie. I didn't mind her too much, since I think her role in the movie was played well, but the Borg WERE scarier with no one voice.

Insurrection: C-

The main story just feels lame, dull, and plodding. Character interactions are mainly what save it.

Nemesis: B+
I'll concede that it was pretty flawed (pretty much everything about Shinzon and the Scimitar for example), but I think it's a VERY fun movie to watch and leaps and bounds better than TWOK. More great character moments, a great OST, and just a good one to sit and watch on a bored day, I find.
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Old May 17 2009, 10:18 AM   #11
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Re: Rating all the films....

I gotta go to bed now, so I will expand on this tomorrow, but here's a quick recap of my ratings for the films:

TMP: C+, TMP DE raises it to a B+ though.

TWOK: B+

TSFS: B

TVH: C+

TFF: C+

TUC: A

GEN: D-

FC: B

INS: C-

NEM: F
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Old May 18 2009, 01:05 PM   #12
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Re: Rating all the films....

TMP — theatrical edition: C; special longer version: C+; director's edition: B
TWOK — theatrical edition: A-; director's edition: A
TSFS — B-
TVH — A-
TFF — C-
TUC — B+
GEN — C
FC — B+
INS — C-
NEM — F
ST (2009) — B+
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Old May 18 2009, 03:13 PM   #13
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Re: Rating all the films....

TMP - B
Great movie, the heart of what Trek means to me, but hamstrung by the glacial pace, univolving characterisations, and a sterile feel.

TWOK - A-

My favourite Trek movie.

TSFS - B+

An extension of TWOK really...

TVH - B+

Ditto, but fun and funny.

TFF - C+

The only time the TOS characters ever felt right to me. And I find that I enjoy this film still where the TNG films have lost their lustre.

TUC - E

The only really bad TOS film. They twisted the characters to suit the story, the Enterprise crew were bigots all of a sudden. Meyer's martial Hornblower tendencies went over the top in this film, very Diane Carey. It's ridden with plot holes to a mind numbing extent, and the whole glasnost perestroika allegory means that this film has dated like none of the others.

GEN - D

Oh my God, They killed Kirk, You bastards! Contrived nonsense, probably the best cinematography in the Trek movie canon.

FC - C-

Zombie action flick, fun, but killed the Borg as a viable threat as established in TNG. Borg Queen my ass. Also led to Seven of Eleven and a whole slew of bad Voyager episodes (admittedly it's hard to tell them apart from good Voyager episodes)

INS - D-

Not a movie, just a TV ep shot in HD. Stupid joystick. Not much of an insurrection either. False advertising. See TSFS for an insurrection.

NEM - F

Still makes me throw up in my mouth a little. A turd of a film topped of with a Starfleet badge.

Star Trek (2009) E-

It's a dumb summer blockbuster with no intelligence whatsoever. It's crap, it's offal, it stinks, but it will draw you attention for two hours with the pretty colours and loud explosions, and it will release the right endorphins in the brain to convince you you had a good time watching it. Just don't try and think about it afterwards. Makes Independence Day look like Shakespeare. Makes Godzilla look esoteric. Would have cast Vin Diesel as Nero but he was too fucking highbrow!
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Old May 18 2009, 03:49 PM   #14
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Re: Rating all the films....

TMP: A-
TWOK: A+
TSFS: B
TVH: A-
TFF: C+
TUC: A
GEN: F
FC: A
INS: D+
NEM: B
ST09: B+
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Old May 18 2009, 04:25 PM   #15
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Re: Rating all the films....

KingstonTrekker wrote: View Post
Star Trek = F
This film has a lot of energy and brisk pacing. But as I've elaborated elsewhere I see it as all adrenalin and zero smarts and logic flaws out the wazoo. I'm more disappointed and disheartened than angry because of what I feel is a greatly missed opportunity particularly with a reboot. That said I do see why many people like it--it's just that I can't agree.


Sigh...yet another Trek XI hater trying to bring the movie down...
Okay, you quoted me without quoting me.

But this goddamned attitude really fucking pisses me off!

If you like the fucking movie then bully for you. But just because someone disagrees does not mean you should be labeling them in a denigrating way.

What is wrong with you? If you like the film then support your view with why you like it rather than trying to impugn someone else's opinion with am offensive label.
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