RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,151
Posts: 5,343,733
Members: 24,595
Currently online: 556
Newest member: simran gill

TrekToday headlines

New Funko Trek Figure
By: T'Bonz on Jul 21

Saldana As A Role Model
By: T'Bonz on Jul 21

San Diego Comic-Con Trek Fan Guide
By: T'Bonz on Jul 21

Cumberbatch As Turing
By: T'Bonz on Jul 21

Retro Review: In the Pale Moonlight
By: Michelle on Jul 19

Trek Beach Towel
By: T'Bonz on Jul 18

Two New Starships Collection Releases
By: T'Bonz on Jul 17

Giacchino Tour Arrives In North America
By: T'Bonz on Jul 17

IDW Publishing October Star Trek Comics
By: T'Bonz on Jul 16

Cho As Romantic Lead
By: T'Bonz on Jul 16


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Battlestar Galactica & Caprica

Battlestar Galactica & Caprica This forum was created by man. It rebelled. It evolved. And it has a plan.

 
 
Thread Tools
Old March 21 2009, 07:12 PM   #1
USS Gettysburg
Captain
 
USS Gettysburg's Avatar
 
Location: I Dunno
Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

I think the "harbinger of death" line deserves some more thought. Many have dismissed the line as something RDM abandoned in order to move the show in a different direction for the finale. However, I don't know if the ending of the show invalidated the line. For summaries sake here are the lines:
  • "You are the Harbinger of Death, Kara Thrace. You will lead them all to their end."
  • "You must not follow her. She is the Harbinger of Death."

So what do those mean? Harbinger in the archaic means to go ahead and find lodging, which obviously Kara did. But, that doesn't jive with the death part. Unless you say that the death is for the cylons who will now never be able to procreate because Kara flipped the switch to elude them forever. Both times it was a hybrid speaking. So "you must not follow her" and death could be the hybrid's warning to cylons, not humans.

Harbinger in the modern form of course means one who brings about or leads others to a monumental change... Well she certainly did that, but it didn't kill anyone. Although the FTL jump did kill Galactica, which put an end to their journey in some sense. I smiled when Adama realizes that Galactica is permanently disabled and immediately states with certaintly that they were staying put.

Could the death also be the death of the cycle, "this has all happened before, and will happen again?" We'll we don't know that either... thanks angels! Does the end of the cycle mean that humans and cylons will eventually fade out of existence and meet their end? Or does it mean that, like in the Bible, the end of the Christ story signifies the eventual end of God's intimate connection with humans through prophecy and visions? You could draw all sorts of connections with death and the end of the cycle.

I think my ultimate point is that we still cannot dismiss the hybrids' prophecy. The message still means something and that its ultimate meaning is still shrouded in quite a bit of ambiguity, but wonderful subtext, symbolism, and allegorical references.
__________________
Magna vis veritatis quae facile se per se ipsa defendat.
USS Gettysburg is offline  
Old March 21 2009, 10:16 PM   #2
Legolas
Commodore
 
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

All good points.

I think what i realized today is that Kara is Jesus. She willingly sacraficed herself to save those she loved, like what Jesus did for humanity, and her dead body wound up on cylon earth. She was then resurrected to complete her mission and when she was done she ascended like jesus did after he met with his disciples post resurrection and told them to spread "The "Word".

and I also think that "our God" is probably one of The Lords of kobol.
__________________
"He's dead Jim."

America
1776-2004
Legolas is offline  
Old March 21 2009, 10:19 PM   #3
Chess Piece Face
Commodore
 
Chess Piece Face's Avatar
 
Location: Akron, Ohio
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

She brought about the end of the cylon and kobolian human races. The new race is Hera based. She is technically the harbinger of death to both sides in this war.

Although I have no idea how the hybrid knew it, and it was presented as something other than what it turned out to be, which I chalk up to bad writing. Especially since we don't know anything more about Kara now than we did when her viper returned in season 3 or whenever that was.
Chess Piece Face is offline  
Old March 21 2009, 10:23 PM   #4
USS Gettysburg
Captain
 
USS Gettysburg's Avatar
 
Location: I Dunno
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

Chess Piece Face wrote: View Post
She brought about the end of the cylon and kobolian human races. The new race is Hera based. She is technically the harbinger of death to both sides in this war.
I like that one. Yea, I don't know why the hybrids would either besides maybe their gibberish was slightly plugged into the cosmic going ons.
__________________
Magna vis veritatis quae facile se per se ipsa defendat.
USS Gettysburg is offline  
Old March 21 2009, 10:39 PM   #5
Ryan Thomas Riddle
Rear Admiral
 
Ryan Thomas Riddle's Avatar
 
Location: The Bay Area
View Ryan Thomas Riddle's Twitter Profile
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

USS Gettysburg wrote: View Post
  • "You are the Harbinger of Death, Kara Thrace. You will lead them all to their end."
  • "You must not follow her. She is the Harbinger of Death."
She did bring death -- the death of their previous civilization, which ended when they gave up the "baggage" of the ships, the technology, and their way of Colonial/Cylon life.

When she led them to their end, Earth, it also led to the death of that previous culture and the birth of something new.
__________________
A mild-mannered reporter
Ryan Thomas Riddle is offline  
Old March 22 2009, 03:38 AM   #6
CaptainHarlock
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

middyseafort wrote: View Post
USS Gettysburg wrote: View Post
  • "You are the Harbinger of Death, Kara Thrace. You will lead them all to their end."
  • "You must not follow her. She is the Harbinger of Death."
She did bring death -- the death of their previous civilization, which ended when they gave up the "baggage" of the ships, the technology, and their way of Colonial/Cylon life.

When she led them to their end, Earth, it also led to the death of that previous culture and the birth of something new.
* I don´t know. It seems forced. Ron Moore could explain why the old hybrid say that.
CaptainHarlock is offline  
Old March 22 2009, 07:40 AM   #7
nx1701g
Admiral
 
nx1701g's Avatar
 
Location: Aboard the Executor...
Re: Harbinger?... (Spoilers)

In a lot of ways it seems like Ron Moore was going for the same interpretation.

TVGuide.com: What exactly is Kara at the end of the series? An angel?
Moore: I think Kara remains an ambiguous figure. Kara lived a mortal life, died and was resurrected to get them to their final destiny. Clearly she was a key player in the events that led to [the fleet's] finding a home. And, I don't know if there's any more to it beyond that. I think you could call her an angel, you could call her a demon, the second coming or the first coming, I guess, chronologically speaking. You can say that she had a certain messiah-like quality, in the classic resurrection story. There's a lot of different ways you can look at it, but the more we talked about it, the more we realized there was more in the ambiguity and mystery of it than there was in trying to give it more definition in the end.

TVGuide.com: So she is completely different than the hallucination/visions of Baltar and Six?
Moore: Yes, Kara was physically among us. Everybody saw her. She was tactile, she flew a viper, she was around. She was with us. And yet, there was a body that died on the original Earth, and Baltar did the DNA analysis and it was her body, so she was literally brought back from the dead by something — by some higher power or other power, and she came back to serve a function.
__________________
Not Dead Yet.
nx1701g is offline  
 

Bookmarks

Tags
harbinger, kara thrace, prophecy

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:04 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.