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Old January 10 2009, 02:44 AM   #31
Gojirob
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

We will let you enjoy the status quo in peace then, and wish you a happy seven months.
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Old January 10 2009, 04:52 AM   #32
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

darkwing_duck1 wrote: View Post
Or killing Cap for no good reason. Or busting up Spidey and Mary Jane.
I don't care much for OMD/BND, but Marvel has managed to turn the Captain America comic around or would you have preferred it back before then when they were using that book to shill for Hilary Clinton's health initiatives or just bashing Republican politicians?

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Old January 10 2009, 10:24 AM   #33
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

Ben Sisko3 wrote: View Post
Captain Craig wrote: View Post
Ben Sisko3 wrote: View Post
Spider-Man...Norman Osborn (not even his teammates know)
Iron Patriot...Harry Osborn
Timeout

Spider-Man = Norman Osborn?? The original GG is now bonded to the symbiote? What happened to Gargan, I don't read TB.

Iron Patriot = Harry Osborn??? Did you read the big buddy confession at the end of the last ASM with Molten Man. Is the greater MU even concerened with BND Spidey or what??
Who knows if he's even bonded with the symbiote? It could just be a black costume, no symbiote necessary. And nothing's happened with Gargan since he left the T-Bolts, save for an appearance on the last page of New Avengers #48.

I haven't read Amazing Spider-Man since December 2007, but I have absolutely no doubt that Norman is not above manipulating his son in order to do whatever he wants. And using Harry Osborn as a major player in the MU is the only reason to justify his soap opera-worthy resurrection.
Not to get OT, but here's a thought inspired by your post. My frustration and even anger with BND aside, I had wondered why the erasure of Pete/MJ had negated Harry's death. Now I'm thinking : What if it wasn't the Parkers deal with Mephisto that restored him, but a separate deal inked by Norman? Though what he could have that Mephisto wants is beyond me, since his soul is pretty much Mephisto-Bound, no questions asked.
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Old January 10 2009, 10:51 AM   #34
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

^ That would've been cool...I'd buy that. I've been enjoying what has been going on in the 616 universe over the last couple of years. Dark Reign is only supposed to last a couple of months...not sure what will be succeeding it. About the line up speculation...

-Spider-Man/Venom
-Ms.Marvel/Moonstone
-Wolverine/Draken
-Noh-Var
-Iron Patriot/Harry Osborn or Norman Osborn

I'm forgetting someone..I'm intrigued by the concept along with the Anti-Illuminatii...and am interested in seeing where this goes.
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Old January 10 2009, 11:01 PM   #35
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

My feeling is that somehow, OMD/BND is somehow Osborne's doing. Not sure how, but he's got to be behind it. The simple fact that Harry is still alive and now Norman is making him the Iron Cap figurehead... something is rotten in the state of Osborne. I mean really NOTHING else has changed other than no MJ/Pete wedding, which really is odd in and of itself.

I mean, I reread SSM#200 again recently, where Harry dies, and its pretty much her that talks Harry out of killing Pete by blowing up the house. Not to mention the one that kinda kept things 'real' for Peter over the years. I dunno... something is definately not right there

Norman=Mephisto!
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Old January 10 2009, 11:15 PM   #36
M'rk, son of Mogh
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

The Marvel universe has never been more interesting as a whole. Disassembled REALLY got things rocking, and it hasn't recovered since (despite all of the whiners saying "it's a lame story that will be forgotten about in 6 months"... nice to see things still moving from that!)

It's moving organically from chapter to chapter, and I'm loving that the villains are now totally in charge. Though story potential isn't always realized with the new status quos of late, it still fires the imagination!

