The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

[Tom Servo]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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Kirk also goes to the Academy about eight years earlier in the original timeline and is an experience, seasoned officer by the time he's assigned command of the Enterprise, whereas in this case, we're talking the "Top Gun" school of "rising through the ranks on the merits of being smokin' hot!"

Well who could call this happening? Someone comes in loving the movie, and you are gonna come in a bitch why it is so bad.

It must be killing you to see this movie getting such good reviews.

[Captain Robert April]

It's irritating, given the plot holes big enough to drive a planet killer through.

[Samurai8472]

If only this could be a theater crowd.

[Tom Servo]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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It's irritating, given the plot holes big enough to drive a planet killer through.

You havent seen the film yet, so how do you know there are massive plot holes?

And if you are talking about the continuity changes, those are not plot holes, but part of the plot itself.

[Aeolusdallas]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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Kirk also goes to the Academy about eight years earlier in the original timeline and is an experience, seasoned officer by the time he's assigned command of the Enterprise, whereas in this case, we're talking the "Top Gun" school of "rising through the ranks on the merits of being a smokin' hot bad boy!"

If you have watched this movie then could you be more specific about which scenes you disapprove of? If you have not seen this movie then your opinion is worthless.

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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Kirk also goes to the Academy about eight years earlier in the original timeline and is an experience, seasoned officer by the time he's assigned command of the Enterprise, whereas in this case, we're talking the "Top Gun" school of "rising through the ranks on the merits of being a smokin' hot bad boy!"

No One Cares™.

[Captain Robert April]

Tom Servo wrote:

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You havent seen the film yet, so how do you know there are massive plot holes?

And if you are talking about the continuity changes, those are not plot holes, but part of the plot itself.

The entire plot hinges on a plot hole the size of Vulcan itself, namely Spock, who's no stranger to time travel, doesn't take his little squidship into another time warp or two and stop Nero before he goes on his rampage! For that matter, he could even go back and prevent the accident that destroyed Romulus in the first place, so I can say with utmost confidence that this is a typical case of dumbed-down-for-the-masses popcorn action movie that uses the flashiest effects they can get their hands on to disguise the fact that we've already seen this story a hundred times before! And probably done better.

The rest is details.

Factor in that they've turned Kirk into a reckless smartass, who any responsible military organization wouldn't trust with a potato gun, being given command of Starfleet's biggest and flashiest ship, and you're talking scripting by cliche by writers whose closest thing to military experience is apparently having played with G.I. Joe's as kids (the little 3 3/4 ones, not the old 12" classics).

Oh, and I've read lots of spoilers, both here on TrekBBS and elsewhere. I don't need to see the movie to know what happens, I've seen point-by-point breakdowns of the entire plot.

[TheBrew]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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The entire plot hinges on a plot hole the size of Vulcan itself, namely Spock, who's no stranger to time travel, doesn't take his little squidship into another time warp or two and stop Nero before he goes on his rampage! For that matter, he could even go back and prevent the accident that destroyed Romulus in the first place.

Factor in that they've turned Kirk into a reckless smartass, who any responsible military organization wouldn't trust with a potato gun, being given command of Starfleet's biggest and flashiest ship, and you're talking scripting by cliche by writers whose closest thing to military experience is apparently having played with G.I. Joe's as kids (the little 3 3/4 ones, not the old 12" classics).

Oh, and I've read lots of spoilers, both here on TrekBBS and elsewhere. I don't need to see the movie to know what happens, I've seen point-by-point breakdowns of the entire plot.

You have obviously no idea what happens. Spock didn't choose to go back in time.

[Captain Robert April]

And that prevents him from choosing to go back intentionally to fix all this....how?

It's simple. Slingshot around the sun to go back to a point before the timeline diverged and prevent the destruction of the Kelvin, presuming that's the focal point in the timeline (another argument), then go back to the point in the timeline before this whole thing started, apparently the destruction of Romulus. Prevent that, or at least mitigate the results somehow, to the point where Nero doesn't go on a time-spanning rampage, and bingo, timeline restored.

But then, JJ wouldn't have his own Star Trek universe to do with what he wants.

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Ah, look - someone who hasn't seen the movie yet voted "poor."

[Tom Servo]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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And that prevents him from choosing to go back intentionally to fix all this....how?

It's simple. Slingshot around the sun to go back to a point before the timeline diverged and prevent the destruction of the Kelvin, presuming that's the focal point in the timeline (another argument), then go back to the point in the timeline before this whole thing started, apparently the destruction of Romulus. Prevent that, or at least mitigate the results somehow, to the point where Nero doesn't go on a time-spanning rampage, and bingo, timeline restored.

But then, JJ wouldn't have his own Star Trek universe to do with what he wants.

All Spock has is the Jellyfish. How do you know he can even defeat Nero head to head? How do you know that the timeline might not get screwed up even more?

Anyway, your time travel argument is moot because that idea can be applied to ANY instance in Trek when a disaster happens. Why not just go back in time and fix it?

The fact that you are using that point to try and rip this film, but choose to ignore all the other times in Trek that the time travel plot device can be used completely destroys your argument.

[Captain Robert April]

The problem involved time travel. Logic dictates that time travel be used to resolve it.

[Captain Robert April]

Dennis wrote:

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Ah, look - someone who hasn't seen the movie yet voted "poor."

As I stated above, I haven't voted yet.

Do pay attention, 007.

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Jeff Bond's review of the movie is up now at www.trekmovie.com. One remark of his in particular captures much of what is true, and different, about this Trek movie:

Star Trek films have been hit and miss, but even as I’ve enjoyed some of them there’s an acknowledgment that I have never gotten what I’ve wanted from these movies—because what I’ve wanted is to re-experience the thrill I got out of watching the wonderful character moments in episodes like “Journey to Babel” and “Amok Time”—while seeing the Trek characters in a MOVIE with the kind of scope, action and drama I was used to seeing from the post-Star Wars era. And as heretical as it is to say this, that was never possible while watching the original cast do their Trek movies. As much as I loved those people, as good as they still were at what they did, it required a frustrating act of faith to watch old men and women trying their best to fit into the uniforms and chairs they inhabited decades earlier. The movie series had to jump through hoops to keep poor Sulu sitting at the helm as an old man while Spock—a Vulcan with a lifespan of hundreds of years—looked 20 years older than everyone around him, his father included. Gallivanting around the universe is a game for the young, and what I wanted was to see those heroes again in their prime. That’s what struck me when I was watching this movie—that I was finally seeing what I wanted a Star Trek movie to be.

[Cheebo]

Captain Robert April wrote:

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And that prevents him from choosing to go back intentionally to fix all this....how?

It's simple. Slingshot around the sun to go back to a point before the timeline diverged and prevent the destruction of the Kelvin, presuming that's the focal point in the timeline (another argument), then go back to the point in the timeline before this whole thing started, apparently the destruction of Romulus. Prevent that, or at least mitigate the results somehow, to the point where Nero doesn't go on a time-spanning rampage, and bingo, timeline restored.

But then, JJ wouldn't have his own Star Trek universe to do with what he wants.

You have no idea what you are talking about. soon as he is accidently thrown back in time nero attacks him (Nero knew where and when he'd end up and waited for him) and takes his ship and leaves him to die on Delta Vega.