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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 16 2009, 04:27 PM   #31
TrekGuide.com
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

I'm just saying that if Nero went back through the black hole, and the only thing he did in the past was to beam down to Vulcan, step on a single Vulcanian butterfly, and then immediately return to the black hole and vanish forever, then it would still be a new timeline without that butterfly, just as much as the new timeline without Vulcan.

The magnitude of the change has nothing to do with the actual mechanics of time travel or divergent timelines. The magnitude of the change simply affects our emotional reaction to it.

I think most people's objection to this movie is emotional, based on the magnitude of the change, not that time travel caused ANY change to the past.
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Old May 16 2009, 04:59 PM   #32
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

TrekGuide.com wrote: View Post
I'm just saying that if Nero went back through the black hole, and the only thing he did in the past was to beam down to Vulcan, step on a single Vulcanian butterfly, and then immediately return to the black hole and vanish forever, then it would still be a new timeline without that butterfly, just as much as the new timeline without Vulcan.

The magnitude of the change has nothing to do with the actual mechanics of time travel or divergent timelines. The magnitude of the change simply affects our emotional reaction to it.

I think most people's objection to this movie is emotional, based on the magnitude of the change, not that time travel caused ANY change to the past.
Noone is disputing this is a new timeline, the whole point of this thread is to clear up what timeline this movie takes place in. The fact is, Nero didnt just step on a butterfly and go on his merry way, he destroyed a Starship, A Planet and attempted to destroy Earth along with a fleet of starships full of personell who would have had an effect on the timeline regardless is what caused the drastic changes in this film from the visual look to the rank and position of characters. It was an attempt to reconcile all the "nagging" inconsistencies many had with the film, and it pretty much does work out.
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Old May 16 2009, 05:02 PM   #33
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

HellRaiser wrote: View Post
I prefer the alternate quantum reality theory (seen here), for that permits the future exploration of the 24th and 25th centuries. Not only has this theory been incorporated to permit ST:Online, but statements from the ST11 screenwriters indicate that this was their intent -- they point to "Parallels" for inspiration for the time travel.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but I wouldn't want you guys parading your Prime Timeline disrupting theory without a counterargument logged.
With the exception of the two Ent timelines in that image (They should be one and the same), I thought that WAS what the image here stated. The First Contact timeline should probably be offset in relation to the Prime one, but because the changes werent all that big to begin with (up until Nero's incursion) it "fit" in with the original timeline very well.
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Old May 16 2009, 05:10 PM   #34
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

anothertrekfan wrote: View Post
Are you saying this is a new timeline in the prime universe because I'm afraid you're mistaken. This movie takes place in another quantum universe.

Haha sorry, I couldn't resist. Not trying to start anything. I know we all have different views on how this new timeline works. But great chart by the way!
I was going to mention that.

Heh.

But yeah, really cool stuff. Either you're awesome as hell, or I'm amused entirely too easily.

It's probably somewhere in the middle.
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Old May 16 2009, 06:25 PM   #35
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

barnaclelapse wrote: View Post

I was going to mention that.

Heh.

But yeah, really cool stuff. Either you're awesome as hell, or I'm amused entirely too easily.

It's probably somewhere in the middle.
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Old May 16 2009, 06:27 PM   #36
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

barnaclelapse wrote: View Post
anothertrekfan wrote: View Post
Are you saying this is a new timeline in the prime universe because I'm afraid you're mistaken. This movie takes place in another quantum universe.

Haha sorry, I couldn't resist. Not trying to start anything. I know we all have different views on how this new timeline works. But great chart by the way!
I was going to mention that.

Heh.

But yeah, really cool stuff. Either you're awesome as hell, or I'm amused entirely too easily.

It's probably somewhere in the middle.
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Old May 16 2009, 09:37 PM   #37
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

Squiggyfm wrote: View Post


[Click on thumbnail to embiggen.]

Ugh.
Nice work, Squggs. (I would've made each "jump" a different color, though, for clarity. Can't believe I forgot "CotEoF" in my timeline! :headsmack: (I also forgot Little Green Men.)

Yeah, there should be a small jump between DS9 and TOS (Trials and Tribblations) but near as I can tell that's all of the time jumps.

I'm guessing that the blue line between the end of the 21st century and TOS is there to suggest that TOS wasn't effected by Enterprise?
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Old May 16 2009, 10:13 PM   #38
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

very interesting and good work
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Old May 16 2009, 11:02 PM   #39
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

urbandk wrote: View Post
I love it!
Me too!
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Old May 16 2009, 11:05 PM   #40
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

My latest revision. I *think* I got all incidences of time-travel in Trek and I'll admit that the order of *when* these divergent time lines occur is suspect. But the "going theory" would be that the divergant timelines occured in the order we viewed them. (I.E. Archer's timeline was based off the time-travel that occured in First Contact. Since First Contact (for us) "happened first.)) But I admit that even-then it's not perfect as I was fuzzy on when certain epiosdes took place before when. And it now occurs to be that the timeline with an elder Jake Sisko would be yet another divergence but, granted, a divergence in the future, not the past. (The Visitor)

So, I'm going under the theory that every incidence of time-travel is just a shift into a parallel universe and that it's impossible to return to your "home" time you simply return to the futue of that parallel universe you entered/created.

(Click Thumbnail)

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Old May 16 2009, 11:29 PM   #41
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Squiggyfm wrote: View Post

Ugh.
Nice work, Squggs. (I would've made each "jump" a different color, though, for clarity. Can't believe I forgot "CotEoF" in my timeline! :headsmack: (I also forgot Little Green Men.)

Yeah, there should be a small jump between DS9 and TOS (Trials and Tribblations) but near as I can tell that's all of the time jumps.

I'm guessing that the blue line between the end of the 21st century and TOS is there to suggest that TOS wasn't effected by Enterprise?
All the "Prime Jumps" are blue because results of those jumps were seemingly reversed by the end of the episode.
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Old May 17 2009, 12:38 PM   #42
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
My latest revision. I *think* I got all incidences of time-travel in Trek and I'll admit that the order of *when* these divergent time lines occur is suspect. But the "going theory" would be that the divergant timelines occured in the order we viewed them. (I.E. Archer's timeline was based off the time-travel that occured in First Contact. Since First Contact (for us) "happened first.)) But I admit that even-then it's not perfect as I was fuzzy on when certain epiosdes took place before when. And it now occurs to be that the timeline with an elder Jake Sisko would be yet another divergence but, granted, a divergence in the future, not the past. (The Visitor)

So, I'm going under the theory that every incidence of time-travel is just a shift into a parallel universe and that it's impossible to return to your "home" time you simply return to the futue of that parallel universe you entered/created.

(Click Thumbnail)


No no no no no, the Quantum Doohicky theory states that if you jumped to the future again you could ONLY jump back to your original timeline. You could only observe the effects of the new timeline if you remained there. Hence, there are only 3 main timelines (Star Trek TOS Through Nemesis, First Contact - Enterprise and the Nero Timeline).
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Old May 17 2009, 12:49 PM   #43
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

whats stopping the timeline from going perpendicularly into the chart, so missing everthing that we ever knew about?

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Old May 17 2009, 01:38 PM   #44
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

Interesting charts
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Old May 17 2009, 02:18 PM   #45
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Re: Clearing Up the Timelines

Let's not forget the original timeline in "Twilight," where Earth was destroyed by an alien death ray, and the last human survivors settled on Ceti Alpha Five.

That had certain echoes of this new movie. Ceti Alpha Five seems like a swell spot for a new Vulcan colony (but Ambassador Spock probably crossed that off the list, knowing what will happen there 10 years from now).
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