Even looking at that picture, same heroes, but sdifferent. LOVE Moonstone's new costume! What a way to show the world she's on your side by using the much loved Captain Marvel pattern (FINALLY a Ms. Marvel does that!!). Well, it at least worked for me!!
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Old January 10 2009, 11:24 PM   #37
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

M'rk, son of Mogh wrote: View Post
The Marvel universe has never been more interesting as a whole. Disassembled REALLY got things rocking, and it hasn't recovered since (despite all of the whiners saying "it's a lame story that will be forgotten about in 6 months"... nice to see things still moving from that!)
While I agree, that the Marvel Universe is quite an interesting and entertaining place these days, I do miss the "old-days", when there wasn´t one Universe-wide crossover after another, emeshing all the books into chapters of One Big Story. I liked it better when each book had it´s own story, tone, and pace, that could be read and enjoyed without having to buy a half a dozen other titles to understand what is going on.
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Old January 10 2009, 11:54 PM   #38
M'rk, son of Mogh
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

^^^
Yeah, I agree with THAT as well. A break is needed. Set up the new status quo maybe and live in that for a few years.

(With that said, I'm a fan of the Hulk series right now, I know I'm in the minority. But that seems to totally disregard all continuity! Most people hate it, but it leaves for a fun book for me!!)
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Old January 11 2009, 12:20 AM   #39
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

I honestly long for the old days of the 90s where maybe each 'family' had their own crossovers that sort of spilled over into other titles but you didn't have to essentially buy EVERYTHING the company made to get the story. Civil War comes to mind of a story that went through SO MANY issues of SO MANY titles for quite a while. I hope that after Dark Reign and whatever sort of resolves that, we get a break. Just let each title tell its own stories again, its own arcs, its own storylines and maybe just give it a year or two to just sort of let each title stand on its own, without having another 'ZOMG! Wolverine and Iron Man and Spider-Man are guest staring!" arc every month.

Although I do rather enjoy Ms. Marvel and She Hulk, I got a couple of the TPBs and I really enjoy how they set the stories of Civil War up but didn't get too overly enmeshed in it to the point of where universe changing things happened. Change for the sake of change is really getting annoying. Just because you got a different idea doesn't mean it HAS to be done.

"Yeah we're going to make Tony Stark the new Hawkeye. I think fans will really get a kick out of it!"
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Old January 11 2009, 12:22 AM   #40
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

I will agree that I miss the old days as well as I grew up on them but I'm loving the dismantaling into chaos that is going on currently as well. IMHO it's better than most of the stuff that DC has been doing...with perhaps the exception of the Green Lantern stuff and Superman that Geoff Johns has been involved with. I like that the villians are in control and manipulating events and that the heores are out of control, distrustfull of each other and uncoordinated. It used to be that a crisis occured everyone would rally behind the Avengers and Fantastic Four but now...the Avengers were dissassembled, became new and mighty but still not the old guard. The FF hasn't been the same in years...although I must admit that I haven't been reading FF on a regular basis and pick up the trades when the library gets them in.

Norman as Mephisto...interesting. Didn't think about that at all. That would explain some of what has been going on including the bargain with Peter in One More Day. Norman though will eventually descend into madness again though...the Goblin is the real power behind the man afterall. As said in the Fox 90's animated series..."There's only one true Goblin, the Green Goblin!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!" (tosses pumpkin bombs at Peter and Hobgoblin)!
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Old January 11 2009, 12:37 AM   #41
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

I keep remembering an old issue of Spider-Man where Norman made some mention that he basically wanted to break Peter. He could kill his loved ones, he could physically hurt him, he could even make everything else in his life hell, but Peter kept bouncing back. So I wonder if this isnt some overly elaborate selfish plot to basically completely utterly break Peter once and for all and put Norman in charge of it all. Either Norman is Mephisto, or he's made one hell of a deal. But why would Mephisto really give two shits if Pete and MJ are married or not, "Oh I will feast on that pain forever!" uhm yeah so what if Pete gets together with Black Cat finally? MJ was Pete's true love, but Gwen was his first true. Black Cat was his first super true love. MJ was the friend that he gradually fell in love with and became his rock, but still...

