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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

View Poll Results: Grade Lost Souls
Excellent 130 72.22%
Above Average 35 19.44%
Average 12 6.67%
Below Average 1 0.56%
Poor 2 1.11%
Voters: 180. You may not vote on this poll

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Old November 26 2008, 10:47 PM   #136
ParticleMan
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Stephen! wrote: View Post
Amazon: The soldiers of Armageddon are on the march, laying waste to worlds in their passage. An audacious plan could stop them forever, but it carries risks that one starship captain is unwilling to take.
What exactly was the audacious plan then?
I think the audacious plan was the one they ended up taking and that Picard was the one who was unwilling to take the risk. Remember that he didn't like the idea of interfacing Hernandez with the Collective initially and although he voiced his displeasure, but couldn't actually stop Dax from going ahead since they are both captains. He also didn't really like bringing the Caeliar in at the end for fear the Borg would assimilate them and then it would REALLY all be over with...
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Old November 27 2008, 05:30 AM   #137
KRAD
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

ronny wrote: View Post
The Borg have been vanquished. I'm not going to be satisfied if none of the follow up books have some sort of VJ Day type of celebration somewhere.
Erm -- sixty-three billion people died. I don't care who you vanquish, that is no cause for celebration of any kind.
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Old November 27 2008, 09:42 AM   #138
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Dave your Trilogy is brilliant! This should be a movie series. I looked forward to this series more that I do the new movie because it is quintessentially everything that Star Trek is meant to be. Even in the darkest hour hope springs. Great story, great character work with Dax and Hernandez (Erika was someone that I really liked in ENT and it was great to see her get a chance to save the universe like the greatest of Starfleet captains). It is nice to have Picard back to the hopeful and even deeper man we all loved. Cannot wait to see what happens with Baco, VOY, Titan and DS9. So good!
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Old November 27 2008, 01:05 PM   #139
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

LaBarre wrote: View Post
In that same line, do you feel that the characterization of Picard when he ordered the Thalaron weapon to be built was in line with what we know about him? Or the parts where he was in such serious doubt about his future? I wanted to hear what you were thinking Picard was feeling when you wrote those parts so I could better understand where he was coming from.

Thanks.
David, I also wondered about this. All the reviews I've read have been positive, but almost everyone wonders about Picard being "off" in this third instalment as well as the previous two.

I'd love to know your thinking process insofar as Picard is concerned.
Christopher wrote: View Post
^^I think the whole point was that Picard was "off," that the magnitude of the Borg invasion coupled with his own traumas and his link to them had thrown him completely off his game. He'd fought them off over and over but they kept coming back, and this final, all-out invasion, coming mere weeks after he decided to start a family, had broken his spirit. So he wasn't quite himself for the duration of the trilogy, or rather, the more vulnerable aspects of his character were overwhelming the parts we're used to seeing.
Being a newbie, I mangled the sourcing of the author of the original quote. It was Gauis Polt (p.5 of postings. Apologies to you).

I'm grateful for Christopher's response, particularly as I thought that he dealt wonderfully with the Picard and Crusher relationship and how that was playing out; thereby giving us some insight into how and why Picard was behaving as he was in these books. I recently reread the poker night scene in GTTS and its aftermath and thought that this was very delicately written.

It has taken a very long, long, time for TPTB to come to terms with the fact that the fanship also includes women.

Never the less - and granted that Thanksgiving is on the morn - I really would like to have David's response to the questions above.

Happy Thanksgiving to all our American friends.
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Old November 27 2008, 08:37 PM   #140
Steve Roby
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

This is a bit long, being the review posted over at my blog, so I'll hide it behind a spoiler warning. Because there are indeed spoilers. FWIW, I liked it. A lot.

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Old November 27 2008, 09:30 PM   #141
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Really nothing to say here, other than that it was, as expected, entirely excellent. A few small things nagged at me (I was hoping to see more of the primordial-borg after the initial assimilations) but I can't argue at all with the overall structure of the story. It worked on every level, from the minor personal notes, to the overall galactic repercussions of the entire thing. Favorite moments include the creepy, zombie vibe of the icebreaker crew running into the first of the Borg, and, of course "My name is Annika." Brilliant.

Oh, and Terminat hora diem terminat auctor opus? Way to go, Dave. It takes a real writer to throw out a personal message both from and for the author, a little latin, and a tip of the hat to Rush all at once. Bravo, good sir.
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Old November 27 2008, 10:53 PM   #142
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Steve, your review reminded me of something that's been nagging at me for a week now.

