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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

View Poll Results: Grade Lost Souls
Excellent 130 72.22%
Above Average 35 19.44%
Average 12 6.67%
Below Average 1 0.56%
Poor 2 1.11%
Voters: 180. You may not vote on this poll

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Old November 30 2008, 08:52 PM   #181
Christopher
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

KRAD wrote: View Post
The draft I have on my hard drive that Dave sent me to look at (I don't actually have the book yet) has President Bacco saying that more than forty percent of Starfleet was destroyed.
That's right. Now it's just Starf.
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Old November 30 2008, 09:01 PM   #182
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Arpy wrote: View Post
Geek question for someone who hasn't read the entire trilogy: what were the Sheliak, Tzenkethi, Miradorn, Jarada, Tamarians, or Dominion doing during the Borg invasion?
In addition to the answer above, we don't know what shape the Dominion is in 5 years from "now."

And the Jarada are... jerks. I can't see them helping out. They'd attack the Borg if they approached the Hives, but they're so... what was that term in the DS9R? Zeno-disdainful or something? I'm not convinced it'd matter to them who was being attacked, as long as nothing bothered them...
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Old November 30 2008, 09:07 PM   #183
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

KRAD wrote: View Post
Pudding wrote: View Post
now that we have a slipstream drive that's been proven stable in Starfleet's hands, how will this be followed up on in future novels?
It will be followed up on in future novels. To find out how, you'll just have to read 'em.


Speaking of the fleet being rebuilt, I don't remember Destiny quantifying exactly what the Starfleet toll was, with regard to ships and crew lost, though we did get to see a number of scenes where individual ships and crews made the ultimate sacrifice. What kind of scale are we talking about (compared to, say, Wolf 359 or The Dominion War), or was this intentionally left vague for a future book to address? Or did I just miss it?
The draft I have on my hard drive that Dave sent me to look at (I don't actually have the book yet) has President Bacco saying that more than forty percent of Starfleet was destroyed.
40% Casualties?

Holy Crap...that's gonna be a helluva mess to clean up.That's a logistical nightmare,running relief efforts with 40% less ships to work with.

I wonder what bad guy(s) in the next books take advantage of this...
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Old November 30 2008, 09:39 PM   #184
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Well that was a roler coaster ride. Thanks for the good read.
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Old November 30 2008, 09:39 PM   #185
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Christopher wrote: View Post
KRAD wrote: View Post
The draft I have on my hard drive that Dave sent me to look at (I don't actually have the book yet) has President Bacco saying that more than forty percent of Starfleet was destroyed.
That's right. Now it's just Starf.
Quiet, Pinky.
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Old November 30 2008, 11:15 PM   #186
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

I haven't finished yet, so it only 60% of Federation worlds survived or 60% of all Starfleet vessels survived?
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Old November 30 2008, 11:44 PM   #187
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Ronald Held wrote: View Post
I haven't finished yet, so it only 60% of Federation worlds survived or 60% of all Starfleet vessels survived?
Starfleet suffered a loss of 40%. The most conservative estimate for the death toll is about 63 billion combined Federates, Klingons, and Romulans (Star Empire and Imperial State).

From page 420 of Lost Souls:

Bacco found it difficult to read the next portion of her address, but she had no choice. The truth had to be faced.

"It is unfortunate," she continued, "that at a time when we should be rejoicing in our victory, we must mourn losses so tragic. It's natural, at a time such as this, for us to think of ourselves. We had not yet completely recovered from the Dominion War, and now dozens of worlds--including Deneva, Coridan, Risa, Regulus, Korvat, and Ramatis--lay in ruins. Dozens more, including Qo'noS, Vulcan, Andor, and Tellar, suffered devestating attacks. And we must remember that the Borg did not discriminate between us and our unaligned neighbors. They inflicted widespread damage on Nausicaa, Yridia, and Barolia.
We know from Book I that all life on Ramatis was exterminated, as was all life on Deneva. Given Bacco's inclusion of them in the first list, I would presume that this means that all life was exterminated in Coridan, Risa, Regulus, and Korvat as well. Presumably, this means that the Coridanite, Risian, and Ramatian species are now critically endangered if not functionally extinct (in spite of their world's Federation membership). No clue whether or not surviving members of those species be repatriated into other Federation Member States or if they'll somehow retain their own Member State status if they resettle. (Will the Federation go from 155 Member States to 149?)

We know from page 416 of Book III that 77 million Klingons died on Qo'noS, so we can probably presume similar death rates for Vulcan, Andor, and Tellar -- probably roughly 60 to 80 million deaths. I would imagine the same to be true of Yridia, Nausicaa, and Barolia.