Harry as Iron Patriot is pretty interesting and out of left field. So was Harry EVER the GG in the BND continuity? Moonstone as Ms Marvel is pretty interesting really, course what happened to Carol? She'[s still using the Ms Marvel codename right?
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Old January 11 2009, 03:22 AM   #42
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

There are indeed flaws with Brand New Day and this comes from Joe Q essentially forcing MJ and Peter apart by any means neccesssary and he finally got his wish. I just got the first volume of Brand New Day so I'll be able to at least finally start reading through the new changes that I'm vaguely aware of.
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Old January 11 2009, 06:50 AM   #43
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

I'm amazed that the JoeQ is STILL EIC of Marvel. I think he's done far more damage to the MU than Bob Haras ever did, and Haras did that goofy 'Only titles within each 'family' can interact with each other' mandate. Which seperated the Spider-Man titles, the X-Men, the Midnight Sons, Avengers etc. Seems like JoeQ is the polar opposite, he wants everything meshed in, which is really only helping the TPB market and not the single issues. At least with the TPBs you can pick up most of the story in one volume and when you want to.

I really miss the days when nearly every grocery store, drug store and discount store had a spinner rack of comic books and every week there would be new issues so it made it easy to stay on top of most storylines since you could get the current week's chapter as well as the last week's or so.

What's weird is, I bought the issue that Harry died in at a Wal-Mart or Target, and I remember thinking how shocking it was that they actually killed off Harry, not just having him go back to the Asylum or maybe actually becoming an ally, now that he's back... its just weird... for almost a decade of him being dead in the comics. He was one of the few comic book deaths that stuck. Heck even Bucky came back - although HE I don't mind being back. I'm glad that at least if we lost Steve Rogers, we regained Bucky Barnes.

Kinda wonder how new Cap will work out in the long run, I'm hoping he does really. It'll be the first time in a while that the original hero was replaced by someone new. Usually they just ret-con their age or something. Heck even Cap being from WW2 will eventually be like 'Nam or Korea or Desert Storm eventually since WW2 will be so long ago.

I'm shocked Normie didn't tap the Red Skull for his Dark Illuminati, unless he feels the Skull is too bad even for him.

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Old January 11 2009, 07:18 AM   #44
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

NickRyder wrote: View Post
I'm amazed that the JoeQ is STILL EIC of Marvel. I think he's done far more damage to the MU than Bob Haras ever did, and Haras did that goofy 'Only titles within each 'family' can interact with each other' mandate. Which seperated the Spider-Man titles, the X-Men, the Midnight Sons, Avengers etc. Seems like JoeQ is the polar opposite, he wants everything meshed in, which is really only helping the TPB market and not the single issues. At least with the TPBs you can pick up most of the story in one volume and when you want to.

I really miss the days when nearly every grocery store, drug store and discount store had a spinner rack of comic books and every week there would be new issues so it made it easy to stay on top of most storylines since you could get the current week's chapter as well as the last week's or so.

What's weird is, I bought the issue that Harry died in at a Wal-Mart or Target, and I remember thinking how shocking it was that they actually killed off Harry, not just having him go back to the Asylum or maybe actually becoming an ally, now that he's back... its just weird... for almost a decade of him being dead in the comics. He was one of the few comic book deaths that stuck. Heck even Bucky came back - although HE I don't mind being back. I'm glad that at least if we lost Steve Rogers, we regained Bucky Barnes.

Kinda wonder how new Cap will work out in the long run, I'm hoping he does really. It'll be the first time in a while that the original hero was replaced by someone new. Usually they just ret-con their age or something. Heck even Cap being from WW2 will eventually be like 'Nam or Korea or Desert Storm eventually since WW2 will be so long ago.

I'm shocked Normie didn't tap the Red Skull for his Dark Illuminati, unless he feels the Skull is too bad even for him.
Quesada has sales on his side. That said, I often feel like he's a farmer who sells off all his seed corn. So, before I'm dismissed by whippersnappers as something that creaked in, let me merely wish for a status quo that lasts for a few years and limits itself to events within a family of books or only xing over with one more for a few issues. But let's delve into the shaken-up world before shaking it up again-again-again...
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Old January 11 2009, 07:27 AM   #45
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Re: Dark Avengers - Your thoughts

I don't mind that he wants a cohesive universe where all the heroes are interacting with each other. I just wish that we had some breaks in between all of these events every summer or winter. Just a few months, nothing longish. I'm looking forward to (if it ever happens I'm not sure) the unification of the heroes...I thought that it might happen at the conclusion of Secret Invasion but maybe after the events of Dark Reign.
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