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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old May 5 2009, 05:44 PM   #1081
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Jaespol wrote: View Post
neogothboy74 wrote: View Post
DGCatAniSiri wrote: View Post
I think one and a half stars is about right for Displaced. I remember enjoying it when watching it, but it doesn't exactly hold up under scrutiny.
My reaction exactly. I remember liking it. But when you actually think about it...there's no point. It's kind of funny actually.
So what if there's no point?
If you enjoy something then you enjoy something. There may have been some lapses in logic (although hardly as big as GodBen thinks) but if its enjoyable its enjoyable.
GodBen is reviewing these episodes critically as well as for entertainment. While enjoyability is often not contingent on quality, just because something is enjoyable does not automatically make it high quality. I like a lot of bad B movies, but I'd hardly argue that they were well-made.

And I'd argue that inherently any story that is told, especially if it is a 'Star Trek' story, needs to have some point - even if that point is solely to entertain. By extension, I'd argue that if the goal of 'Displaced' was to entertain, it didn't do that good of a job. I respect the opinions of those that like it, but I personally don't find it that original or enjoyable.

This is 'Star Trek' after all, and we should expect more than just 'filler.'
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Old May 5 2009, 06:57 PM   #1082
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

When the network wants 26 episodes a season, there's gonna be filler!
Filler is the mainstay of American episodic television.
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Old May 5 2009, 07:10 PM   #1083
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

When the network wants 26 episodes a season, there's gonna be filler!
Filler is the mainstay of American episodic television.
By that logic, DS9 has the most filler of all since it has the most episodes out of any Star Trek series :P
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Old May 5 2009, 07:25 PM   #1084
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

^ Actually, TNG has two episodes more than it. Three if you view the feature-length episodes as one episode, and I do.
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Old May 5 2009, 09:23 PM   #1085
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

'Displaced' is one of those episodes that requires the crew to act like total morons for the first two acts, and those are always pretty desperate. To top it off, there's one of those improbable escapes at the end because Lisa Klink wrote herself into a corner.

There have been worse episodes, but it's not got much rewatch value.
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Old May 5 2009, 10:59 PM   #1086
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Well said, Tomalak.
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Old May 6 2009, 12:24 AM   #1087
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Worst Case Scenario (**½)

I guess this is the mutiny episode we were never going to get. It's no The Oath.

The episode is pretty good for the first half as the crew plays around in the mutiny. It's not the greatest depiction of a mutiny I've ever seen, but its fun and we get a glimpse at a Voyager that never was. The scenes where the crew discusses the program were also good, it helps make the crew feel like a community.

But I've never been a fan of the second half of the show where Seska shows up and wreaks havoc. There's too many plot conveniences , such as Seska programming a holo-program that can counteract anything Janeway does to interfere, not to mention the fact that the episode falls back on the holodeck malfunction cliché.

Tuvok wrote:
Logic is an integral part of narrative structure. According to The Dictates of Poetics by T'hain of Vulcan, a character's actions must flow inexorably from his or her established traits.
It's annoying that this episode ignores its own advice. I never saw Seska as the murderous type, she just wanted control of Voyager. And she never showed any signs of wanting to kill Tuvok for being a Starfleet infiltrator before, she even had the chance to kill him in Basics and chose to maroon him on a planet instead. But this episode needs Seska to try to kill Tuvok, so she tries to kill Tuvok, going completely against her established traits. I guess Kenneth Biller follows the Tom Paris school of writing; just do "cool" stuff for no reason.

It's a pity, if this episode had stuck to its original idea and explored how Voyager's community responds to the mutiny program then it could have been a really good episode, but they flushed it all for some fun on the holodeck. This episode epitomises the fundamental flaw of this show.
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Old May 6 2009, 12:55 AM   #1088
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Agreed. Very enjoyable, until you think about it. Then it's not as enjoyable.
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Old May 6 2009, 12:57 AM   #1089
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

GodBen wrote: View Post
Worst Case Scenario (**½)
Once again, I very much agree with about everything you just said, Ben. I just rewatched this episode the other day and had the same issues with it as you.