Did I miss anything? Did anyone ever compile a comprehensive list of Federation Member Worlds that were destroyed? Or of Federation species homeworlds that were destroyed (since we know that Deneva was a Member State but not any one species' homeworld)?
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Old December 1 2008, 12:16 AM   #188
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Doesn't it get difficult to justify keeping the senior staff together on ships like the enterprise in a credible manner?

You'd have massive gaps in the organisational chain of command and I can't see how Picard would be able to hang onto people like La Forge.
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Old December 1 2008, 12:24 AM   #189
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Sci wrote: View Post
Did I miss anything?
Acamar, I think. Maybe the Gatherers were better off not coming back.
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Old December 1 2008, 12:46 AM   #190
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

JoeZhang wrote: View Post
Doesn't it get difficult to justify keeping the senior staff together on ships like the enterprise in a credible manner?

You'd have massive gaps in the organisational chain of command and I can't see how Picard would be able to hang onto people like La Forge.
Well, considering that the only original TNG senior crew left over from the show and films are Picard, Worf, Beverly, and Geordi, I'm not sure how that's a pertinent critique anymore. There's Kadohata, there's Den, there's Choudhury, there's Elfiki, there's Chen.....
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Old December 1 2008, 12:49 AM   #191
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Sci wrote: View Post
JoeZhang wrote: View Post
Doesn't it get difficult to justify keeping the senior staff together on ships like the enterprise in a credible manner?

You'd have massive gaps in the organisational chain of command and I can't see how Picard would be able to hang onto people like La Forge.
Well, considering that the only original TNG senior crew left over from the show and films are Picard, Worf, Beverly, and Geordi, I'm not sure how that's a pertinent critique anymore. There's Kadohata, there's Den, there's Choudhury, there's Elfiki, there's Chen.....
Den?

Yes but I cannot see him holding on Worf or La Forge - both would end up with their own postings or ships - with 40% losses, experienced officers would be like gold.
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Old December 1 2008, 12:51 AM   #192
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

JoeZhang wrote: View Post
Sci wrote: View Post
JoeZhang wrote: View Post
Doesn't it get difficult to justify keeping the senior staff together on ships like the enterprise in a credible manner?

You'd have massive gaps in the organisational chain of command and I can't see how Picard would be able to hang onto people like La Forge.
Well, considering that the only original TNG senior crew left over from the show and films are Picard, Worf, Beverly, and Geordi, I'm not sure how that's a pertinent critique anymore. There's Kadohata, there's Den, there's Choudhury, there's Elfiki, there's Chen.....
Den?

Yes but I cannot see him holding on Worf or La Forge - both would end up with their own postings or ships - with 40% losses, experienced officers would be like gold.
Den is the new senior counselor.

Maybe, maybe not. Worf has the whole "rescued his wife rather than save a Cardassian defector" problem, and Geordi is an engineer, not a command officer.
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Old December 1 2008, 12:54 AM   #193
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Sci wrote: View Post
JoeZhang wrote: View Post
Sci wrote: View Post

Well, considering that the only original TNG senior crew left over from the show and films are Picard, Worf, Beverly, and Geordi, I'm not sure how that's a pertinent critique anymore. There's Kadohata, there's Den, there's Choudhury, there's Elfiki, there's Chen.....
Den?

Yes but I cannot see him holding on Worf or La Forge - both would end up with their own postings or ships - with 40% losses, experienced officers would be like gold.
Den is the new senior counselor.

Maybe, maybe not. Worf has the whole "rescued his wife rather than save a Cardassian defector" problem, and Geordi is an engineer, not a command officer.
I doubt it would matter - half the fleet is gone - in such a crisis situation I would guess it would be

Admiral: Congratulations Captain La Forge, you are now in charge of the SCE ship USS bag of spanners

La Forge: But I'm not a command officer!

Admiral: You are now, good luck.

(and Geordi's original training was command right? he was a red shirt?)
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Old December 1 2008, 01:00 AM   #194
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

I'm sure they can come up with some kind of in-universe reason, but we all know that they can't really afford to lose anymore of the originals that are left.

Worf has the black mark on his record, Laforge has stated that he is happy where he is... But you don't always get to choose your postings. I'd like to see this addressed in the future somehow. I imagine that for awhile there won't be enough ships around to even need new Captains. After they start to seriously rebuild Starfleet though it becomes a harder question to answer.
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Old December 1 2008, 01:04 AM   #195
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

destro wrote: View Post
I'm sure they can come up with some kind of in-universe reason, but we all know that they can't really afford to lose anymore of the originals that are left.

Worf has the black mark on his record, Laforge has stated that he is happy where he is... But you don't always get to choose your postings. I'd like to see this addressed in the future somehow. I imagine that for awhile there won't be enough ships around to even need new Captains. After they start to seriously rebuild Starfleet though it becomes a harder question to answer.
Oh I agree, I don't expect to see any of this happen just spit balling - but even without the ships - I would think that there are plenty of gaps in planet side postings.
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