You wrote, "the former Seven of Nine may come out of the experience as a very different person," which is what's been nagging me.





Either way, this could make for some interesting storytelling avenues.
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Old November 27 2008, 11:14 PM   #143
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

So I take it that the old rumor that..
... didn't actually occur?
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Old November 28 2008, 01:15 AM   #144
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Babaganoosh wrote: View Post
So I take it that the old rumor that..
... didn't actually occur?
I believe that very question was answered when I enquired about a prediction I made a few months back about Mr Mack going after the


But to answer, then no, it is still there, but as I haven't gotten a copy yet I'm not sure in what state she is in.
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Old November 28 2008, 01:18 AM   #145
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

Babaganoosh wrote: View Post
So I take it that the old rumor that..
... didn't actually occur?
I don't think that ever reached the level of full-fledged rumor, just wild speculation on somebody's part.
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Old November 28 2008, 03:14 PM   #146
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

KRAD wrote: View Post
ronny wrote: View Post
The Borg have been vanquished. I'm not going to be satisfied if none of the follow up books have some sort of VJ Day type of celebration somewhere.
Erm -- sixty-three billion people died. I don't care who you vanquish, that is no cause for celebration of any kind.
If nothing else, David has outdone himself with the number of people killed in a Star Trek novel. It makes the events of Tezwa look mild by comparison.
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Old November 28 2008, 04:49 PM   #147
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

destro wrote: View Post

My only real problem was Picard's treatment in the book. There was a logical explanation yes, but I felt like he may as well not have been there. He didn't really accomplish anything or help much. Even worse he spends a lot of his time bitching about his ready room and crying on the holodeck. Even considering his emotional state at the time, acting like this while the Federation was about to be destroyed came off as really weak. I feel really let down by Picard's actions in this book. I also feel like his actions are going to be brushed under the rug since by the end we are back to 'happy Picard'. I hope someone addresses this in a future novel.
Despite my small criticisms I really liked the whole Trilogy and I'm excited about where things are going from here. Great work David!
I really enjoyed Book 3 over all but I wanted to say that I agree with the above. If there was one blemish, it is the handling of Picard. This whole concept of how Picard is obsessed and wears blinders with regard to the Borg comes from First Contact and was a flawed characterization from the start (I am a lone voice in the wilderness, but I found FC weak for this and other reasons). Picard had a chance to destroy the Borg years earlier in "I, Borg" and true to his nature, decided against it. To throw that away cuts to the core of who the character is. It wasn't David Mack's choice I suppose, since, as I wrote, it was established in the movie, but it still is disappointing to me. Otherwise a great job!
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Old November 28 2008, 07:22 PM   #148
Julio Angel Ortiz
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

See, I don't understand the frustration about Picard's state of mind here. Considering all he's been through, and the fact that he now has a wife and a baby on the way, I don't see how he couldn't have cracked a little. Maybe people want to see him in Kirk-God mode, single-handedly destroying the Borg with his hands and charisma. Humans are flawed, and are going to go through low periods that challenge who they are and they (hopefully) come out the better for it. To expect otherwise undermines the point of drama and is, frankly, unrealistic.
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Old November 28 2008, 07:24 PM   #149
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

My goodness....well, I'll just say this: I picked up the book on Wednesday and finished it in the same night. My final Destiny review is forthcoming, but I just have to say this: this book was downright amazing! My thoughts were this at the end: there's no more?! Dave, you did a great job with it. And yes, I love the religious overtones in the book. And, you even had me dig to find stuff when compiling my review. (Like my first question, 'what the freak does 'Logos' mean?') When I found out, lightbulbs went off in my head, and I was just extremely excited for what you were accomplishing in the story.

Personally, I liked what was done to Picard, and I think it was essential that he play the role he played in the book. You had Dax, who was gung-ho, Picard, who was very cautious and pensive, and Riker, who balanced the two out. Everything's about balance, and the book did a great job of it.

There were a lot of gems in this story... too many to mention twice, so I'll save it for my review. Bacco's always a star, and I loved reading about her again in this story. I also liked the ultimate fate of the Borg Collective, and did not clue in whatsoever as to what powered the Caeliar cities until you mentioned "Particle 010"... in that context, the Borg's desire to assimilate Omega at all costs made sense.

All in all, very sweet read! As I said, review forthcoming.
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Old November 28 2008, 07:29 PM   #150
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Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Lost Souls - Discuss/Grade

JeremyW wrote: View Post
My thoughts were this at the end: there's no more?!
Sure there is: A Singular Destiny, Over a Torrent Sea, Full Circle, Losing the Peace.......
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