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View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
Excellent 31 22.30%
Above Average 58 41.73%
Average 32 23.02%
Below Average 12 8.63%
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Old November 19 2008, 02:05 AM   #181
trevanian
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Broccoli wrote: View Post
wait...

Indysolo wrote: View Post
Casino Royale didn't open as well as Die Another Day because DAD isn't a good film and people really didn't respond to it.
But...CR had a better opening than DAD. It seems that, within "recent times", each Bond movie has trumped the previous one in terms of opening gross.
No, CR opened a little bit under DAD, which was odd, since inflation pretty much guarantees that the numbers go up each time (unless you get an oddity, like the MGM morons releasing LTK against a flotilla of heavyweights without the slightest domestic PR campaign.)
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Old November 19 2008, 02:41 AM   #182
Broccoli
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

trevanian wrote: View Post
Broccoli wrote: View Post
wait...

Indysolo wrote: View Post
Casino Royale didn't open as well as Die Another Day because DAD isn't a good film and people really didn't respond to it.
But...CR had a better opening than DAD. It seems that, within "recent times", each Bond movie has trumped the previous one in terms of opening gross.
No, CR opened a little bit under DAD, which was odd, since inflation pretty much guarantees that the numbers go up each time (unless you get an oddity, like the MGM morons releasing LTK against a flotilla of heavyweights without the slightest domestic PR campaign.)
Huh...well, I'll be damned. I could have sworn I read that was the biggest Bond opening. Maybe the thing I read was about totals. Oh well...
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Old November 19 2008, 03:32 AM   #183
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

trevanian wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Here's an idea:

Read the fucking book.
Here's a BETTER idea: you read the fuckin' books, and see that Mathis never dies in any of them.
I know that, but that has nothing to do with it. And what makes you think it was talking to you anyway?

Oh, and please learn to use the Multi Quote feature.
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Old November 19 2008, 04:16 AM   #184
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Broccoli wrote: View Post
trevanian wrote: View Post
Broccoli wrote: View Post
wait...



But...CR had a better opening than DAD. It seems that, within "recent times", each Bond movie has trumped the previous one in terms of opening gross.
No, CR opened a little bit under DAD, which was odd, since inflation pretty much guarantees that the numbers go up each time (unless you get an oddity, like the MGM morons releasing LTK against a flotilla of heavyweights without the slightest domestic PR campaign.)
Huh...well, I'll be damned. I could have sworn I read that was the biggest Bond opening. Maybe the thing I read was about totals. Oh well...
Ultimately CR did outgross DAD, but it's opening weekend was not as big. CR opened second that weekend behind Happy Feet.

Final numbers came out for QoS in the US and Sony over estimated by $3 million. Sunday's gross was down from what they had predicted. Could word of mouth spread that fast?

Neil
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Old November 19 2008, 05:22 AM   #185
trevanian
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
trevanian wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Here's an idea:

Read the fucking book.
Here's a BETTER idea: you read the fuckin' books, and see that Mathis never dies in any of them.
I know that, but that has nothing to do with it. And what makes you think it was talking to you anyway?

Oh, and please learn to use the Multi Quote feature.
If I'm reading the thread backwards, then I don't know there's anything else to respond to.

What kind of answer is that? You acknowledge that you're wrong, but that that is irrelevant? No, it just shows that making dumbass snipes ought to get you your ears thwacked, but hard. So try putting content in your posts instead of just 'tude you can't back up.
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Old November 19 2008, 06:26 AM   #186
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

trevanian wrote: View Post
so McClory had EVERY right to SPECTRE and Blofeld.
But I just don't see how. All third party accounts and evidence over the years have suggested Witthingham and McClory's actual contribution was limited and that all the parts in question (SPECTRE and Blofeld, for instance) were part of Fleming's original short story. If it had been dragged out in court, there's little doubt Fleming would have one. He was simply too ill to bother and acquiesced.

Really, it was nothing more than piss-ant of a man trying to take advantage of an unfortunate situation and make a career for himself.. In fact, I'll even put it to the court that had Fleming been younger and of better health, McClory would've just stayed home--or gone back to holding the microphones.

In any case, the issue is really over the Thunderball property itself which, by default, includes SPECTRE. However, one could easily argue Blofeld is not conclusive.

He isn't actually called "Blofeld, nor had he been on film to that date.

All there was was a couple of hands and a cat. Hell, people can't even agree on who provided the voice. So, if EON were to go ahead and make him the King of Quantum, I don't think there'd be anything anyone could say about it. And, it's not as if McClory is going to come back from the afterlife.


If I'm reading the thread backwards, then I don't know there's anything else to respond to.

What kind of answer is that? You acknowledge that you're wrong, but that that is irrelevant? No, it just shows that making dumbass snipes ought to get you your ears thwacked, but hard. So try putting content in your posts instead of just 'tude you can't back up.
I'm totally not with you. For starters, I never said I was wrong. But Never mind that.

There was about two pages of threads of bickering over Mathis's fate in CR. I found it rather annoying and pointless, and I suggested, not so politely, that, instead of continuing the dispute, all involved parties should read the novel and come to a definitive conclusion on their own. You were not one of said parties.