I think it's almost ironic that the writers used the whole Maquis/Starfleet issue as the basis for an enjoyable yet pointless holodeck episode. It's as if they freely admitted that they didn't even take the whole thing seriously themselves. They must have thought, well, in three years we haven't really done anything with the premise; maybe we should at least use it somehow. It must have been about that time when one of the writers threw the idea of a Holodeck Gone Awry™ episode in the room.

Don't get me wrong, I can enjoy this episode for what it is: A fun romp in the holodeck with some nice What if ... scenarios added. Like Ben, I liked the idea of portraying the crew as a community. That's one thing in the episode that most certainly did work. Although I must say that in some scenes I found it ridiculous how lighthearted they all take this whole issue. That just goes to show that they never even tried to portray these people as realistic. If in the beginning they really had problems getting along with each other (and frankly, I think they should have had problems), they wouldn't find it so easy to enjoy a holo-simulation of that nature. I just don't believe it.

Oh, and I didn't care for the Seska plot at all. It was just a cheap attempt at inserting action where the mere drama of finding such a program would have sufficed to make this a wonderful episode. But you know, you gotta insert people firing phasers somehow.

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Old May 6 2009, 01:00 AM   #1090
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

It was rather nice to see Seska again, though. And while the reprogramming seemed worthy of her, it was a tad too convenient.

I'd have preferred a slight twist ending that revealed one of the N.D. Starfleet crew had actually reprogrammed it to make the Maquis look bad if that trick was to happen at all.
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Old May 6 2009, 02:19 AM   #1091
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

I'd agree with whoever said the first three seasons were more enjoyable than the last three seasons.

At least back then I had some hope for the show. Dumping Jennifer Lien for those melons still brings out the cynic in me with respect to the motivations of the writing staff in the later seasons.

Were they really interested in the creative aspects of storytelling? Or were they just feeding the lowest common denominator? Sure, Seven got some interesting stories here and there and Jeri Ryan proved that she had more to offer than just the awesome boobage.

But I lost faith in the writing staff. At least in the first three seasons I still believeed that the show might get better and become worthy of its predecessors. And I liked Kes... they could have kept her and dumped Neelix, Kim, and Chakotay IMO.
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Old May 6 2009, 04:11 AM   #1092
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

When I first watched "Worst Case Scenario", I was less interested in the episode itself and more excited about seeing the trailer at the end of the episode for "Scorpion". Afterall, I had known for several weeks of the Borg's big return with the final six episode trailer--"Come What May, Come This May". And you know what, it was more compelling with that haunting operatic score and all those wonderfully intriguing clips for the finale.

After the credits rolled for the next week I couldn't be bothered to think about "Worst Case Scenario" I was too anxious for next Sunday to roll around. I wanted the Borg!

"Worst Case Scenario" is enjoyable fluff but like TNG's "Transfigurations" this episode unfortunately happens to come right before an exciting Borg season finale to where it gets over looked.

I'd give it about three stars out of four.
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Old May 6 2009, 05:10 AM   #1093
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Why rate things out of four startrekwatcher?

GodBen's reviews are starting to annoy me again....this was a fun episode and another great episode in a string of great episodes at the end of season 3! It was FFFUUUUNNNNN!
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Old May 6 2009, 05:42 AM   #1094
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

Jaespol wrote: View Post
Why rate things out of four startrekwatcher?
Personally, I have never cared for assigning scores and grades to episodes. It is so subjective and everyone has their own idea of what a certain grade means. Throw in the fact that internet fans have an absolutely awful habit of giving everything "A+++++" or "excellents". I find it for more illuminating to read the aspects in detail that one likes or dislikes.
GodBen's reviews are starting to annoy me again....this was a fun episode and another great episode in a string of great episodes at the end of season 3! It was FFFUUUUNNNNN!
The last few episodes of the season were alright and certainly a step up from the majority of season three episodes but they weren't enough. Only "Before and After" and "Scorpion" were really great.
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Old May 6 2009, 06:31 AM   #1095
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Re: A Hater Revisits Voyager

I thought every single episode from "Before and After" on was very good ....except maybe "Real Life"
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