Also, whether or not Mathis lived or died in any subsequent novel had absolutely nothing to do with it.
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Old November 19 2008, 06:41 AM   #187
Broccoli
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
There was about two pages of threads of bickering over Mathis's fate in CR. I found it rather annoying and pointless, and I suggested, not so politely, that, instead of continuing the dispute, all involved parties should read the novel and come to a definitive conclusion on their own. You were not one of said parties.
Well, I did read the novel. Mathis is an ally of Bond in the book and future books that he appeared in (including Never Dream of Dying and Devil May Care).

But since the film (and, really, any film adaptation of a novel) changes some things, the idea the Mathis is an ally is tossed out in favor of seemingly turning him into a villain (a decision that didn't sit well with me when I first saw CR).

In any event, the discussion was about Mathis, the film character. Not Mathis, the novel character. There is a difference and where the question of his loyalties lie arises.
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Old November 19 2008, 07:27 AM   #188
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Mathis is innocent.He always has been.

Here's why;
QoS adresses a question I had about Casino Royale ,who paints Mathis as Le Chiffre's leak.

If Mathis' intention was to kill Bond,why wait until he's concious and coherent to poison him with a drink?
Granted Bond is in a wheelchair,but a former SAS soldier is still plenty deadly with his hands.


Since the movie establishes Vesper and Mathis being present while Bond was passed out,that would have been a MUCH better time for Mathis to poison him via IV in his hospital bed while he's drugged to unconciousness instead of waiting X amount of days for Bond to be released to a wheelchair,then mixing the poison in his presence and asking him to drink it.


Second,Vesper says 'Mathis needs me' before she stages her kidnapping by Le Chiffre.Who coincidentally utters the line about Mathis being 'his' special friend.
This he said so that Bond wouldn't put two and two and suspect Vesper,who Le Chiffre still needed to matter to Bond so as to coerce the password out of Bond via Le Chiffre 'torturing' Vesper.

When of course Vesper was in on the whole hustle.


This also adresses why Vesper walks off the ship alive when the rest of Le Chiffre's entourage ate lead courtesy of Mr White.
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Old November 19 2008, 11:05 AM   #189
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Above average

I can't believe that I'm saying this but there was way TOO much action and not enough plot. I liked the movie but it was not as good as CR. However Daniel Craig and Judi Dench were as great as always. The best parts of the movie were the all scenes that referenced CR.
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Old November 19 2008, 11:19 AM   #190
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

JKTim wrote: View Post
Lonemagpie wrote: View Post
I dunno about that - I suspect he's our new Blofeld. Remember he was the only one smart enough not to give himself away in the opera house...
In early cuts of the movie, at the very end, Bond killed White and then introduced himself to Guy Haines (the advisor to the Prime Minister mentioned earlier in the movie) at his estate. That was then followed by the gunbarrel sequence and credits.
I've heard that, and they were wise to cut it.
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Old November 19 2008, 11:21 AM   #191
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

trevanian wrote: View Post
Wouldn't happen, guy, Clive Owen would wipe the floor with Craig, who is so short he probably couldn't even reach the other guy with a roundhouse.
Craig is 5' 11'

Clive is only 3 and a half inches taller - not that much of a difference
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Old November 19 2008, 02:09 PM   #192
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Excellent - I really, really enjoyed this. A fast-paced, uncompromising sequel to CR with enough quieter and well-placed moments to give the characters the space they need.

I think the Bond, M dynamic is excellent and one of the major reasons this works. I also thought Bond and Camille worked very well together. Camille is an interesting character, I think. I'm curious to see what they'll do with her in the future (I'm assuming she will be back in some form).
I also really like what I've seen of 'Quantum' so far. For the bad guys, they're frighteningly down-to-earth in their approach, which is exactly why you could imagine they might succeed whit what they're doing.
My favorite scene was probably the opera house in Bregenz when Bond calls out and photographs all the bad guys and especially that moment when Bond stands opposite Greene and everything is mute for a few seconds and then the sound of the Opera takes over. I thought that was really, really well staged and shot.
One of the few complaints I have was the building blowing up at the end. It was just that bit too much, I thought. However, I am glad that it actually leads to something on a character level with Camille re-living her childhood experience.

So, having been uncertain as to how this would turn out after reading some reviews I'm happy to say I really, really enjoyed this and am looking forward to re-watching sometime in the future.
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Old November 19 2008, 02:20 PM   #193
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Lonemagpie wrote: View Post
trevanian wrote: View Post
Wouldn't happen, guy, Clive Owen would wipe the floor with Craig, who is so short he probably couldn't even reach the other guy with a roundhouse.
Craig is 5' 11'

Clive is only 3 and a half inches taller - not that much of a difference
Craig's under 5'10", and that is confirmed by my interview with QOS dp Roberto Schaefer, who had to deal with the lack of height dif of Craig and Olga (probably why Craig had to wear lifts in the desert scenes.)

Owen and Craig both look like they have something of the brawler in them ... dif is Craig looks like the guy you have to pick up off the floor (again, referencing Roberto Schaefer, he looks like a bashed-in Russian boxer) while Owen is the guy who put him there.
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Old November 19 2008, 02:41 PM   #194
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Where is Q?

Where is the Martini, shaken not stirred?

Where is Bond, James Bond?
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Old November 19 2008, 04:44 PM   #195
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Re: Quantum of Solace - Grading & Discussion

Sheliak wrote: View Post
Where is the Martini, shaken not stirred?
He had 6 of them on the airplane.

And just for the record, Roger Moore, though he was in seven Bond adventures, never once ordered that drink.

Neil
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